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[pct-l] RE: Ozarks
- Subject: [pct-l] RE: Ozarks
- From: jcartne at hotmail.com (Jacob Cartner)
- Date: Thu Jan 27 18:21:21 2005
- In-reply-to: <20050114025338.01B471CF81@edina.hack.net>
We are actually leaving today to do a section of the Ozark Trail in MO, in
the Mark Twain Wilderness area just outside of St Louis, which is actually
separate from the OHT and the Ouchita Trail. We have done a major section
of the OHT, and have enjoyed it. I have heard, although not hiked, that the
sections along the Buffalo River are also nice. Be warned, however, that
some major portions of the OHT are densely overgrown and route-finding and
bushwhacking can be somewhat of a challenge. I also would not recommend
hiking the OHT during the summer months, both because of the dense
undergrowth and the bugs. The OHT has one of the largest concentrations of
mosquitos and ticks than anywhere I have ever seen, and I have hiked in many
places from the Deep South to the Alaskan tundra.
The Solemates
OHT 03
AT 04
>From: pct-l-request@mailman.backcountry.net
>Reply-To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Subject: pct-l Digest, Vol 21, Issue 21
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 20:53:38 -0600 (CST)
>
>Send pct-l mailing list submissions to
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>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Nick Simon)
> 2. RE: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Paul)
> 3. Ozark Trails (Trekker4@aol.com)
> 4. Re: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Glen Hubbell)
> 5. RE: Kansas City tourism (Chad Killingsworth)
> 6. RE: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism (Ron Smith)
> 7. Kansas City tourism (yogi)
> 8. RE:Kansas City tourism...a Californian's perspective! (Mike Saenz)
> 9. RE: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Chris Willett)
> 10. Re: Ozark Trails (Karen Borski)
> 11. '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review (Karen Borski)
> 12. '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review (Karen Borski)
> 13. Re: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (StoneDancer1@aol.com)
> 14. Re: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (StoneDancer1@aol.com)
> 15. RE: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Chris Willett)
> 16. Re: Kansas City tourism (Jeff Moorehead)
> 17. Ozark Highlands Trail (Christin L. Pruett)
> 18. Re: Kansas City tourism (Bighummel@aol.com)
> 19. Is the " Golden Age Over?" (Monte Dodge)
> 20. Re: Kansas City tourism (Brett)
> 21. Is the " Golden Age Over?" (Chuckie V)
> 22. Re: Is the " Golden Age Over?" (Brett)
> 23. Is the " Golden Age Over?" (The Mountain Goat)
> 24. Music on the trail (Miranda Levin)
> 25. Fwd: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
> (Jeffrey Zimmerman)
> 26. Re: '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review (Jeffrey Zimmerman)
> 27. ice axe for sale? (Shamli Tarbell)
> 28. re Musics on the trail...?? (Don Fletcher)
> 29. Fwd: Re: [pct-l] Music on the trail (Jeffrey Zimmerman)
> 30. Re: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Craig Milo Rogers)
> 31. Re: Vacationing with a thru-hiker? (Lonetrail@aol.com)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 09:48:46 -0800 (PST)
>From: Nick Simon <nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113174846.12882.qmail@web53509.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>I look forward to seeing many of you this summer on the PCT. I have
>obtained "permission"
>to spend the summer on the trail. :-) One of the conditions of this
>permission is that I plan
>two hikes where my partner can fly from the east coast and spend a week at
>a time with me on the trail. So, the challenge to you is this. Can anyone
>recommend two 5-7 day sections of the PCT that I can hike with my
>wonderful girlfriend, with the following parameters in mind.
>
>1. We'll be hiking at a reduced rate (by thru-hike standards) of about
>12-15 miles per day.
>2. Ease of access for her from the east coast (airport proximity, bus
>line, etc).
>3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered during the hikes.
>
>Any suggestions along these lines would be greatly appreciated!
>
>Nick
>AT '97
>
>
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Do you Yahoo!?
> All your favorites on one personal page ? Try My Yahoo!
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 10:51:59 -0800
>From: "Paul" <cactus_paul@earthlink.net>
>Subject: RE: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <000001c4f9a0$f6a86090$8a01a8c0@duffy>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>Possibly Echo Lake to Sierra City would be nice. Both have easy access and
>if you go slower you can just go to Hwy. 80
>
>The PEDestrian
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
>[mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Nick Simon
>Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 9:49 AM
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Subject: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>
>I look forward to seeing many of you this summer on the PCT. I have
>obtained "permission"
>to spend the summer on the trail. :-) One of the conditions of this
>permission is that I plan
>two hikes where my partner can fly from the east coast and spend a week at
>a
>time with me on the trail. So, the challenge to you is this. Can anyone
>recommend two 5-7 day sections of the PCT that I can hike with my
>wonderful
>girlfriend, with the following parameters in mind.
>
>1. We'll be hiking at a reduced rate (by thru-hike standards) of about
>12-15 miles per day.
>2. Ease of access for her from the east coast (airport proximity, bus
>line,
>etc).
>3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered during the hikes.
>
>Any suggestions along these lines would be greatly appreciated!
>
>Nick
>AT '97
>
>
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Do you Yahoo!?
> All your favorites on one personal page - Try My Yahoo!
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>unsubscribe or change options:
>http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 14:05:15 EST
>From: Trekker4@aol.com
>Subject: [pct-l] Ozark Trails
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <1e5.3337c860.2f18206b@aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>The Ozarks are low, mostly wooded hills, compared to the PCT & AT. There
>are
>2 long trails, the Ouachita Trail, 100+ miles from southeast OK into west
>central AR, and the Ozark Highlands Trail, 125+ miles all in northwest AR.
>Eventually the latter will be connected with other trails into an 750+
>trail that
>goes almost to St Louis; in AR and possibly MO it will run along some of
>the
>existing National Wild & Scenic River lands.
>
>Bob
>Big Bend Desert Denizen
>(Naturalized Citizen, Republic of Texas)
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 11:29:33 -0800 (PST)
>From: Glen Hubbell <glenhubbell@yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: Nick Simon <nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com>,
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113192933.23634.qmail@web50709.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> >From Road 242 (McKenzie Pass) to Timberline Lodge and
>then onto Cascade Locks is a nice hike. Can probably
>fly into Bend, Oregon but there is no regular bus
>service to McKenzie Pass. Maybe find a shuttle service
>in town? At Cascade Locks you will have to hitch to
>the next town west to catch the Greyhound Bus to
>Portland.
>
>--- Nick Simon <nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > I look forward to seeing many of you this summer on
> > the PCT. I have obtained "permission"
> > to spend the summer on the trail. :-) One of the
> > conditions of this permission is that I plan
> > two hikes where my partner can fly from the east
> > coast and spend a week at a time with me on the
> > trail. So, the challenge to you is this. Can
> > anyone recommend two 5-7 day sections of the PCT
> > that I can hike with my wonderful girlfriend, with
> > the following parameters in mind.
> >
> > 1. We'll be hiking at a reduced rate (by thru-hike
> > standards) of about 12-15 miles per day.
> > 2. Ease of access for her from the east coast
> > (airport proximity, bus line, etc).
> > 3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered
> > during the hikes.
> >
> > Any suggestions along these lines would be greatly
> > appreciated!
> >
> > Nick
> > AT '97
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > All your favorites on one personal page ? Try My
> > Yahoo!
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today!
>http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 13:44:46 -0600
>From: "Chad Killingsworth" <chadk3@sbcglobal.net>
>Subject: RE: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <20050113195810.3E67C1D0D9@edina.hack.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>There are a multitude of trails in the region.
>
>For day hikes, the 12 mile section between Taum Sauk (pronounced Tom Sock)
>Mountain to Johnson Shut-ins in MO is excellent. Another good area is the
>Richland Creek Wilderness Area about an hour south of Jasper, AR.
>
>There are many wonderful multi-day hikes along the Buffalo National River
>in
>Arkansas.
>
>As for long distance hikes, the Ozark Trail is nearing completion. Southern
>Terminus is in North Central Arkansas and Northern Terminus is near St.
>Louis, Missouri.
>
>As a native of SW Missouri, I've grown up hiking many of the area's trails.
>
>Piper
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Kraig Mottar [mailto:kraig.mottar@verizon.net]
>Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 3:45 PM
>To: yogi; pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>
>I've been to the Mark Twain National forest which I think is in Missouri
>and
>Arkansas.
>Anyone know of any trail in that region?
>
>Kraig
>
> >
> > From: yogi <yogihikes@sbcglobal.net>
> > Date: 2005/01/12 Wed AM 10:56:40 PST
> > To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > Subject: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
> >
> > Never been to the Ozarks, except to drive through. I hear it's
>beautiful!
> >
> > yogi
> > www.pcthandbook.com
> >
> >
> > Kraig Mottar <kraig.mottar@verizon.net> wrote:
> > Don't forget about the cows. And to bring this back ontopic (hiking)
>what
>can you say about the Ozarks?
> >
> > Kraig
> >
> > > From: Trekking Amy
> > > Date: 2005/01/12 Wed AM 07:56:45 PST
> > > To: yogi , pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
> > >
> > > although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL Kansas Citians :)
> > > hail from the Missouri side......at least that's what I've always
> > > been told, having had the good luck to be born there! There are
> > > fountains and roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose
> > > Garden. (OK -- it's been a while since I've visited, and that's all
> > > I remember....but it was great!)
> > >
> > > yogi wrote:I remember when this appeared in "Backpacker" last year.
> > > It seems like there are some scientists with too much time on their
> > > hands!!
> > >
> > > yogi
> > > www.pcthandbook.com
> > >
> > >
> > > Mark Wright wrote:
> > > I'm afraid there isn't going to be much of a "crest" in Kansas. It
> > > has been scientifically proven that Kansas is in fact flatter than a
> > > pancake.
> > >
> > > http://www.improb.com/airchives/paperair/volume9/v9i3/kansas.html
> > >
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > > -----
> > > Have fun or die trying - but try not to actually die.
> > > http://www.AboveCalifornia.com
> > > Got Mac OS X? Get the AboveCalifornia Sherlock Channel:
> > > sherlock://www.AboveCalifornia.com/sherlock/SherlockChannel.xml?
> > > action=add
> > > On Jan 11, 2005, at 10:14 PM, Judson Brown wrote:
> > >
> > > > Well, Yogi, there's your next long-distance hike: From KC to Mt.
> > > > Sunflower
> > > > on the KCT (Kansas Crest Trail).
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > pct-l mailing list
> > > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > > unsubscribe or change options:
> > > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > pct-l mailing list
> > > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > > unsubscribe or change options:
> > > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As long as I live, I'll hear waterfalls and birds and winds sing. I'll
>interpret the rocks, learn the language of flood, storm, and the avalanche.
>I'll acquaint myself with the glaciers and wild gardens, and get as near
>the
>heart of the world as I can.
> > > -- John Muir
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > pct-l mailing list
> > > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > > unsubscribe or change options:
> > > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:01:58 -0800
>From: "Ron Smith" <ronyon@comcast.net>
>Subject: RE: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <000301c4f9aa$bd7e3ce0$6601a8c0@SMITHMOBILE>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>If you can't find anything but fountains and roses in Kansas, you're
>looking in the wrong place. Ask Dorothy. As a kid growing up on the flat
>Texas plains I frequently dreamed that mountains had miraculously sprung
>up in my back yard. This is one of the reasons I always see magic, in
>addition to geology and sweat, in the hills, crests, and mountains I
>visit. I pity the poor souls who had to grow up in a mountain state!
>-Ron
> >
> > although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL Kansas Citians :)
>hail from the Missouri side......at least that's what I've always been
>told, having had the good luck to be born there! There are fountains and
>roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose Garden. (OK -- it's
>been a while since I've visited, and that's all I remember....but it was
>great!)
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 7
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:20:04 -0800 (PST)
>From: yogi <yogihikes@sbcglobal.net>
>Subject: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113202004.89524.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>I agree. I think since I don't have mountains during the off season, when
>I do get out on a trail, the mountains seem to be that much more magical.
>
>yogi
>www.pcthandbook.com
>
>
>Ron Smith <ronyon@comcast.net> wrote:
>If you can't find anything but fountains and roses in Kansas, you're
>looking in the wrong place. Ask Dorothy. As a kid growing up on the flat
>Texas plains I frequently dreamed that mountains had miraculously sprung
>up in my back yard. This is one of the reasons I always see magic, in
>addition to geology and sweat, in the hills, crests, and mountains I
>visit. I pity the poor souls who had to grow up in a mountain state!
>-Ron
> >
> > although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL Kansas Citians :)
>hail from the Missouri side......at least that's what I've always been
>told, having had the good luck to be born there! There are fountains and
>roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose Garden. (OK -- it's
>been a while since I've visited, and that's all I remember....but it was
>great!)
>
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>unsubscribe or change options:
>http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 8
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:27:05 -0800
>From: "Mike Saenz" <msaenz@mve-architects.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] RE:Kansas City tourism...a Californian's perspective!
>To: "Ron Smith" <ronyon@comcast.net>, <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID:
> <157A61E98909CA47A3BBC4D6E5A7737703420F72@server3.mvenet.ad>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>Ohhhhhhh......I just can't resist!!!!!
>
>Born, raised and STILL a Californian...
>I pity the poor souls who have to dream about mountains miraculously
>springing up in their back yards...
>Or oceans, or deserts, or wide fertile valleys, or islands, great
>rivers...San Francisco Bay....giant
>sequoias...Yosemite...Whitney...Death Valley... Oilcans!...The PCT!!!
>
>We get to see them all within a few hours drive of each other!!!!!
>
>Damn if that didn't smack of flagrant elitisms....
>
>Unabashedly proud to be a Californian, where from my office desk (after
>I drive through the Cleveland National Forest and Santa Ana Mountains on
>my morning commute), I can see the Pacific Ocean, Santa Catalina Island,
>the skyline of LA, the coastal hills of Newport Coast and Laguna, The
>snow on The San Gabriel's, and, for now, actual water flowing in the
>Santa Ana River!
>
>I just COULDN'T resist!
>
>;)
>
>M i c h a e l S a e n z
>McLarand Vasquez Emsiek & Partners, Inc.
>A r c h i t e c t u r e P l a n n i n g I n t e r i o r s
>w w w . m v e - a r c h i t e c t s . c o m
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
>[mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Ron Smith
>Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:02 PM
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Subject: [BULK] - RE: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>
>If you can't find anything but fountains and roses in Kansas, you're
>looking in the wrong place. Ask Dorothy. As a kid growing up on the flat
>Texas plains I frequently dreamed that mountains had miraculously sprung
>up in my back yard. This is one of the reasons I always see magic, in
>addition to geology and sweat, in the hills, crests, and mountains I
>visit. I pity the poor souls who had to grow up in a mountain state!
>-Ron
> >
> > although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL Kansas Citians :)
>hail from the Missouri side......at least that's what I've always been
>told, having had the good luck to be born there! There are fountains and
>roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose Garden. (OK -- it's
>been a while since I've visited, and that's all I remember....but it was
>great!)
>
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>unsubscribe or change options:
>http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 9
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:35:04 -0800
>From: "Chris Willett" <CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu>
>Subject: RE: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>, "Nick Simon"
> <nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com>
>Message-ID:
> <62C689C9C0C6A141AED8F6B8121FB893065512A7@mail.pierce.ctc.edu>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>Unfortunately, Greyhound cut a lot of service in Washington and Oregon and
>I think places like Snoqualmie was one of them. Snoqualmie to Skykomish,
>or Skykomish to Stehekin would be real top flight sections and about the
>right length and are about as pretty as anything on the trail. If there
>is still bus service to Snoqualmie and Skykomish (Stevens Pass), all is
>good. Snoqualmie is about 60 miles from SeaTac.
>
>
>I think SoCal is stunning, but many people do not and desert hiking is
>something that is a little to jump into (I broke two friends in 2003 doing
>this). But, I really liked Agua Dulce to Mojave and you could probably
>arrange public transit without too many problems through LA. Fly to LA,
>local bus out to Santa Clarita.
>
>
>
> If there is anyway to stretch the days or lengthen miles, Tuolumne
>Meadows to South Lake Tahoe (about 150 miles) is the prettiest section of
>the entire trail (no one better disagree with me on this one!) Getting to
>either end should not be a problem, although it will mean a few buses to
>get to Tuolumne.
>
>In Oregon, the stretch from Sisters to, say, Timberline is about 120ish
>miles. Keep on to Cascade Locks for 164. Not super hard miles. Not the
>most scenic either, but pleasant. Fly into Portland and Greyhound it to
>Sisters (might have to go to Bend), where she'll meet you. Hitch back up to
>MacKenzie Pass and hike to Cascade Locks. I think Greyhound service to CL
>has been terminated, but I also think it still runs to Hood River, which is
>a close hitch.
>
>Suge
>
>---------------------------
>Christopher Willett
>cwillett@pierce.ctc.edu
>www.pierce.ctc.edu/faculty/cwillett
>Pierce College
>9401 Farwest Drive SW.
>Lakewood, WA. 98498-1999
>
> > ----------
> > From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net on behalf of Nick Simon
> > Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 9:48 AM
> > To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > Subject: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
> >
> > I look forward to seeing many of you this summer on the PCT. I have
>obtained "permission"
> > to spend the summer on the trail. :-) One of the conditions of this
>permission is that I plan
> > two hikes where my partner can fly from the east coast and spend a week
>at a time with me on the trail. So, the challenge to you is this. Can
>anyone recommend two 5-7 day sections of the PCT that I can hike with my
>wonderful girlfriend, with the following parameters in mind.
> >
> > 1. We'll be hiking at a reduced rate (by thru-hike standards) of about
>12-15 miles per day.
> > 2. Ease of access for her from the east coast (airport proximity, bus
>line, etc).
> > 3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered during the hikes.
> >
> > Any suggestions along these lines would be greatly appreciated!
> >
> > Nick
> > AT '97
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > All your favorites on one personal page > -> Try My Yahoo!
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> >
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 10
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:47:36 -0800 (PST)
>From: Karen Borski <kborski@yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Ozark Trails
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113204736.52013.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>A correction/addition: the OT, or Ouachita Trail, is
>192 miles long and runs east-west through Oklahoma and
>Arkansas. The Ouachita Mountains are separate, and
>different than the Boston Mts through which the OHT,
>or Ozark Highlands Trail, runs. The Ouachita Mts are
>one of the only east-west running mountain ranges in
>the world; they are similar in size and shape to the
>Blue Ridge in Virginia on the AT. The climbs may not
>be as high as those on the AT (compare 1000-foot
>climbs to 2000 or 3000 ft on the AT), but the views
>and terrain is very similar.
>
>There are guidebooks to both the OT and OHT. Both
>trails can be hiked year-round. This is a great time
>of the year to hike them. I've hike most of the OT,
>if anyone has specific questions. I can't say enough
>about how wonderful the trail is....very remote and
>beautiful.
>
>Nocona
>Native Flatlander, East Texas
>
>--- Trekker4@aol.com wrote:
>
> > The Ozarks are low, mostly wooded hills, compared to
> > the PCT & AT. There are
> > 2 long trails, the Ouachita Trail, 100+ miles from
> > southeast OK into west
> > central AR, and the Ozark Highlands Trail, 125+
> > miles all in northwest AR.
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today!
>http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 11
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:50:52 -0800 (PST)
>From: Karen Borski <kborski@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review
>To: Mike Saenz <msaenz@mve-architects.com>, Ron Smith
> <ronyon@comcast.net>, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113205052.53236.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
>--- Mike Saenz <msaenz@mve-architects.com> wrote:
>
> > Ohhhhhhh......I just can't resist!!!!!
> >
> > Born, raised and STILL a Californian...
> > I pity the poor souls who have to dream about
> > mountains miraculously
> > springing up in their back yards...
> > Or oceans, or deserts, or wide fertile valleys, or
> > islands, great
> > rivers...San Francisco Bay....giant
> > sequoias...Yosemite...Whitney...Death Valley...
> > Oilcans!...The PCT!!!
> >
> > We get to see them all within a few hours drive of
> > each other!!!!!
> >
> > Damn if that didn't smack of flagrant elitisms....
> >
> > Unabashedly proud to be a Californian, where from my
> > office desk (after
> > I drive through the Cleveland National Forest and
> > Santa Ana Mountains on
> > my morning commute), I can see the Pacific Ocean,
> > Santa Catalina Island,
> > the skyline of LA, the coastal hills of Newport
> > Coast and Laguna, The
> > snow on The San Gabriel's, and, for now, actual
> > water flowing in the
> > Santa Ana River!
> >
> > I just COULDN'T resist!
> >
> > ;)
> >
> > M i c h a e l S a e n z
> > McLarand Vasquez Emsiek & Partners, Inc.
> > A r c h i t e c t u r e P l a n n i n g I n t
> > e r i o r s
> > w w w . m v e - a r c h i t e c t s
> > . c o m
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
> > [mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On
> > Behalf Of Ron Smith
> > Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:02 PM
> > To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > Subject: [BULK] - RE: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City
> > tourism
> >
> > If you can't find anything but fountains and roses
> > in Kansas, you're
> > looking in the wrong place. Ask Dorothy. As a kid
> > growing up on the flat
> > Texas plains I frequently dreamed that mountains had
> > miraculously sprung
> > up in my back yard. This is one of the reasons I
> > always see magic, in
> > addition to geology and sweat, in the hills, crests,
> > and mountains I
> > visit. I pity the poor souls who had to grow up in a
> > mountain state!
> > -Ron
> > >
> > > although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL
> > Kansas Citians :)
> > hail from the Missouri side......at least that's
> > what I've always been
> > told, having had the good luck to be born there!
> > There are fountains and
> > roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose
> > Garden. (OK -- it's
> > been a while since I've visited, and that's all I
> > remember....but it was
> > great!)
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>All your favorites on one personal page ? Try My Yahoo!
>http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 12
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:53:47 -0800 (PST)
>From: Karen Borski <kborski@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050113205347.82135.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>I've been meaning to send out a post to let all those
>who are in the throes of researching and purchasing
>gear for a thru-hike that I took some time to write a
>short review of each item I carried with me (or
>planned to carry with me) on my thru-hike last year.
>The review is at:
>
>http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?id=85040
>
>...and it should all be taken with the typical "grain
>of salt." Gear is very personal and just because I
>gave something a good review doesn't mean everyone
>used it, liked it or should take it.
>
>I did my best to be thorough, yet brief.
>
>Nocona
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
>http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 13
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 15:54:48 EST
>From: StoneDancer1@aol.com
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <d8.1d7ecfd4.2f183a18@aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>
>In a message dated 1/13/2005 12:39:24 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu writes:
>
> >>>But, I really liked Agua Dulce to Mojave <<<
>
>
>
>Ditto! I liked the Mojave so well that I went back and did it again the
>next year.
>
>"No Way" Ray Echols
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 14
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:01:48 EST
>From: StoneDancer1@aol.com
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <1f1.32ef7d84.2f183bbc@aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>
>In a message dated 1/13/2005 12:39:24 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu writes:
>
> >>>If there is anyway to stretch the days or lengthen miles, Tuolumne
>Meadows to South Lake Tahoe (about 150 miles) is the prettiest section of
>the
>entire trail (no one better disagree with me on this one!) <<<<
>
>
> A way to shorten this trip is to skip Tuolumne Meadows to Sonora Pass.
>This is a TOUGH section on which to begin a trip... first hand experience!
>(
>and.. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with CWillett ) I had never hiked
>the
>trail from Sonora to Echo lake before and I found it striking and
>strikingly
>different from the granitic Sierra. From Sonora (mile 1013.2) to Echo (
>mile
>1089.3) is 76.1 miles. If that's too long, start at Ebbetts Pass.
>
>"No Way" Ray Echols
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 15
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 13:12:54 -0800
>From: "Chris Willett" <CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu>
>Subject: RE: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>, <StoneDancer1@aol.com>
>Message-ID:
> <62C689C9C0C6A141AED8F6B8121FB893065512AA@mail.pierce.ctc.edu>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>Yeah, but Tuolumne to Sonora pass includes the single greatest ridgewalk on
>the PCT. And it will be tough to get to Sonora Pass without a lot of
>hitching.
>
>
>Suge
>
>---------------------------
>Christopher Willett
>cwillett@pierce.ctc.edu
>www.pierce.ctc.edu/faculty/cwillett
>Pierce College
>9401 Farwest Drive SW.
>Lakewood, WA. 98498-1999
>
> > ----------
> > From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net on behalf of
>StoneDancer1@aol.com
> > Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 1:01 PM
> > To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 1/13/2005 12:39:24 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> > CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu writes:
> >
> > >>>If there is anyway to stretch the days or lengthen miles, Tuolumne
> > Meadows to South Lake Tahoe (about 150 miles) is the prettiest section
>of the
> > entire trail (no one better disagree with me on this one!) <<<<
> >
> >
> > A way to shorten this trip is to skip Tuolumne Meadows to Sonora Pass.
> > This is a TOUGH section on which to begin a trip... first hand
>experience! (
> > and.. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with CWillett ) I had never hiked
>the
> > trail from Sonora to Echo lake before and I found it striking and
>strikingly
> > different from the granitic Sierra. From Sonora (mile 1013.2) to Echo
>( mile
> > 1089.3) is 76.1 miles. If that's too long, start at Ebbetts Pass.
> >
> > "No Way" Ray Echols
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> >
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 16
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 13:50:20 -0800
>From: "Jeff Moorehead" <jeffmoorehead1@cox.net>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <006e01c4f9b9$e0d4b980$6501a8c0@LapDancer>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>a couple of math nerds with time on their hands determined that, relatively
>speaking, Kansas is flatter than a pancake. If you resize the topography of
>a pancake to the same dimensions as a real state, an average pancake looks
>more like Nebraska and Kansas is flatter than either. On the other hand,
>the
>nicest people I've met have been from Kansas... go figure
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "yogi" <yogihikes@sbcglobal.net>
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:20 PM
>Subject: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>
>
> >I agree. I think since I don't have mountains during the off season,
>when
> >I do get out on a trail, the mountains seem to be that much more magical.
> >
> > yogi
> > www.pcthandbook.com
> >
> >
> > Ron Smith <ronyon@comcast.net> wrote:
> > If you can't find anything but fountains and roses in Kansas, you're
> > looking in the wrong place. Ask Dorothy. As a kid growing up on the flat
> > Texas plains I frequently dreamed that mountains had miraculously sprung
> > up in my back yard. This is one of the reasons I always see magic, in
> > addition to geology and sweat, in the hills, crests, and mountains I
> > visit. I pity the poor souls who had to grow up in a mountain state!
> > -Ron
> >>
> >> although, to be completely accurate, the only REAL Kansas Citians :)
> > hail from the Missouri side......at least that's what I've always been
> > told, having had the good luck to be born there! There are fountains and
> > roses! Don't forget Loose Park and the famous Rose Garden. (OK -- it's
> > been a while since I've visited, and that's all I remember....but it was
> > great!)
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 17
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 13:49:16 -0900 (AKST)
>From: "Christin L. Pruett" <ftclp@uaf.edu>
>Subject: [pct-l] Ozark Highlands Trail
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <51619.137.229.29.102.1105656556.squirrel@137.229.29.102>
>Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
>I've hiked the beginning and the end of the Ozark Highlands Trail. It
>feels quite remote and is a bit of a hassle logistically but very nice
>especially in the fall. I'd be cautious about going at this time of year
>because it can get cold and snowy. Bring your cold weather gear. It is
>very similar to the AT, lots of decidious trees and many wonderful
>waterfalls. Check out Tim Ernst's guide.
>
>Completely off topic: It is -41 F here which is -41 C also! Ah, the last
>frontier... now you know why.
>
>Christy
>
>--
>Christin L. Pruett
>University of Alaska Museum
>907 Yukon Dr.
>Fairbanks, AK 99775
>907-474-6727
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 18
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 18:42:47 EST
>From: Bighummel@aol.com
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <12f.548a9f5d.2f186177@aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>Kansas was not always flat. The central Kansas uplift exposes several
>hundred million years of rock deposits, thus it is an eroded flat, previous
>mountain
>range . . .
>
>Well, maybe it was just a bit higher than the surrounding land and would
>not
>qualify as a "mountain range" in those states that are fortunate enough to
>have them now.
>
>Speaking of natural phenomena, in Newport Beach this morning the early
>morning fog put just exactly enough moisture in front of the rising sun to
>produce a
>circular rainbow around it! Cool. Wish that I had camera with the
>capability to take a picture of this.
>
>Okay, back to PCT related discussions . . . like how long your hair should
>be
>(hah!)
>
>Greg
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 19
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 15:44:06 -0800
>From: "Monte Dodge" <montedodge@msn.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] Is the " Golden Age Over?"
>To: "pct-l" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <BAY3-DAV168CE8E08DB3FCAEBB9F01D58A0@phx.gbl>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> A few of us were talking at the Kick-off about how this is really " The
>Golden Age" of the PCT. The number of hikers are perfect for the
>trail,,,big enough to meet new people, but not overwhelming as the AT.
> My take is it is still in the golden age but not for much longer . We
>have lost so many great places in the last few years that are so personal
>to the PCT thru- hiker.
> The loss of the Pink Motel is the last of many cool spots where hikers
>can enjoy each other's company away from town and city stops. Jack Fair
>will never really be replaced, nor the Pink Motel, nor Butch, nor Etna
>Summit's Hiker Haven or free camping at the Fire Station in Big Bear!!
> Donna and Jeff's place in Aqua-Dulce is as well known as any Mountain
>or Lake along the PCT in the minds of the PCT hiker. Paul and Pat's place
>in Anza at Hiker Oasis is another awesome spot at lives in the minds of
>past hikers.
> It will be interesting to see how the next 25 years pass on the PCT.
> Will other folks fill the shoes of other trail angels as time passes?
>Will trail numbers increase so you no longer know the names of most the
>folks hiking the PCT the same year as you did? Will thru-hiker permits be
>free as a bird while weekend warriors pay through the nose for a weekend
>trip? More folks usually bring about more regulations in time. Regulations
>in time usually bring along more fees.
> My take??? The PCT IS in it's " Golden Age" .. Hike it soon before
>the age is over. ( They will in 2020 say, " Remember the Kick-Off Parties
>we use to have at Lake Morena? ". Back then there were only 300 people!!)
>Kick-Off 2020 may well have Meadow Ed sitting in a chair with a cane
>talking through a micro phone pinned to his shirt addressing 2,500 hikers
>as to where the water will be stored and making sure they all have their
>water trail permit and the day they are to be allowed to get water to said
>spot. Charlie and Chuck will have a water truck left from the gulf war to
>haul 20,000 gallon's to Chariot Canyon and Scissors crossing. Daily
>journals will speak of making it to my permit camping site by noon buy not
>allowed to hike farther as this is where I am to camp ..........
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 20
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:30:24 -0500
>From: "Brett" <blisterfree@isp01.net>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Kansas City tourism
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <005601c4f9d0$3f4bc2e0$ab8b0fce@DB943421>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> > Kansas was not always flat. The central Kansas uplift
> > exposes several
> > hundred million years of rock deposits, thus it is an
> > eroded flat, previous mountain
> > range . . .
>
>
>Pretty sure the great plains used to be an inland sea,
>(before my time) hence all the marine sediments exposed here
>and there by more recent tectonic forces (and erosion).
>
>Remember that Ed Abbey described the plain states, and
>midwest in general, as "mysterious." Unlike the mostly
>uninhabited (and traditionally mysterious) mountain and
>desert lands to the west, which nevertheless revealed
>themselves to even the casual visitor who would climb a peak
>or stand amidst an empty waste, the well-populated midwest
>remained the greater mystery to ol' Cactus Ed, whose
>journeys by car through this region revealed only the 12
>mile horizon and a culture vaguely familiar and yet
>completely foreign.
>
>Parkey, the Kansas interstate freeway kangaroo mascot, might
>agree. Utterly mysterious.
>
>- blisterfree
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Simblissity Ultralight :: One-of-a-Kind Designs for the
>Great Outdoors
>www.simblissity.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 21
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:48:15 -0800 (PST)
>From: Chuckie V <rubberchuckie@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] Is the " Golden Age Over?"
>To: PCT-List <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <20050114004815.85513.qmail@web52803.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>For a future PCT hiker born today, the trail's "Golden Age" will likely be
>25 years from now; so really, it's all a matter of perspective. Reminiscing
>is a good thing; it means you've done something in your life, but it also
>means you're still alive and there's more to do.
>
>But I agree with Monte. The facts are scary; times are changing.
>California's population is projected to double by then (the next 25-30
>years). Washington and Oregon's will likely do the same, if not more so.
>And not all this growth will be in urban areas. This will put pressure on
>the PCT both directly and indirectly, by seeing more visitors (which is
>considered a good thing) and the usual encroachment, and of course, the
>needed resources to sustain this explosion of growth. (Many trees will be
>needed to help build this growth and they have to come from somewhere;
>clear-cutting already exists along the PCT in numerous places). Water
>issues are becoming more of a concern and this will likely affect the trail
>too. Smog is killing trees galore in some places.
>
>Since there will always be people living along the PCT, the loss of
>something like the Pink Motel will not last forever...replacements appear.
>They're just new and different. I can't even begin to name all the people
>that helped me en route; not all of them are known to other hikers.
>
>Let's just hope the PCT is there in 25 years! Plenty of things threaten it:
>floods, landslides, forest fires, but nothing quite so much as people!
>People are the problem and the solution!
>
>CV
>
>
>Monte Dodge <montedodge@msn.com> wrote:
>A few of us were talking at the Kick-off about how this is really " The
>Golden Age" of the PCT. The number of hikers are perfect for the
>trail,,,big enough to meet new people, but not overwhelming as the AT.
>My take is it is still in the golden age but not for much longer . We have
>lost so many great places in the last few years that are so personal to the
>PCT thru- hiker.
>The loss of the Pink Motel is the last of many cool spots where hikers can
>enjoy each other's company away from town and city stops. Jack Fair will
>never really be replaced, nor the Pink Motel, nor Butch, nor Etna Summit's
>Hiker Haven or free camping at the Fire Station in Big Bear!!
>Donna and Jeff's place in Aqua-Dulce is as well known as any Mountain or
>Lake along the PCT in the minds of the PCT hiker. Paul and Pat's place in
>Anza at Hiker Oasis is another awesome spot at lives in the minds of past
>hikers.
>It will be interesting to see how the next 25 years pass on the PCT. Will
>other folks fill the shoes of other trail angels as time passes? Will trail
>numbers increase so you no longer know the names of most the folks hiking
>the PCT the same year as you did? Will thru-hiker permits be free as a bird
>while weekend warriors pay through the nose for a weekend trip? More folks
>usually bring about more regulations in time. Regulations in time usually
>bring along more fees.
>My take??? The PCT IS in it's " Golden Age" .. Hike it soon before the age
>is over. ( They will in 2020 say, " Remember the Kick-Off Parties we use to
>have at Lake Morena? ". Back then there were only 300 people!!) Kick-Off
>2020 may well have Meadow Ed sitting in a chair with a cane talking through
>a micro phone pinned to his shirt addressing 2,500 hikers as to where the
>water will be stored and making sure they all have their water trail permit
>and the day they are to be allowed to get water to said spot. Charlie and
>Chuck will have a water truck left from the gulf war to haul 20,000
>gallon's to Chariot Canyon and Scissors crossing. Daily journals will speak
>of making it to my permit camping site by noon buy not allowed to hike
>farther as this is where I am to camp ..........
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>unsubscribe or change options:
>http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 22
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 20:08:14 -0500
>From: "Brett" <blisterfree@isp01.net>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Is the " Golden Age Over?"
>To: "Chuckie V" <rubberchuckie@yahoo.com>, "PCT-List"
> <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <006c01c4f9d5$86f65f60$ab8b0fce@DB943421>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>I maintain that some of the reason for the surge in
>thru-hiker numbers, across the board, has to do with a
>realization that the golden age of SOCIETY is slipping past,
>and is doing so in direct proportion to our alienation from,
>and extermination of, the natural places which the great
>trails attempt to promote, protect, and which are actually
>replacing society at large as a place of kinship, a place of
>centeredness and belonging, and for some folks (however
>indirectly) even a place of livelihood.
>
>Long-distance hiking is not a fad. Many folks are having
>their needs fulfilled out there in a way that society simply
>cannot do anymore, perhaps never could do. The trails allow
>for the ultimate making of the Individual, something the
>American dream has long promoted but never really delivered
>on. Because it can't. As someone around here once put it,
>"To walk in the wilderness is freedom."
>
>- blisterfree
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Simblissity Ultralight :: One-of-a-Kind Designs for the
>Great Outdoors
>www.simblissity.net
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 23
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:15:58 -0800 (PST)
>From: The Mountain Goat <themtgoat@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] Is the " Golden Age Over?"
>To: montedodge@msn.com, pct mailing list
> <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <20050114011558.95121.qmail@web52807.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>I feel a little bepressed after that, but there is some
>truth to it. At some point the trail will probably get
>"popular", our "mid sized meetings" of 300 or so people
>will one day grow to over 1000, and water permits, are an
>interesting idea, but the point is we may get to the point
>where we have designated points or maybe just areas that we
>can camp. I had that happen about 6 years ago, when doing
>Half Dome in Yosemity. we couldn't camp at Little Yosemity
>on our first night, because we came in from the valley
>floor to Glacier Point to Little Yosemity campground.
>
> But today the permits are free, about 300-400 people
>attempt a thru-hike a year. You will probably get to know
>most hiker names, or just "Mike" his real name. Some water
>spots can run low or out at the begining of the trail, but
>thats probably not a very big problem now. The trail is not
>heavly worn, so you still need to take a Trail guide with
>maps to make sure you don't get lost.
>
>Class of 2005, enjoy your hike. The PCT has gotten some
>popularity, but it is still mostly a little known activity
>among so many other things that the greater public does.
>
>Enjoy for Section, Thru, partial, slacked, skipped, or
>otherwise PCT Trek in 2005.
>
>Your fellow hiker of 2005.
>
>-Mountain Goat-
>www.geocites.com/pct_2005
>
>[pct-l] Is the " Golden Age Over?"
>Monte Dodge montedodge at msn.com
>
> A few of us were talking at the Kick-off about how this is
>really " The Golden Age" of the PCT. The number of hikers
>are perfect for the trail,,,big enough to meet new people,
>but not overwhelming as the AT.
> My take is it is still in the golden age but not for
>much longer . We have lost so many great places in the last
>few years that are so personal to the PCT thru- hiker.
> The loss of the Pink Motel is the last of many cool
>spots where hikers can enjoy each other's company away from
>town and city stops. Jack Fair will never really be
>replaced, nor the Pink Motel, nor Butch, nor Etna Summit's
>Hiker Haven or free camping at the Fire Station in Big
>Bear!!
> Donna and Jeff's place in Aqua-Dulce is as well known
>as any Mountain or Lake along the PCT in the minds of the
>PCT hiker. Paul and Pat's place in Anza at Hiker Oasis is
>another awesome spot at lives in the minds of past hikers.
> It will be interesting to see how the next 25 years
>pass on the PCT. Will other folks fill the shoes of other
>trail angels as time passes? Will trail numbers increase so
>you no longer know the names of most the folks hiking the
>PCT the same year as you did? Will thru-hiker permits be
>free as a bird while weekend warriors pay through the nose
>for a weekend trip? More folks usually bring about more
>regulations in time. Regulations in time usually bring
>along more fees.
> My take??? The PCT IS in it's " Golden Age" .. Hike it
>soon before the age is over. ( They will in 2020 say, "
>Remember the Kick-Off Parties we use to have at Lake
>Morena? ". Back then there were only 300 people!!) Kick-Off
>2020 may well have Meadow Ed sitting in a chair with a cane
>talking through a micro phone pinned to his shirt
>addressing 2,500 hikers as to where the water will be
>stored and making sure they all have their water trail
>permit and the day they are to be allowed to get water to
>said spot. Charlie and Chuck will have a water truck left
>from the gulf war to haul 20,000 gallon's to Chariot Canyon
>and Scissors crossing. Daily journals will speak of making
>it to my permit camping site by noon buy not allowed to
>hike farther as this is where I am to camp ..........
>
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 24
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:21:37 -0800
>From: "Miranda Levin" <spenluc@earthlink.net>
>Subject: [pct-l] Music on the trail
>To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <002901c4f9d7$65cc7700$2d2179a5@vanman.lan>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>What is a good radio for the trail? I am looking at the Creative NOMAD
>MuVo TX FM 256 MB MP3 Player. It would be great to have MP3 when there
>were no stations, and only 1.5 oz. What are some other radios people have
>used? Thanks.
>
>Brian
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 25
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:19:04 -0800
>From: "Jeffrey Zimmerman" <jeffreyn@sonic.net>
>Subject: Fwd: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: PCT-L <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <opskki92ppb8be6q@mail.sonic.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes;
> charset=iso-8859-15
>
>
>
>------- Forwarded message -------
>From: "Jeffrey Zimmerman" <jeffreyn@sonic.net>
>To: "Chris Willett" <CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:55:11 -0800
>
>On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:35:04 -0800, Chris Willett
><CWillett@pierce.ctc.edu> wrote:
>
> > ... If there is anyway to stretch the days or lengthen miles, Tuolumne
> > Meadows to South Lake Tahoe (about 150 miles) is the prettiest section
> > of the entire trail (no one better disagree with me on this one!)
> > Getting to either end should not be a problem, although it will mean a
> > few buses to get to Tuolumne. ...
>
>That was going to be my suggestion! I would suggest Amtrak from the Bay
>Area down the valley, with the connecting bus to Yosemite Valley and then
>YARTS to Tuloumne Meadows (unless she wants to hike up from Happy Isles).
>Then a return from Truckee -- again via Amtrak -- will get her right back
>to the Bay Area. There would be some details on the airport-Amtrak
>connection, but I'm sure there are shuttles, but I suspect Oakland would
>be preferred to SFO for that purpose. There might be similar connections
>available at either Sacramento or Reno, too.
>
>
>
>--
>Jeffrey Neil Zimmerman
>Sonoma County, The Left Coast
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 26
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:19:02 -0800
>From: "Jeffrey Zimmerman" <jeffreyn@sonic.net>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] '04 Thru-Hiker Gear Review
>To: PCT-L <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <opskki90hlb8be6q@mail.sonic.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes;
> charset=iso-8859-15
>
>On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 12:53:47 -0800 (PST), Karen Borski <kborski@yahoo.com>
>wrote:
>
> > ... I took some time to write a
> > short review of each item I carried with me ...
>
>Good review. Thanks, Nocona
>
>
>
>--
>Jeffrey Neil Zimmerman
>Sonoma County, The Left Coast
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 27
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:25:40 -0800
>From: "Shamli Tarbell" <galletamonster@hotmail.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] ice axe for sale?
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <BAY101-F2129E2023BB9FB52CFC9D8C58B0@phx.gbl>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>
>does anyone have a light & used ice axe for sale?? i was eyeing the cassin
>ghost and the camp xla but i'm open to other light ones too.
>thanks, shamli
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 28
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:35:01 -0600
>From: Don Fletcher <dsfletcher1@shaw.ca>
>Subject: [pct-l] re Musics on the trail...??
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <000e01c4f9d9$44629f70$e7384f18@Don>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Greetings:
>
> do people actualy carry music with them while hiknig???
> I am sorry , but I really enjoy the sounds of the outdoors as opposed to
>music... but each to their own I know ...
>
>
> Don aka " Malachi"
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 29
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:41:18 -0800
>From: "Jeffrey Zimmerman" <jeffreyn@sonic.net>
>Subject: Fwd: Re: [pct-l] Music on the trail
>To: PCT-L <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
>Message-ID: <opskkka4okb8be6q@mail.sonic.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes;
> charset=iso-8859-15
>
>
>
>------- Forwarded message -------
>From: "Jeffrey Zimmerman" <jeffreyn@sonic.net>
>To: "Miranda Levin" <spenluc@earthlink.net>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Music on the trail
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:40:45 -0800
>
>On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 17:21:37 -0800, Miranda Levin <spenluc@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>
> > What is a good radio for the trail? I am looking at the Creative NOMAD
> > MuVo TX FM 256 MB MP3 Player. It would be great to have MP3 when there
> > were no stations, and only 1.5 oz. What are some other radios people
> > have used? Thanks.
>
>In the mountains there is little reception (aside, perhaps, from satellite
>radio) which is useful. For music, I suggest the wind in the trees and
>the water splashing on the rocks. For weather forecasts I suggest an eye
>on the sky and an ungloved hand in the air. For sports, I suggest the
>joys of clean, dry socks. For news reports, I suggest forbearance.
>
>
>
>--
>Jeffrey Neil Zimmerman
>Sonoma County, The Left Coast
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 30
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 18:10:58 -0800
>From: Craig Milo Rogers <rogers@isi.edu>
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: Nick Simon <nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com>
>Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20050114021058.GD29988@isi.edu>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>On 05.01.13, Nick Simon wrote:
> > two hikes where my partner can fly from the east coast and spend a week
>at
> > a time with me on the trail.
>...
> > 2. Ease of access for her from the east coast (airport proximity, bus
>line, etc).
> > 3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered during the hikes.
>
> There is an unfortunate correlation between "scenic" and
>"inaccessible" on the PCT, particularly now that Greyhound has
>discontinued so much rural service.
>
> One possibility is... the Angeles National Forest! I believe
>it is possible to fly into, say, Ontario International Airport, catch
>a bus to San Bernardino (Omnitrans), catch another bus to Victorville
>(Victor Valley Commuter or Greyhound), and catch a final bus to
>Wrightwood (Victor Valley Transit, reservation required, see
>www.vvta.org/local). Can this be done in one day... probably not.
>But, don't despair... there are many trail angels in Southern
>California, and you may be able to arrange transportatin through a
>suitable plea on this newsgroup or at the ADZPCTKO. Historically,
>transportation back to Los Angeles has been readily available, say, at
>the Saufleys'.
>
> The eastern Sierra is very scenic, and it is still possible to
>get there by bus, in spite of Greyhound's withdrawal from the market.
>The High Sierra might be overly challenging for an early-season hike
>with a novice hiker, particularly if this turns out to be a late
>snowmelt year, but here are some of your options:
>
>1) Fly to LAX, connect to Greyhound (I don't know the details,
> a local bus, or taxi ride at worst), Greyhound to Mojave,
> regional bus to Ridgecrest, Inyo Mono Transit to Lone Pine.
>
>2) Fly to Reno, Inyo Mono Transit to Bishop, and on to Lone Pine,
> if needed.
>
> You could rendezvous in Lone Pine, hitch up to Horseshoe Meadows,
>do Mt Whitney (but you'd need a hard-to-get permit for your girlfriend!),
>and come out at Independence.
>
> You could meet at Bishop, catch a ride up Bishop Creek, hike
>in to the PCT, and catch a bus out at Red's Meadow (bus or hitch from
>there back to Bishop).
>
> Bishop to Mammoth, Mammoth to Red's Meadow, hike to Tuolomne
>Meadows, (somehow) get to Lee Vining, then catch the regional bus to
>Reno.
>
> If money isn't an object, you can:
>
>1) Charter an airplane to fly in/out of Lone Pine, Bishop, or
> Mammoth.
>
>2) Have a horse packer give your girlfriend (and your resupplies)
> a ride to/from the PCT out of Lone Pine or Bishop.
>
> If you poke around on trailjournals.com, you may be able to
>find descriptions from last year on how past hikers made these
>connections.
>
> Craig "Computer" Rogers
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 31
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 21:34:37 EST
>From: Lonetrail@aol.com
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] Vacationing with a thru-hiker?
>To: rogers@isi.edu, nickjstone2005pct@yahoo.com
>Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <d4.1f6a0edc.2f1889bd@aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>
>I would suggest Big Bear to Cabozon. You could not ask for more from high
>mountain to high desert to low desert about 64 miles. Fly into LAX go to LA
>Greyhound Station. take a bus to San Bernardino. The local bus to Big Bear.
>Once
>in Big Bear they have Dial a Ride for about $1.00 will take you to trail
>head. I hitch hiked from the Hwy. 10 to Banning and got a Greyhound back
>to LA.
>You will go by an eye sore a Wind Mill Farm, a Wild Animal Refuge, A
>Mountain
>that has winds at night that sounds like a freight train to the sounds of
>Coyotes in the low desert going after a chase. If you do this in the
>winter
>better check snow conditions take an ice ax, hiking poles and be careful
>
>Lonetrail
>
>If interested I could
>Lonetral
>
>forOn 05.01.13, Nick Simon wrote:
>
>
>
> > two hikes where my partner can fly from the east coast and spend a week
>at
> > a time with me on the trail.
>...
> > 2. Ease of access for her from the east coast (airport proximity, bus
>line, etc).
> > 3. Maximizing the beauty of the scenery covered during the hikes.
>
>There is an unfortunate correlation between "scenic" and
>"inaccessible" on the PCT, particularly now that Greyhound has
>discontinued so much rural service.
>
>One possibility is... the Angeles National Forest! I believe
>it is possible to fly into, say, Ontario International Airport, catch
>a bus to San Bernardino (Omnitrans), catch another bus to Victorville
>(Victor Valley Commuter or Greyhound), and catch a final bus to
>Wrightwood (Victor Valley Transit, reservation required, see
>www.vvta.org/local). Can this be done in one day... probably not.
>But, don't despair... there are many trail angels in Southern
>California, and you may be able to arrange transportatin through a
>suitable plea on this newsgroup or at the ADZPCTKO. Historically,
>transportation back to Los Angeles has been readily available, say, at
>the Saufleys'.
>
>The eastern Sierra is very scenic, and it is still possible to
>get there by bus, in spite of Greyhound's withdrawal from the market.
>The High Sierra might be overly challenging for an early-season hike
>with a novice hiker, particularly if this turns out to be a late
>snowmelt year, but here are some of your options:
>
>1) Fly to LAX, connect to Greyhound (I don't know the details,
>a local bus, or taxi ride at worst), Greyhound to Mojave,
>regional bus to Ridgecrest, Inyo Mono Transit to Lone Pine.
>
>2) Fly to Reno, Inyo Mono Transit to Bishop, and on to Lone Pine,
>if needed.
>
>You could rendezvous in Lone Pine, hitch up to Horseshoe Meadows,
>do Mt Whitney (but you'd need a hard-to-get permit for your girlfriend!),
>and come out at Independence.
>
>You could meet at Bishop, catch a ride up Bishop Creek, hike
>in to the PCT, and catch a bus out at Red's Meadow (bus or hitch from
>there back to Bishop).
>
>Bishop to Mammoth, Mammoth to Red's Meadow, hike to Tuolomne
>Meadows, (somehow) get to Lee Vining, then catch the regional bus to
>Reno.
>
>If money isn't an object, you can:
>
>1) Charter an airplane to fly in/out of Lone Pine, Bishop, or
>Mammoth.
>
>2) Have a horse packer give your girlfriend (and your resupplies)
>a ride to/from the PCT out of Lone Pine or Bishop.
>
>If you poke around on trailjournals.com, you may be able to
>find descriptions from last year on how past hikers made these
>connections.
>
>Craig "Computer" Rogers
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
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>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
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>End of pct-l Digest, Vol 21, Issue 21
>*************************************