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[pct-l] RE: Photographs of the PCT
- Subject: [pct-l] RE: Photographs of the PCT
- From: jcoyle at sanjuan.edu (John Coyle)
- Date: Mon Jan 12 14:35:35 2004
Does anyone know of any sites that specialize in photographs of the PCT. I
would be interested in photos from anywhere on the PCT, but especially in
the Northern California area since I frequent that area most. I would like
to find a site that mostly diplays photos or galleries of the PCT with a
minimum of technical content. Is such a thing out there?
Thanks in advance
JAYCO
-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Friday, January 09, 2004 3:43 PM
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Subject: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 7
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks (Hiker)
2. Fw: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box (Ken Powers)
3. RE: Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
(Robert Ellinwood)
4. Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
(Bob Bankhead)
5. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
(CMountainDave@aol.com)
6. RE: Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
(Brian Bowlsby)
7. historic weather data for California (Plotnikoff, David)
8. RE: Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
(Hiker)
9. Re: 5 gal buckets bounce box /What can you mail USPS
(The Mountain Goat)
10. Re: weather log (CMountainDave@aol.com)
11. Re: weather log (dude)
12. need some help (JoAnn M. Michael)
13. Re: Convenced,,,,! (Joanne Lennox)
14. weather log (The Weathercarrot)
15. RE: northern cascades (robert vance)
16. new section K? (Judson Brown)
17. Re: new section K? (robert vance)
18. Re: new section K? (CMountainDave@aol.com)
19. Mountain Lion (Lonetrail@aol.com)
20. Also in the news from Orange County (Bighummel@aol.com)
21. Re: Also in the news from Orange County (CMountainDave@aol.com)
22. Deer question? (Slyatpct@aol.com)
23. Re: Deer question? (Edmond Meinfelder)
24. Re: Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
(DANIEL ALAN ERDMAN)
25. Re: Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
(Slyatpct@aol.com)
26. Ice axe size (Beth Murdock)
27. Re: Deer question? (Ilja Friedel)
28. Re: Ice axe size (CMountainDave@aol.com)
29. Re: Ice axe size (Marshall Karon)
30. Kennedy Meadows Start (Gene Neagle)
31. Ice ax size (Gene Neagle)
32. Re: Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
(Slyatpct@aol.com)
33. Re: Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date (Ron Martino)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 10:57:01 -0800
From: Hiker <hiker@godlikebuthumble.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20040108105019.02828b10@fastpack.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 06:29 AM 1/8/04, StoneDancer1@aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>I'm surprised no one has mentioned Rush Creek. <<<<<
I crossed it on a snow bridge. My coldest night on the PCT was between
Island Pass and Donahue Pass.....
While climbing up the sun-cupped snow to Donahue the next morning, there
was a swarm of black winged butterflies. It started to sleet a little, and
thousands of them ended up covering the snow. Beautiful, and kind of sad,
all at the same time. I was SOO happy to make it back down to the snow free
and relative warmth of Lyell canyon, only to be rudely asked for my permit
by a gun-toting ranger on horse-back. And his horse was causing major
damage to the soaking wet trails.
Welcome to Yosemite.
The least friendly National Park in my experience
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 11:18:56 -0800
From: "Ken Powers" <kdpo@pacbell.net>
Subject: Fw: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box
To: <pct-l@backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000601c3d61c$42dfd6e0$6501a8c0@pacbell.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Powers" <kdpo@pacbell.net>
To: "Kent Ryhorchuk" <kentr-lists@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box
> I have heard of people using smaller plastics boxes for bounce boxes. I
> don't remember the details, but I think they were fishing tackle boxes.
> Maybe the larger sizes would work well.
> Ken
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kent Ryhorchuk" <kentr-lists@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 9:54 AM
> Subject: RE: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box
>
>
> > Cathy and I used 5-gal buckets for our drift boxes in 2002 and they
> > lasted the whole trip (Mexico to Oregon). I highly recommend them, and
> > will be using the same buckets this year. The post office never blinked
> > when we brought them in, nor were we ever required to remove the
> > handles. They do not exceed any large package dimensions so postage is
> > only based on weight.
> >
> > I would keep the handle on because it makes it easier to carry around
> > town if you have to. Write your last name on the side and use removable
> > sticky labels (available at any office depot, etc.) on the lid for
> > addressing. To keep the lids from popping off in transit we used 3M
> > strapping tape to supplement the snap-on lid.
> >
> > The only possible downsides are the weight of the bucket (extra postage)
> > and the less than optimal circular dimensions. They do not pack well.
> > However, we never really filled them up. The last postage on our buckets
> > (sent partially full of extra gear and town clothes) is priority mail,
> > Ashland OR to Sunnyvale CA: $9.50.
> >
> > Later,
> > Kent.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
> > [mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Robert B
> > Smith
> > Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 8:09 AM
> > To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > Subject: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box
> >
> > I have seen a few entries where hikers stated that they used a 5 gal
> > plastic bucket as a bounce box.
> > Overall, how did this work out ?. How did the Post Office staff react to
> > the bucket ?. I like the idea and see how it could be a good system.
> > Also, did you remove the handle ?.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Wateboy
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 14:25:20 -0500
From: "Robert Ellinwood" <rellinwood@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: "'Hiker'" <hiker@godlikebuthumble.com>,
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000001c3d61d$282b5530$3e794d0c@ellinwood>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hiker writes: "I crossed it on a snow bridge."
I've always been leery (read: chicken) about snow bridges, preferring to
wade. Anyone ever fallen through on one? Are there specific
techniques for "judging" a snow bridge from those who have crossed a
number of them? How do you know it will hold you? I assume one jumps
over the center part??
Bob (BobnShell)
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-
> bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Hiker
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 1:57 PM
> To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
>
> At 06:29 AM 1/8/04, StoneDancer1@aol.com wrote:
> > >>>>>I'm surprised no one has mentioned Rush Creek. <<<<<
>
> I crossed it on a snow bridge. My coldest night on the PCT was between
> Island Pass and Donahue Pass.....
>
> While climbing up the sun-cupped snow to Donahue the next morning,
there
> was a swarm of black winged butterflies. It started to sleet a little,
and
> thousands of them ended up covering the snow. Beautiful, and kind of
sad,
> all at the same time. I was SOO happy to make it back down to the snow
free
> and relative warmth of Lyell canyon, only to be rudely asked for my
permit
> by a gun-toting ranger on horse-back. And his horse was causing major
> damage to the soaking wet trails.
>
> Welcome to Yosemite.
> The least friendly National Park in my experience
>
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 11:41:39 -0800
From: "Bob Bankhead" <wandering_bob@comcast.net>
Subject: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: "Robert Ellinwood" <rellinwood@worldnet.att.net>, "PCT List Forum"
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <006c01c3d61f$6f5f1b60$6401a8c0@BOB>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Wise man say: "Never burn your bridges."
One NEVER jumps on a snow bridge unless one enjoys collapsing it under them.
This can really upset your partners behind (or in front of) you who now have
to pull you out AND find another way over (and maybe back). They might just
leave you down there to contemplate the wisdom of your actions. Worse yet,
you could be alone when you did it. Cross slowly and step gently - don't
run or do anything to set up harmonic vibrations in the bridge.
Will it hold you? There's no way to tell but to try it. Rope up first -
either to your partner(s) or to a solid anchor - unless you know for sure
what's under that bridge.
Wandering Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Ellinwood" <rellinwood@worldnet.att.net>
To: "'Hiker'" <hiker@godlikebuthumble.com>; <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 11:25 AM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
I've always been leery (read: chicken) about snow bridges, preferring to
wade. Anyone ever fallen through on one? Are there specific
techniques for "judging" a snow bridge from those who have crossed a
number of them? How do you know it will hold you? I assume one jumps
over the center part??
Bob (BobnShell)
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 14:54:17 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1cf.177844d5.2d2f0f69@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/8/04 11:26:01 AM, rellinwood@worldnet.att.net writes:
<< Anyone ever fallen through on one? Are there specific
techniques for "judging" a snow bridge from those who have crossed a
number of them? How do you know it will hold you? I assume one jumps
over the center part??
>>
You let the biggest guy go first! If he falls through, you wade. If not, it
is probably safe for you. Sorry about that if you ARE the biggest guy
Other than that, poke your ice ax or a branch into the snow in front of
you
as you cross. If it breaks through, watch out. Or pick up a big soccerball
sized rock and toss it on to the snow bridge to see what happens
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 11:56:08 -0800
From: "Brian Bowlsby" <go4ahike@verizon.net>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: "'Bob Bankhead'" <wandering_bob@comcast.net>, "'Robert Ellinwood'"
<rellinwood@worldnet.att.net>, "'PCT List Forum'"
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <A00B28CCEC72D711A4A80003470C5EBF11B570@pdx-mail>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Also, to add to what Bob said, it helps to probe the snow ahead of you
with a trekking pole or stick to "feel" if the snow is solid or not. If
the pole pokes through the snow, then don't go any farther or else you
will also be going through the snow! Even better, if you can see the
snowbridge from the side before you cross, you can get a visual of how
thick the bridge is at the apex. Any less than a foot thick and I
wouldn't chance it!
Brian
-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
[mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Bob Bankhead
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 11:42 AM
To: Robert Ellinwood; PCT List Forum
Subject: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
Wise man say: "Never burn your bridges."
One NEVER jumps on a snow bridge unless one enjoys collapsing it under
them. This can really upset your partners behind (or in front of) you
who now have to pull you out AND find another way over (and maybe back).
They might just leave you down there to contemplate the wisdom of your
actions. Worse yet, you could be alone when you did it. Cross slowly
and step gently - don't run or do anything to set up harmonic vibrations
in the bridge.
Will it hold you? There's no way to tell but to try it. Rope up first -
either to your partner(s) or to a solid anchor - unless you know for
sure what's under that bridge.
Wandering Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Ellinwood" <rellinwood@worldnet.att.net>
To: "'Hiker'" <hiker@godlikebuthumble.com>;
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 11:25 AM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
I've always been leery (read: chicken) about snow bridges, preferring to
wade. Anyone ever fallen through on one? Are there specific
techniques for "judging" a snow bridge from those who have crossed a
number of them? How do you know it will hold you? I assume one jumps
over the center part??
Bob (BobnShell)
_______________________________________________
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pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
unsubscribe or change options:
http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 11:55:04 -0800
From: "Plotnikoff, David" <DPlotnikoff@mercurynews.com>
Subject: [pct-l] historic weather data for California
To: "'oz4130@yahoo.com'" <oz4130@yahoo.com>
Cc: "'pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net'" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID:
<C742294845ABD41190920008C7A4CFB00DAF1DFD@email1.mercurynews.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
>From: scott deputy <oz4130@yahoo.com>
>Subject: [pct-l] weather log
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Message-ID: <20040108031249.33624.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
>This topic may have floated around some time ago but I was unable to find
it. Does anyone >know of an online journal that documents daily weather
conditions on a thruhike. I'm mainly >interested in high and low
temperatures, I'm trying to figure out how few clothes I will need to
>carry starting at Campo and what might need to be changed when I enter the
Sierra. I'm >planning on starting around the middle of April.
Scott, the CA Dept. of Water Resources has all its snow and river monitors,
plus other weather stations, networked on the Web. It's very simple to look
at a station near or on the trail and examine the historic highs, lows,
rain, snow for any month in any year going back sometimes to the 50s. The
form online isn't perfectly intuitive.You'll have to play with it.
Essentially, you give it a date range, a sensor number and the type of data
you want and it plots it graphically. This has been VERY helpful to me in
planning for typical nighttime low temps, knowing when a section of trail
might be reasonably clear of snow, what the chance of rain is on a certain
section during a certain week or month of the year, etc ... And, as everyone
else here has already emphasized: Every year is different. Historic
performance is no indicator of future conditions. But you knew that.
http://cdec.water.ca.gov/
David Plotnikoff
San Jose Mercury News
(408) 920-5867
dplotnikoff@mercurynews.com
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 11:50:55 -0800
From: Hiker <hiker@godlikebuthumble.com>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem
creeks
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20040108114806.042e7ac0@fastpack.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 11:25 AM 1/8/04, Robert Ellinwood wrote:
>Hiker writes: "I crossed it on a snow bridge."
>
>I've always been leery (read: chicken) about snow bridges, preferring to
>wade. Anyone ever fallen through on one?
Actually where I crossed, you could only tell where the creek was because
there was a depression in the snow field, and you could hear the creek
underneath. There was no liquid water in sight anywhere around.
The snow must have been several feet thick in that area, but I still didn't
feel to comfortable hearing the water roaring under foot......
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 13:28:32 -0800 (PST)
From: The Mountain Goat <themtgoat@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box /What can you mail USPS
To: pct mailing list <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <20040108212832.21264.qmail@web40909.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
This is probably the funniest page (to me) that I have read in some time...
-Mt Goat-
Edmond Meinfelder <edmond@mydogmeg.net> wrote:
At The post office has wider latitude on unusually shaped objects than you
might think. The following link shows an interesting experiment into just
how tolerant the post office is:
http://www.improb.com/airchives/paperair/volume6/v6i4/postal-6-4.html
Apparently, the Post Office will not ship helium balloons, but will ship a
properly labelled can of split pea soup.
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" SweepstakesFrom
themtgoat@yahoo.com Thu Jan 8 15:37:42 2004
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Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 13:37:03 -0800 (PST)
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Subject: Re: [pct-l] 5 gal buckets bounce box /What can you mail USPS
To: pct mailing list <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
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This is probably the funniest page (to me) that I have read in some time...
-Mt Goat-
Edmond Meinfelder <edmond@mydogmeg.net> wrote:
At The post office has wider latitude on unusually shaped objects than you
might think. The following link shows an interesting experiment into just
how tolerant the post office is:
http://www.improb.com/airchives/paperair/volume6/v6i4/postal-6-4.html
Apparently, the Post Office will not ship helium balloons, but will ship a
properly labelled can of split pea soup.
---------------------------------
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<< This topic may have floated around some time ago but I was unable to find
it. Does anyone know of an online journal that documents daily weather
conditions on a thruhike. I'm mainly interested in high and low
temperatures, I'm trying to figure out how few clothes I will need to carry
starting at Campo and what might need to be changed when I enter the Sierra.
I'm planning on starting around the middle of April. >>
As has already mention mentioned, the southern CA region has a tremendous
amount of temperature diversity in April, May, and even June. In the same
given spot as low as 2,500 feet (such as in May of '95 and '98) you can have
below freezing with snow falling, and then well over 100 degrees on the same
date a year later, or a few days later in the same year. I would carry
enough for full winter conditions, but expect the heat of summer with hours
at a time of direct sunlight more often, especially below the forest zones
(which start at an average elevation of 5,000 feet, with variations). Above
that, extreme heat becomes uncommon and canopy gives you frequent breaks
from the sunshine. In most years, when you drop into the Agua Dulce region
it's getting later in the spring/early summer, and you generally have a
break from the potential cold snaps until after the Walker Pass area
(approaching the Kennedy meadows region). Once you hit the high Sierra, your
temp range in June will be similar to that of a cold spell in late April/May
in the southern CA mtns, so your gear is about the same. Typically 60's and
70's during the day with 20's at night. Once you get past the
Yosemite/Sonora Pass region and into July, below freezing nights become very
infrequent, although be prepared for it anyway. I found that in Oregon in
August, we were getting frosts or freezes about every 7-10 mornings. By
September in Washington, assume atleast some snow with the temps
occasionally in the 20's or lower, especially toward the second half of the
month. But it's different every year. In September, '98 I never experienced
32 degrees or lower in Washington, and no snow. It was sunny and in the 60's
and 70's almost everyday. In 2000 the story was completely different. So in
conclusion, my clothing gear didn't change all that much from beginning to
end.
wc
_________________________________________________________________
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 17:38:55 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] weather log
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20.200cd7f0.2d2f35ff@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/8/04 2:04:39 PM, weathercarrot@hotmail.com writes:
<< So in
conclusion, my clothing gear didn't change all that much from beginning to
end. >>
Same here
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 18:14:33 -0500 (EST)
From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] weather log
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <3FFDE459.00015F.34587@ns.interchange.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
this may have already been mentioned, if so I apologize, but you can
get historical weather info for most cities or zip codes in the US
from:
http://www.wunderground.com
> << This topic may have floated around some time ago but I was
> unable to find it. Does anyone know of an online journal that
> documents daily weather conditions on a thruhike. I'm mainly
> interested in high and low temperatures, I'm trying to figure out
> how few clothes I will need to carry starting at Campo and what
> might need to be changed when I enter the Sierra. I'm planning on
> starting around the middle of April. >>
>
> As has already mention mentioned, the southern CA region has a
> tremendous amount of temperature diversity in April, May, and even
> June. In the same given spot as low as 2,500 feet (such as in May
> of '95 and '98) you can have below freezing with snow falling, and
> then well over 100 degrees on the same date a year later, or a few
> days later in the same year. I would carry enough for full winter
> conditions, but expect the heat of summer with hours at a time of
> direct sunlight more often, especially below the forest zones
> (which start at an average elevation of 5,000 feet, with
> variations). Above that, extreme heat becomes uncommon and canopy
> gives you frequent breaks from the sunshine. In most years, when
> you drop into the Agua Dulce region it's getting later in the
> spring/early summer, and you generally have a break from the
> potential cold snaps until after the Walker Pass area (approaching
> the Kennedy meadows region). Once you hit the high Sierra, your
> temp range in June will be similar to that of a cold spell in late
> April/May in the southern CA mtns, so your gear is about the same.
> Typically 60's and 70's during the day with 20's at night. Once
> you get past the Yosemite/Sonora Pass region and into July, below
> freezing nights become very infrequent, although be prepared for
> it anyway. I found that in Oregon in August, we were getting
> frosts or freezes about every 7-10 mornings. By September in
> Washington, assume atleast some snow with the temps occasionally
> in the 20's or lower, especially toward the second half of the
> month. But it's different every year. In September, '98 I never
> experienced 32 degrees or lower in Washington, and no snow. It was
> sunny and in the 60's and 70's almost everyday. In 2000 the story
> was completely different. So in conclusion, my clothing gear
> didn't change all that much from beginning to end.
>
> wc
>
> _________________________________________________________________
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
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------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:25:06 -0800
From: "JoAnn M. Michael" <jomike47@earthlink.net>
Subject: [pct-l] need some help
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <001501c3d63e$a7a91ba0$9828a5d1@yourxhtr8hvc4p>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Okay guys...just what is a triptease rope??
JoAnnFrom go4ahike@verizon.net Thu Jan 8 17:34:41 2004
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From: "Brian Bowlsby" <go4ahike@verizon.net>
To: "'JoAnn M. Michael'" <jomike47@earthlink.net>,
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] need some help
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:34:58 -0800
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Triptease rope is made by Kelty for tent guylines, and has a reflective
material woven into it so you can see it at night. For more info, check
the link below...
http://www.kelty.com/Kelty/index.cfm?fuseaction=Tents.ShowProduct&type=a
ccessories&ID=5
-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
[mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net] On Behalf Of JoAnn M.
Michael
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 3:25 PM
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Subject: [pct-l] need some help
Okay guys...just what is a triptease rope??
JoAnn
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------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 17:26:36 -0800
From: "Joanne Lennox" <goforth@cio.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Convenced,,,,!
To: "Norma" <n.ruiz@verizon.net>, <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <200401090001.i0901Kch011750@cnwmail.isomedia.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
----------
> From: Norma <n.ruiz@verizon.net>
> To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> Subject: [pct-l] Convenced,,,,!
> Date: Saturday, January 03, 2004 10:22 AM
>
> I am totally convenced that a cart is out of the question and
dangerious,I am convenced that a string of pack annimals are the only way
to go,and several wrote and informed me so,I am convenced that a over
weight handycaped person,can do this with no problems,providing I take
enough food,I have convenced,my son to do this first trip with me,from the
Columbia River to whites pass in May,that will be the drop of & pick up
area,does any body have an idea just how far and how long it will
take,remembering that this is going to ba a big hike and camp out,first
trip,,,,! to take all the bugs out,and to see just how the annimals will
work,mainly to get the do,s and dont,s out,,,at this time I would like to
thank Carol,Morion & husband,& Mr, Bankhead,you all been a great deal of
help,and you all put me on the right path,,,thanks Howard L Ruiz
>
This is such a crazy idea that I hesitated to respond to it; it indicates
that you need to do a LOT more reading and planning with maps and
guidebooks in hand and then do a single overnight on the PCT. After that
do a two day stretch on the PCT with horses; when you make it up to a week
stretch on the PCT in MAY returning with horses that are not hungry or
injured, you might consider doing the Goat Rocks in August or September in
a good low snow year.
Wondered if this wasn't just a flamer, so I will not respond hereafter.
Joanne
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:09:58 -0500
From: "The Weathercarrot" <weathercarrot@hotmail.com>
Subject: [pct-l] weather log
To: dude@fastmail.ca, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <BAY2-F66UhhlzuYl0gH000101e4@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Among others, the Western Regional Climate Center has some of the most
extensive historical temp and precip data. A surprisingly large percentage
of trail towns are represented there, as well as many of the major developed
passes (such as Stevens Pass).
Southern California:
http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/summary/climsmsca.html
Northern California:
http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/summary/climsmnca.html
Oregon:
http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/summary/climsmor.html
Washington:
http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/summary/climsmwa.html
<< this may have already been mentioned, if so I apologize, but you can
get historical weather info for most cities or zip codes in the US
from: http://www.wunderground.com >>
_________________________________________________________________
Take advantage of our limited-time introductory offer for dial-up Internet
access. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 16:39:29 -0800 (PST)
From: robert vance <hikerrobbie@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] northern cascades
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20040109003929.21138.qmail@web20725.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Gray <gray_hiker@mindpoison.org> wrote:
I've only been in that area on one hike, but I've looked at the
surrounding topos a lot... *are* there any roads that an alternate
route could take?
To the best of my memory, there really are no roads on the east side of
Glacier, until well past Lake Chelan. And to the west, it would be a
hell of a hike along the Suiattle River, and then down a long access
road, to get to any road that could be a detour.
I don't doubt at all that the detours will be long and strenuous, but I
highly doubt there will be any road walking... unless, of course, the
damage is so great that it requires a detour of 20 miles or more.
the damage is that great.the main sticking point seems to be south of the
suiattle river. to get around that would require on the east side, a detour
over buck creek pass down to the trailhead at trinity, then a road walk to
the napeequa valley trail and from there having to cross the chiwawa river
and(i belive) the napeequa too,very unlikely in early season snow melt. the
only other alternative i see is a long road walk down the suiattle river
road over to darrington then heading down the mountain loop hwy to catch
back up with the p.c.t. at the north fork sauk rd trailhead.
Ps: Has anyone on this list taken a side-route over to Image Lake from
the PCT on a thru-hike? How many miles and elevation gain does it add?
Worth it?
well worth it! if memory serves me i think it`s about 2 miles and 1000 ft
elevation gain from miners ridge.massive flower gardens and a jaw dropping
look at glaicier peak has made this a northwest favorite for decades.also
there is a lookout tower that welcomes visitors.one of my all time favorite
places not only in the cascades but anywhere.rob
---------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 20:38:34 EST
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques and problem creeks
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
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In a message dated 1/8/2004 11:26:01 AM Pacific Standard Time,
rellinwood@worldnet.att.net writes:
>>>>>Are there specific techniques for "judging" a snow bridge from those
who
have crossed a number of them? How do you know it will hold you?<<<<<<
Try to go in a group and get the heaviest person to cross first. If he
makes
it, chances are you might too. <G>
On a more serious side, they merit care. While not a snow bridge, I had an
experience in Boy Scout Canyon, up the front of Whitney. The canyon was
filled
with snow and I was walking close to a rock wall. The snow gave way and
below me, I could see at least 15' down to the ground. Fortunately I didn't
go in.
No Way
Ray Echols
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 17:58:57 -0800
From: "Judson Brown" <judsonb@internetcds.com>
Subject: [pct-l] new section K?
To: "pctl (E-mail)" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000501c3d654$24c84f10$365af142@pounder>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I read and heard it mentioned that WA's section K past Glacier Peak was the
hardest thing on the PCT N of the Sierra, though I never had the pleasure to
experience it. If/when the trail is rerouted to the side of the mtn., what
will that due to the difficulty and length of this section?
Judson
Ashland
------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 21:36:27 -0800 (PST)
From: robert vance <hikerrobbie@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] new section K?
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20040109053627.8857.qmail@web20725.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I read and heard it mentio
ned that WA's section K past Glacier Peak was the
hardest thing on the PCT N of the Sierra, though I never had the pleasure to
experience it. If/when the trail is rerouted to the side of the mtn., what
will that due to the difficulty and length of this section?
a lot of people have suggested that the p.c.t. be rerouted to the east of
glaicer peak,i can't see any advantage to that. on the west side the
problems are the bridges across milk creek and the suiattle river which wash
out every few years,on the east side you have the napeequa and chiwawa
rivers whose bridges washed out years ago and have never been replaced,for
the same reason as the west side bridges.it seems like six of one or a half
dozen of the other.
---------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 21:50:58 -0800 (PST)
From: robert vance <hikerrobbie@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Surface of Mars...
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While I agree that Bush's
environmental policies suck, I don't think laying every environmental
problem or catastrophe at his feet is fair or even intelligent.
hey i belive in giving credit where credit due,give bush props ,he`s managed
to outdo reagan in his antieviormental stance,he`s never found a
enviromental regulation he can`t roll back. and this is just the start, if
he`s reelected watch how he's going to punish the northwest(and p.c.t.)with
his"healthy forests" plan.youd better hike the deserts of southern
california soon too,another term and those protections are gone too.
---------------------------------
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Subject: Re: [pct-l] need some help
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At 03:25 PM 1/8/2004 -0800, JoAnn M. Michael wrote:
>Okay guys...just what is a triptease rope??
It's highly reflective 3M Scotchlite fiber for visibility wrapped around a
spectra core for strength made by Kelty.
If you go to the Kick Off and accidently set up your tarp or tent near
ground zero (close to the fire), you'll be happy you have it. else you'll
listen to people trip over your guy lines all night.
It's great stuff.
Tangent
------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 02:15:34 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] new section K?
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1dc.181db714.2d2faf16@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/8/04 5:58:35 PM, judsonb@internetcds.com writes:
<< I read and heard it mentioned that WA's section K past Glacier Peak was
the
hardest thing on the PCT N of the Sierra, >>
Not quite right. It IS the hardest section on the PCT. Would be MUCH easier
to just go up and over the dang thing, except for all the crevasses.
------------------------------
Message: 19
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 10:30:15 EST
From: Lonetrail@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] Mountain Lion
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <ca.2685efa4.2d302307@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In an area called Whiting Wilderness Ranch a mountain lion perhaps killed
one
person and seriously mauled another. Whiting Wilderness Ranch is
approximately 1500 acres nestled between several densely populated towns in
Orange County,
CA. Yet it is a designated wilderness
The injured person was mountain biking with a group when the lion attacked
her. If it wasn't for her friend who stopped the lion from dragging her off
by
pulling on her feet.
A few other bikers came by and drove the lion off. It was not until when
medic was removing the victim that they notice a second victim who was half
buried
along the trail. This person a male was killed or died sometimes earlier. It
has been assume that the loin was protecting his/her kill The suspected lion
was killed last night. If this lion was a celebrity (making money) like
Seigfried and Roy's Lion it would never have been killed. I believe this is
the third
mountain lion shot within the last year by park police in this area. Bikers,
hikers, horse back riding and women pushing baby carriages are allowed in
the
park, but no dogs. The environmentalist feel the dogs will scare of the
bears,lions, etc
I saw a mountain lion several years ago in Whiting Ranch. The lion paid no
attention to me. It was busy trying to catch some birds. I guest this was
then
his/her food chain. Evidently the food chain moved up to humans. I reported
this sighting to the ranger station. I got no responce from the ranger
I again question why this area was designated a wilderness. 1500 acres
surround by highway and millions of people. How can large wildlife exist
here
without incidents as occurred last night? Oh! I know it makes the present
day
environmentalist feel so good to have a designated wilderness in their back
yard.
This was the trend several decades ago by local chapters of the Sierra Club.
At
the same time the same environmentalist (Sierra Club) voted for mass
inmagration which resulted in building more homes yes cutting down more
trees. Oh! Yes,
their cry save the forest, save the amimals, save the air and streams but
people votes trees don't, aminals don't and that's more inportant you see
the
Sierra Club became so attached to the Denoctrtic party they could not see
the
forest because of the votes.
lonetrail
------------------------------
Message: 20
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 12:23:57 EST
From: Bighummel@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] Also in the news from Orange County
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <c.1fcf464e.2d303dad@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
HORSE OWNERS FACE HEFTY MANURE FINES
NEWPORT BEACH - The city's canine scooper law has become a bur under the
saddle for horse owners, who are facing $100 to $500 fines if they don't
clean up
after horses on Santa Ana Heights bridle trails.
Horse owners claim their animals are leaving only harmless manure in
their
wake, but residents along the miles of meandering bridle trails said the
neighborhood is being marred by the stench.
New signs posted on the trails warn of $100 to $500 fines for owners
whose
horses leave a mess. Additionally, several houses along sidewalks and
trails
have added shovels with cans.
"It's just a good-neighbor issue. The bottom line is: If you've got an
animal, take care of it." said Barbara Venezia, organizer of the campaign.
Horse owners said they don't mind taking care of their animals, but some
resent a city ordinance that treats them exactly as it does dog owners who
don't clean up after their pets.
Hmmm, better hope that the Forsest Service and Park Service don't catch on
to
this!
------------------------------
Message: 21
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 13:23:38 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Also in the news from Orange County
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1c7.13d698a8.2d304baa@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/9/04 9:24:50 AM, Bighummel@aol.com writes:
<< NEWPORT BEACH - The city's canine scooper law has become a bur under the
saddle for horse owners, who are facing $100 to $500 fines if they don't
clean up
after horses on Santa Ana Heights bridle trails.
Horse owners claim their animals are leaving only harmless manure in
their
wake, but residents along the miles of meandering bridle trails said the
neighborhood is being marred by the stench.
New signs posted on the trails warn of $100 to $500 fines for owners
whose
horses leave a mess. Additionally, several houses along sidewalks and
trails
have added shovels with cans. >>
They are looking at it the wrong way. They should be encouraging horse
poop.
The county could gather up all that free manure and sell it as upscale
fertilizer to be used by the landscapers for those whining about it. These
are
bridle paths used only by horses, right? It's not like hikers have to wade
through
it. If you fine them, they will probably comply and all that potential
revenue
from horse poop will be flushed down the toilet!
------------------------------
Message: 22
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:19:30 EST
From: Slyatpct@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] Deer question?
To: pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID: <dd.fdf905.2d3058c2@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Hey,
I think I heard someone say that deer kill more people than mountain lion,
can anyone verify this?
Thanks.
------------------------------
Message: 23
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 12:38:28 -0700
From: Edmond Meinfelder <edmond@mydogmeg.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Deer question?
To: pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040109123520.017d3af0@mail.mydogmeg.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
I did. I got the information from
http://www.cnn.com/2002/TECH/science/09/25/coolsc.critters.attacks/
It's a short piece and gives Herrero a mention. Regrettably there are no
references citing from where the information comes.
Tangent
At 02:19 PM 1/9/2004 -0500, Slyatpct@aol.com wrote:
>I think I heard someone say that deer kill more people than mountain lion,
>can anyone verify this?
------------------------------
Message: 24
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 16:41:09 -0500 (EST)
From: "DANIEL ALAN ERDMAN" <dae151@psu.edu>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
To: Slyatpct@aol.com
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net, andrew@aushiker.com
Message-ID: <200401092141.QAA20320@webmail5.cac.psu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain
Enough with stating andrew priest's posting would be non pct related.
nothing
could be further from the truth. Gear has been the most discussed topic on
this list.
On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 22:47:03, Slyatpct@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 12/31/2003 10:28:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> andrew@aushiker.com writes:
>
> Andrew, there's nothing to stop you from posting to the list on with an
pct
> related subject. Your signiture has many interesting urls and would be a
> reminder.
>
> In order to put this in perspective, how would you feel about someone
posting
> to the BGT about carrying bear cannisters through the High Sierra or a
> resupply on the CDT? It doesn't really fit your list main function.
>
> Best of luck,
>
> Sly
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 25
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 16:51:55 EST
From: Slyatpct@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
To: dae151@psu.edu
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1dc.18279e7c.2d307c7b@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/9/2004 4:41:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, dae151@psu.edu
writes:
> Enough with stating andrew priest's posting would be non pct related.
> nothing
> could be further from the truth. Gear has been the most discussed topic
on
> this list.
>
Back off, I wasn't the only one that felt it was unwarranted to post
results.
I tried to put it in perspective, saying that PCT related subjects aren't
part of their list, why should his be part of this one? It's easy enough to
join
BGT if you want the info specifically.
------------------------------
Message: 26
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:16:42 -0800
From: "Beth Murdock" <dorothea@onemain.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Ice axe size
To: "Pct-L@Mailman. Backcountry. Net" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <LOBBKEGLCAKDFHIMJHOCGECNFNAA.dorothea@onemain.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I'm thinking about getting a lightweight ice axe, for next year's PCT hike,
but am wondering what size to get. According to the instructions I've seen,
I should get a 70 inch, but at web sites that sell ice axes there seems to
be an implied preference for a shorter axe for PCT hikers.
What's your advice?
Thanks,
Beth, in Portland OR, where we are finally thawing out
------------------------------
Message: 27
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:26:37 -0800 (PST)
From: Ilja Friedel <ilja@cs.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Deer question?
To: pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<Pine.LNX.4.44.0401091420500.12444-100000@performance.cs.caltech.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi Slyatpct,
No deers, but lions from the rec.backcountry FAQ:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=eugene+miya+distilled+wisdom+16/28&hl=en&l
r=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=3fdf06ce%241%40darkstar&rnum=1
> Cause Deaths/year
>
> Bees 40
> Lightning 12
> Mtn Lions 0.11
Lets kill all those lions, to make LA a safer place.
Ilja.
------------------------------
Message: 28
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:53:39 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Ice axe size
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <102.3c5f0135.2d308af3@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
In a message dated 1/9/04 2:11:34 PM, dorothea@onemain.com writes:
<< According to the instructions I?EUR(tm)ve seen,
I should get a 70 inch, >>
Sounds good to me if you are between 5' to 5' 4'' tall. If you want light
weight, get a titanium one. This subject has been discussed at length (no
pun
intended) so you might want to try the archives. To put it succinctly, the
main
function of an ice ax is as a balance tool since it is rarely used for self
arrest (which is only ONE of its functions). A short ice ax is pretty
useless as
a balance tool
I went to a Mountaineers meeting last night and someone had an ice ax
that
once belonged to Jim Whittaker. It was about 3 feet long. And consider the
pre ice ax snow tool, the alpenstock. It wasn't exactly short --- more like
6
feet long. Hmm, I wonder why? Could it be it was used for balance too by any
chance? The ice ax replaced it because it was more functional, not because
alpenstocks were too long
------------------------------
Message: 29
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:59:22 -0800
From: "Marshall Karon" <m.karon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Ice axe size
To: "Beth Murdock" <dorothea@onemain.com>, "Pct-L@Mailman.
Backcountry. Net" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <001301c3d704$3903d7a0$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I finally got to use my ice axe! Never needed on the PCT in 2000, but
getting around my house here in Portland - it saved me. Good for chopping up
this stuff. Lots of opportunity to use it for self arrest (ha! ha! - one
really needed a jack hammer). If we had this stuff on the PCT I wouldn't be
here.
Regarding length: two theories - one is use to use for leverage and as a
walking stick - you need it long; other is for just self arrest and
climbing, shorter will do. What I've been told is that the longer bar gives
you more leverage. Both will work.
We have one that is about 70 cm and another about 73 cm. I used mine in some
streams, but I had to bend over.
Probably you will never need to use one, or if so, only for a very short
distance. That means that you can get by with a shorter axe. Main use is to
stop you from sliding in the first place. So, if you are like me, you will
buy one, carry it, and then use it for the next Portland ice storm. So, that
means it just may not matter.
Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "Beth Murdock" <dorothea@onemain.com>
To: "Pct-L@Mailman. Backcountry. Net" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2004 2:16 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Ice axe size
> I'm thinking about getting a lightweight ice axe, for next year's PCT
hike,
> but am wondering what size to get. According to the instructions I've
seen,
> I should get a 70 inch, but at web sites that sell ice axes there seems to
> be an implied preference for a shorter axe for PCT hikers.
>
> What's your advice?
>
> Thanks,
> Beth, in Portland OR, where we are finally thawing out
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
------------------------------
Message: 30
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 15:10:34 -0800 (PST)
From: Gene Neagle <CTWalker@litebackpacker.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Kennedy Meadows Start
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20040109231035.31121395D@sitemail.everyone.net>
Content-Type: text/plain
Due to school scheduling I am going to start my PCT trip at Kennedy Meadows.
As far as I can tell on the Greyhound site I can get to Lone Pine on
Greyhound. I figure if I can get to Inyokern I can hitch to the trail from
there. Does anyone know of a shuttle or local bus service from Lone Pine to
Inyokern? Maybe a trail angel? This would be around June 14-15. Muchos
Gracias hiker dudes and dudettes.
_____________________________________________________________
Get your free @LiteBACKPACKER.COM email
account at http://www.backpacking.net
------------------------------
Message: 31
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 15:27:20 -0800 (PST)
From: Gene Neagle <CTWalker@litebackpacker.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Ice ax size
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20040109232720.055DF395A@sitemail.everyone.net>
Content-Type: text/plain
It is my understanding that when you hold the head of the ax in your hand
the tip should be about at your ankle. This is what I have heard from a few
climbers and on a couple of forums. I think it is in Mountaineering, Freedom
Of the Hills. I am glad to hear that I am not the only stir crazy maniac
using his ax to chip ice off the steps and sidewalk. I recently bought the
Cassin Ghost, 70 cm , and it surprised me with how well it broke the ice
considering that it is 10 ozs. and all aluminum. I haven't used it in the
real snow yet. Hope this helps. Gene
_____________________________________________________________
Get your free @LiteBACKPACKER.COM email
account at http://www.backpacking.net
------------------------------
Message: 32
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 18:40:14 EST
From: Slyatpct@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
To: dae151@psu.edu
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1ea.16f39fef.2d3095de@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 1/9/2004 4:42:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, dae151@psu.edu
writes:
> Enough with stating andrew priest's posting would be non pct related.
> nothing
> could be further from the truth. Gear has been the most discussed topic
on
> this list.
>
I could answer both yours and Jerry's private emails personally, but since
you, who ever you are, choose to select my post to respond to publically,
I'll
keep the discussion here.
I don't own this list, I'm only a member and I only expressed my opinion.
It's not my call on whether BGT should be able to post their announcements,
or
not, it's Ryan's, the list(s) owner. Why not contact and ask him, instead
of
pleading your case here.
I can use the delete key if I'm not interested in the 68 tests and $100,000
worth of gear you have to test, as easily as I can join the BGT or view the
website.
Sly
------------------------------
Message: 33
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 16:38:10 -0700
From: Ron Martino <yumitori@montana.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <3FFF3B62.7050503@montana.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>I tried to put it in perspective, saying that PCT related subjects aren't
>part of their list, why should his be part of this one? It's easy enough
to join
>BGT if you want the info specifically.
The BGT list exists for the purpose of managing the testing process.
It isn't the best way to keep track of completed reviews, if that's your
only interest. That's the reason for the once-a-month announcements.
In a 'vote' reminiscent of the mandate received by George W. Bush,
the members of this list declared their support for keeping the PCT-L
pure. Which apparently means discussing nothing but bear canisters,
Bush's environmental policies, and Mars, judging by the lack of
complaints about /those/ threads...
--
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will
determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate
discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor
must preside at our assemblies.
William O. Douglas
yumitori(AT)montana(DOT)com
------------------------------
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End of pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 7
***********************************