[pct-l] shuttle rides, bus service, stream crossing

[sierra_marmot at yahoo.com (John Randall)]

I think you'd better check your Greyhound schedule again.  I believe the LA-Reno once-a-day service was discontinued nearly two years ago.  There are some alternatives.  Inyo County has a Lone Pine-Bishop twice a day service.   Greyhound does go across the desert toward Bakersfield with a stop at the McDonalds in Mojave, which I think is going to be your closest bus stop to get to KM.  Trail angels or hitching from there, I'm afraid.  There are some names on this web site for eastside sierra shuttles, including the very expensive Kontry Korners.  http://lomaprieta.sierraclub.org/pcs/info/shuttles.asp   You might call some of the motels in Lone Pine and Independence (Kathy, owner of Ray's Den in Independence comes to mind) to see if they know someone who could use some cash.
 
Using a rope to cross a stream is dangerous.  The only streams you're really going to have a problem with in the High Sierra in early eason will be Evolution Creek, Bear Creek (a bugger), and Silver Pass Creek just above its junction with N. Fork Mono Creek(also very treacherous.)
 
Good luck on your thru-hike.  You might want to re-think your eventual goal and make Stevens Pass your final destination.  Nobody's going to be thru-hiking Glacier Peak this year.  Maybe a hitch down to Lake Chelan and see if you can pick up the trail north of the lake.
 
john

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Today's Topics:

1. Re: Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date (Ilja Friedel)
2. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
(CMountainDave@aol.com)
3. Re: East side shuttle service? (Eckert)
4. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up (Marshall Karon)
5. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
(RBALCORN@cs.com)
6. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
(CMountainDave@aol.com)
7. Rope crossings (CMountainDave@aol.com)
8. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up (Joanne Lennox)
9. Re: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 8 (CicelyB250@aol.com)
10. Re: Unsubscription info and rants (AsABat)
11. Re: Re: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 8 (Ken Powers)
12. Digital Camera and Cold Weather (Marshall Karon)
13. RE: Digital Camera and Cold Weather (Daniel Strickland)
14. ELR to Ashland (Judson Brown)
15. RE: let's fish (Jeff Bohannon)
16. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
(Slyatpct@aol.com)
17. Re: Ice axe size (Slyatpct@aol.com)
18. Re: ELR to Ashland (Edmond Meinfelder)
19. Re: Kennedy Meadows Start (Slyatpct@aol.com)
20. Re: Quick question.. (Slyatpct@aol.com)
21. Re: Ice axe size (CMountainDave@aol.com)
22. Re: Unsubscription info and rants (Slyatpct@aol.com)
23. Re: Quick question.. (CMountainDave@aol.com)
24. Re: ELR to Ashland (Ken Powers)
25. Re: ELR to Ashland (Slyatpct@aol.com)
26. RE: Quick question.. (Gray)
27. Re: Quick question.. (dude)
28. Re: Quick question.. (Richard)
29. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up (Eric Yakel)
30. Re: Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up (Eric Yakel)
31. Re: Trailhead Travel, San Diego to Campo (Eric Yakel)
32. Re: ELR to Ashland (Eric Yakel)
33. Re: Quick question.. (CMountainDave@aol.com)
34. Re: Quick question.. (Ken Powers)
35. Re: Quick question.. (dude)
36. Re: ELR to Ashland (Marshall Karon)
37. Tahoe Rim Trail and PCT (ECPG)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 14:15:54 -0800 (PST)
From: Ilja Friedel 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Gear Test Notifications - Tabulations to date
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID:


Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hi Ron,

On Fri, 9 Jan 2004, Ron Martino wrote: 
> As opposed to people who make an effort and spend their time writing 
> down opinions on the latest gear?

They get free gear and write up an opinion on it. Quite like in academia, 
where people get grants, buy cool stuff and write papers about how they 
use their new toys. Shall we set up monthly postings with all the 
most recent abstracts from Nature and Science? Doable.

> Have you actually looked at any of the reviews on BGT? 

They are a great ressource and I have looked at the reviews more then
once. (But I only do so if I want to know more about a product.) Doesn't
mean that I appreciate having monthly updates here. (Don't want to go
shopping for gear every month.) But then again this is my opinion, yours
my vary, etc. etc.


Ilja.


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 17:28:25 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1a4.1eab6d47.2d31d689@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"


In a message dated 1/10/04 1:06:36 PM, RBALCORN@cs.com writes:

<< I know using a rope for stream crossings is recommended, but in practice, 
the 
extra weight seems too much for the few times it would be useful. Is this 
something that would be on a thru hikers list for the JMT section? If so, 
what 
size of rope (diameter, material, length).
>>

Oh yeah, all thru hikers carry a rope. It builds character. None of them go 
solo either. Just way too dangerous. Bears and lions and Oh My!

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 15:05:13 -0800
From: Eckert 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] East side shuttle service?
To: RBALCORN@cs.com, PCT 

Message-ID: <40008529.4090505@nethere.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed

http://www.mammothlakestransportation.com/

I've used him for a shuttle between the McGee Creek trailhead and the 
Mono Creek Trailhead, without a prior reservation. He met us at Tom's 
place within an hour of being called.

Eckert

RBALCORN@cs.com wrote:

>There used to be an east side of the Sierras shuttle service Kountry Korners, 
>but I just tried their 800 number - disconnected, and their two emails - 
>bounced. Does anyone know of another shuttle service?
>Thanks,
>Ralph Alcorn
>www.backpack45.com
>Shepherd Canyon Books
>Publisher of We're in the Mountains, Not Over the Hill: Tales and Tips from 
>Seasoned Women Backpackers
>_______________________________________________
>pct-l mailing list
>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>unsubscribe or change options:
>http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> 
>



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 16:03:51 -0800
From: "Marshall Karon" 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
To: , 

Message-ID: <001e01c3d7d6$6582f400$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Ropes? What have you been reading? Forget the rope, just use a sky hook and
a helicopter! Or maybe one of those 007 jet packs.

Seriously, if you need a rope, don't cross. You are in the wrong place.
Besides, how the heck are you going to get it attached to something on the
other side? A grappling hook in a cannon?

Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.net


----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: 

Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 12:58 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up


> I know using a rope for stream crossings is recommended, but in practice,
the
> extra weight seems too much for the few times it would be useful. Is this
> something that would be on a thru hikers list for the JMT section? If so,
what
> size of rope (diameter, material, length).
>
> Ralph Alcorn
> www.backpack45.com
> Shepherd Canyon Books
> Publisher of We're in the Mountains, Not Over the Hill: Tales and Tips
from
> Seasoned Women Backpackers
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l


------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 19:38:59 EST
From: RBALCORN@cs.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

I must have had a senior moment, thinking that ropes were recommended for 
stream crossing. In addition to the replies here, I went back and read Ray 
Jardines Pacific Crest Handbook section on stream crossing. While he was with 
Outward Bound, they did a number of tests of stream crossing using ropes, and 
concluded that it was very dangerous.

Ralph Alcorn
www.backpack45.com
Shepherd Canyon Books
Publisher of We're in the Mountains, Not Over the Hill: Tales and Tips from 
Seasoned Women Backpackers

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 20:41:37 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1ef.171dbaf8.2d3203d1@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Hey, all kidding aside, if you want to carry about 75' of 4 mm rope. Put the 
rope around a tree until its mid point. Then tie both ends to something on 
your body or around your waist. Then cross. If you slip the rope will keep you 
from going too far down stream. When you get to the other side, pull on one end 
of rope to retrieve it. No guarantees! You should be able to cross about a 20 
-25' wide creek

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 21:02:02 EST
From: CMountainDave@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] Rope crossings
To: pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID: <1c8.13f76407.2d32089a@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

I agree with Jardine that a rope crossing can be dangerous if you use one as 
a hand line. If you rely on it instead of a pole, it would stretch too much 
and you would probably lose your balance. If you cross on its upstream side and 
slip you could get caught on it or it could snag on something and you might 
not be able to get back up again in the swift current. I think that a belay by 
someone or the self belay I described would be somewhat safer, but again, there 
is still the possibility of snagging the rope on a rock or sweeper log if you 
fall

------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 00:03:44 -0800
From: "Joanne Lennox" 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Early season Streams Techniques - rope up
To: , 

Message-ID: <200401110314.i0B3Eqch017329@cnwmail.isomedia.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

It is my understanding that a number of people have drown using a rope to
cross streams. there are a lot of problems that can occur but the main
dynamic appears to be that the rope itself has a lot of drag and is pulled
under by the current. When somebody is tied to the rope, they are pulled
under as well - no amount of strength can pull or push the body weight up
against the current and the drag of the rope, and the body is being pushed
so hard by the current that untying is not a possiblility either.

One of best techniques of stream crossing is to cross in pairs - two people
anchoring each other in the current. I did this one time where the current
was so strong and deep that I could not keep myself anchored in the stream
bottom (I had to lean into the current to stay upright, but the lean caused
my feet to start slipping downstream). I crossed with my husband and on
the down stream side - we both had sticks to stabilize us and these were
held in the outside hands, I held onto his pack waistband, we moved one
foot at a time.

Make sure there are no log jams or drop offs down stream. Choose the
widest area which is usually shallow (but look at the opposite bank to make
sure it is not a deep outside curve that you can't cross). 

I crossed upstream from the usual bad ones in the Sierras(Kings, Bear,
Evolution , and Kerrick). somebody recently mentioned the spots. It was
worth it to me to look around for a better place than the normal crossing -
which looked really bad to me.

Joanne 

Joanne



------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 22:18:54 EST
From: CicelyB250@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] Re: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 8
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Help. unsubscribe me please. Looking for specific info for my thru hike. 
These folks do too much ranting and not enough advice giving. thank you. 
Cicelyb is my "password"

------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 19:30:00 -0800
From: "AsABat" 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Unsubscription info and rants
To: , 

Message-ID: <000901c3d7f3$34c29ce0$1501010a@sd.cox.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

CicleyB and others tolerating the lists rants -

If you're planning on a thru-hike this year, I'd encourage you to stick
around. The ranting will die down as April approaches and the cabin fever
wanes. Then the list will contain more advice on transportation, resupply,
water sources, snow levels, etc., etc., etc.

Also, don't forget the ADZPCTKO the last weekend of April. More info on the
kickoff will be at www.pct77.org/adz as the date gets closer. (Right now it
has last year's info.)

If you do want to subscribe, just go to the website at the bottom of this
and every message:

> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l

AsABat


------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 19:59:33 -0800
From: "Ken Powers" 
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 8
To: , "PCT-L" 

Message-ID: <001d01c3d7f7$525fa640$6401a8c0@pacbell.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

If you want advice, ask a question. There is lots of experience among the
subscribers. You'll get varying opinions sometimes. Then you can pick the
solution that fits your method of hiking.

Ken
----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: 

Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 7:18 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Re: pct-l Digest, Vol 9, Issue 8


> Help. unsubscribe me please. Looking for specific info for my thru hike.
> These folks do too much ranting and not enough advice giving. thank you.
> Cicelyb is my "password"
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l


------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 20:52:10 -0800
From: "Marshall Karon" 
Subject: [pct-l] Digital Camera and Cold Weather
To: "Pct-L" 

Message-ID: <000c01c3d7fe$ac27f270$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

For those who have digital cameras, do they work at sub-freezing temperatures? At desert temperatures?

The specs I've seen rate them from Freezing (32) to 104 degrees F. It has been known to get below freezing sometimes on the PCT and often when out skiing or snow shoeing. And I'm sure some of those desert temperatures were over 100.

Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.netFrom cdrriess1@cox.net Sat Jan 10 23:01:24 2004
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From: "Robert E. Riess" 
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Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 20:59:31 -0800
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Subject: [pct-l] Trailhead Travel, San Diego to Campo 
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Greetings to the Class of 2004:

It will be my pleasure again this year to host hikers in San Diego and help them get a good start. I can meet hikers at the airport, Amtrak and bus stations, and help with all kinds of Trailhead logistics. Grocery store and post office runs are pretty routine. Sometimes we get out to REI or A-16. Hikers usually spend a night or two at my house, and then we make a Trailhead run, often at 4:00am for a firstlight start. I started in 1999 hosting 15 hikers in 9 groups. Last year it was 31 hikers in 15 groups. Usually the Wednesday, Thursday and Friday of the ADZPCTKO we have a vanfull of 6 hikers going out to the monument to start at firstlight. I am a school teacher, so the earliest I can meet you is 3:00pm on school days. I am one of the unofficial organizers of ADZPCTKO, so I will be at Lake Morena that Saturday and Sunday. 

If you are looking for transporation from San Diego to the Trailhead between mid-Apr and mid-May, send me an email with your arrival information and I will make every effort to accomodate everybody. I have a supply of white gas and alcohol, but if you need a particular fuel cannister, please let me know in your initial message. (I will not tell anybody you are using a store-bought stove.) Please include your airline and flight numbers so I can coordinate pickups at the airport. You are welcome to ship advance packages to me. Once initial contact is made by email, I will keep everybody informed by regular email updates, which do not go to the list. I have always been happy to host hikers without conditions, but due to a health consideration of a family member, I must regrettably host only nonsmokers.

Lastly, if you want to handle San Diego to Campo on your own, visit www.sdcommute.com and click on the online trip planner. From this resource you can determine that if you arrive after about 2:00pm, you cannot get to Campo that day on public transportation.

Whether I meet you or not, good luck to the Class of 2004.

Hike on !! Bob Riess at the Trailhead in San Diego


------------------------------

Message: 13
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 00:06:00 -0500
From: "Daniel Strickland" 
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Digital Camera and Cold Weather
To: "'Pct-L'" 

Message-ID: <20040111050558.TQDH2297.lakemtao02.cox.net@blueneon>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Well, I just got back from a bit of skiing, with temps between 0 and 20 the
whole time (with a windchill of 10 degrees or so). Both my Canon Digital
Elph SD10 and Canon Digital Rebel functioned properly at those temps. The
Elph I definitely used on the 0 degree day, and the Rebel was out on a 15-20
degree day. The cameras work slightly slower than normal (which is normal
for most electronics running at those temps, i.e. you can actually see a
delay in LCD updating and etc), but otherwise they were fine.

The only glitch is when moving your camera quickly between two extremes.
When taking it from a warm house out into the cold, or vice versa, moisture
can develop on the lenses and etc (just like what happens to glasses, which
generally only happens I notice going from cold to hot). 

Friends of mine had other digitals out there, another Canon, an Olympus, and
I don't recall what the other was. All theirs appeared to work properly as
well.

Daniel




------------------------------

Message: 14
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2004 21:18:04 -0800
From: "Judson Brown" 
Subject: [pct-l] ELR to Ashland
To: "pctl (E-mail)" 

Message-ID: <000001c3d802$4b3cb5f0$4d56f142@pounder>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Next summer, starting around July 10th, I am planning on starting at Echo
Lake Resort and hiking N to home in Ashland. I would like to tap your
collective expertise a bit.

What will I need in the way of permits in order to be official?

=== message truncated ===


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