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[pct-l] RE: Running Shoes vs. Hiking boots




In my last post "jeune" should be spelled "jaune," my spell checker dosn't
correct French, and it's been a long time since high school. I don't think
jeune is a word at all.
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Today's Topics:

   1. Phones (MONTE ANN DODGE)
   2. contacts and hiking boots (yogi yogi)
   3. gates in the Sierra (Ilja Friedel)
   4. Gates (Eric Yakel)
   5. Hiking Boots (shoes) (Eric Yakel)
   6. Re: d....hiking boots?? (Marshall Karon)
   7. Re: Contacts and....hiking boots?? (Edmond Meinfelder)
   8. More info on cell phones (MONTE ANN DODGE)
   9. ADZPCTKO (was Resupply Strategy California) (Bighummel@aol.com)
  10. Re: gates in the Sierra (dude)
  11. Re: Contacts and....hiking boots?? (Ken Powers)
  12. Re: hiking boots?? (Ddd51@aol.com)
  13. Re: Phones (John Mertes)
  14. FYI...PCT books (JAMES)
  15. re three sisters (JAMES)
  16. Re: hiking boots?? (Marshall Karon)
  17. Re: d....hiking boots?? (Gary Wright)
  18. Re: hiking boots?? (dude)
  19. Re: d....hiking boots?? (Edmond Meinfelder)
  20. Re: hiking boots?? (StoneDancer1@aol.com)
  21. Fwd: [pct-l] d....hiking boots?? (StoneDancer1@aol.com)
  22. OT - Christmas in Southern California (Jim Keener)
  23. RE: pct'04 planning (Ron Smith)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 22:53:19 -0800
From: "MONTE ANN DODGE" <montedodge@msn.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Phones
To: "pct-l" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <BAY3-DAV1232REgTizU00059873@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

 Phones are getting so small and hightech these days!! With all the new
phone rules changing and deals these days, I dug out my old analog phone
from 1996. The battery on this thing is bigger than most phones today!!! 
  Still, I think I may renew the service and and start carrying it as it now
a " Retro" piece of equipment. ( Which I am quite fond of) These phones also
carry the " Aniti-big brother Chip" which means it doesn't have one. ( GPS
chip) so if any drug dealers, gun owners, free thinkers or other enemies of
our new police state can use the phone knowing you are only being recorded
,but in an unknown location. ( If only they could just give us all a "
Zombie Pill" , all would be better.!)
    Of course all dark clouds have a Silver Lining.  The new " Spy chip "
which is in most phones built since 1998 has helped many lost or injured
hikers to be found.
   Jack Fair had the veneer of a old Coot ,but was crazy as a fox. I think
Jack was clear on many of his idea's about personal freedom and how selling
out your long term freedom for short time security is a big mistake. 
  On well, better a chip in your phone  than a chip in your skin! ( They
would never do that , would they???) TICFrom tkimmel2@hotmail.com  Sun Nov
30 13:15:56 2003
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Subject: [pct-l] Contacts and....hiking boots??
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As an inexperienced  hiker preparing for an '04 PCT thru-hike, I find my 
mind being consumed with hundres of questions that seem to exit my head 
shortly after entering.  I've recenetly decided to start writing these 
questions down regardless of how trivial they might be.  Anyways, here's a 
couple of things that I'm wondering about:

Contacts -  For those hiker's not blessed with 20 20 vision, what is the 
best way to handle optical assistance.  Are disposable contacts fairly 
common on the trail? I suppose picking up solution along the way is not too 
difficult?  Does proper sanitation become an  issue?  Do some people scrap 
the whole contact thing and just wear glasses?

Hiking Boots -  I've heard that some people prefer sneakers/running shoes 
over hiking boots?  What is the norm on the trail?  Does anyone reccomend 
certain brands?  I have a nice pair of REI boots but I'm not sure about 
durability and lifespan.  Typically how many pairs of shoes will a thu-hiker

go thru?


Thanks for all the help.....more questions to come.

Todd

_________________________________________________________________
Set yourself up for fun at home!  Get tips on home entertainment equipment, 
video game reviews, and more here.   
http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 13:26:23 -0600
From: "yogi yogi" <yogilists@hotmail.com>
Subject: [pct-l] contacts and hiking boots
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <Law15-F75EyBP39YP7g00024505@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

CONTACTS:  I wear disposable contacts.  I wear a pair for a month then get a

new set in a resupply box.  I also always carry one extra set of contacts in

my pack.  I take my contacts out every time I go into town.  If I just go 
into town to resupply and eat, I clean them out in the bathroom of a 
restaurant.  If I stay overnight in a hostel or motel, I take the contacts 
out overnight.  I never take them out on the trail.  I carry a small bottle 
of solution, contact case, and glasses in my pack.  Check out the 
travel-sized toiletries section of WalMart for a 2 oz bottle of Renu 
Multi-Purpose solution.  It's only $1.50.  I've only seen this sized bottle 
at WalMart.  Noplace else.

HIKING BOOTS:  Most PCT hikers wear running shoes.  Some hikers wear trail 
runners.  Very few hikers wear heavy boots.   Most of us will recommend 
running shoes.  They're lightweight, breathable, don't need to be broken in.

  New Balance running shoes are the most seen shoes on the trail.  On each 
of my PCT hikes, I used 6 pair of New Balance shoes.

Most of the PCT trail tread is free of roots and rocks.  So, you will be 
walking up and downhill, but the trail itself will be mostly flat----meaning

that there are not obstacles to turn your ankle on.  Running shoes work 
fine.

_________________________________________________________________
Set yourself up for fun at home!  Get tips on home entertainment equipment, 
video game reviews, and more here.   
http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx


------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 11:42:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Ilja Friedel <ilja@cs.caltech.edu>
Subject: [pct-l] gates in the Sierra
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID:
	<Pine.LNX.4.33L0.0311301140370.3552-100000@orchestra.cs.caltech.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hi,

on my last trips I had to cross primitive gates that blocked the trail
periodically. What are those gates good for? Are they supposed to stop
runaway horses?

Ilja.


------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 11:49:37 -0800
From: "Eric Yakel" <eyakel@earthlink.net>
Subject: [pct-l] Gates
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000c01c3b77b$17a18e70$c91ff4d8@David>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Yep, there for the packers.  You probably noticed that they put them in
places where their is usually no way around the gate, like a narrow defile.
The horses get away from the packers and want to go home.  The gates prevent
them from making it all the way back, so the packers don't have to walk all
the way out.  P.S.  That is also why they get P.O.'d
when the backpackers don't fasten them together.
                  Eric

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 11:54:21 -0800
From: "Eric Yakel" <eyakel@earthlink.net>
Subject: [pct-l] Hiking Boots (shoes)
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <001d01c3b77b$bfc82050$c91ff4d8@David>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Most of the folks wear a running shoe, trail running shoe, or very light
weight hiking boot.  My favorites are New Balance in the running and trail
running categories and Montrail in the lightweight boot category.  You'll go
through about 3-4 sets to do the entire trail.

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 12:41:24 -0800
From: "Marshall Karon" <m.karon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] d....hiking boots??
To: "todd kimmel" <tkimmel2@hotmail.com>,
	<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000e01c3b782$54598410$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Light weight trail runners are the way to go on the PCT (perhaps a light
weight book in the High Sierras during through hiking season). Get what
works for your foot. Although New Balance seem to be favorites (they come in
various widths), they aren't for everyone. I prefer Adidas. And,
unfortunately, each brand has numerous styles and they may not make the same
ones a month later. Make sure there is plenty of toe room. And, don't make
the mistake of buying all of your shoes in advance with the same size. I
guarantee your foot will expand and your size x won't fit any more.
Remember to fit while wearing the socks/insoles you intend to take. Note
that changing sock/insole thickness will give you some flexibility in
sizing. Many hikers shop along the way for something that fits. Better than
totally destroying your feet. You may not get the best price, but you will
get a shoe that fits your foot at that particular time.

Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "todd kimmel" <tkimmel2@hotmail.com>
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 11:15 AM
Subject: [pct-l] Contacts and....hiking boots??


> As an inexperienced  hiker preparing for an '04 PCT thru-hike, I find my
> mind being consumed with hundres of questions that seem to exit my head
> shortly after entering.  I've recenetly decided to start writing these
> questions down regardless of how trivial they might be.  Anyways, here's a
> couple of things that I'm wondering about:
>
> Contacts -  For those hiker's not blessed with 20 20 vision, what is the
> best way to handle optical assistance.  Are disposable contacts fairly
> common on the trail? I suppose picking up solution along the way is not
too
> difficult?  Does proper sanitation become an  issue?  Do some people scrap
> the whole contact thing and just wear glasses?
>
> Hiking Boots -  I've heard that some people prefer sneakers/running shoes
> over hiking boots?  What is the norm on the trail?  Does anyone reccomend
> certain brands?  I have a nice pair of REI boots but I'm not sure about
> durability and lifespan.  Typically how many pairs of shoes will a
thu-hiker
> go thru?
>
>
> Thanks for all the help.....more questions to come.
>
> Todd
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Set yourself up for fun at home!  Get tips on home entertainment
equipment,
> video game reviews, and more here.
> http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx
>
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> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
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------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 14:45:38 -0700
From: Edmond Meinfelder <edmond@mydogmeg.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Contacts and....hiking boots??
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20031130135723.0184d250@mail.mydogmeg.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

At 02:15 PM 11/30/2003 -0500, todd kimmel wrote:
>Contacts -  For those hiker's not blessed with 20 20 vision, what is the 
>best way to handle optical assistance.  Are disposable contacts fairly 
>common on the trail?

I knew only one person who wore contacts on the trail when I through hiked. 
Most wore glasses. This person had the ability to keep his contacts in for 
days longer than he should have without irritation. I don't recall anyone 
using disposable contacts.

>I suppose picking up solution along the way is not too difficult?

At the larger towns solution it is not an issue, but many of the most 
convenient resupply towns have little in the way of supplies.

>Hiking Boots -  I've heard that some people prefer sneakers/running shoes 
>over hiking boots?  What is the norm on the trail?  Does anyone reccomend 
>certain brands?  I have a nice pair of REI boots but I'm not sure about 
>durability and lifespan.  Typically how many pairs of shoes will a 
>thu-hiker go thru?

As many said, most wear low-cut running shoes or trail runners. New Balance 
is very popular for the running shoe devotees. In the desert, I enjoyed the 
New Balance 730 which has large vents. Your feet and socks get filthy, but 
stay cool and quickly dry. I also liked the Montrail trail runners and I 
currently like my pair of Merrel Baja Ventilators.

I saw a podiatrist recently and he seemed to think the pain along my 
metatarsals was caused by the flexible sole of the New Balance running 
shoes. He said the thick sole of most boots keeps the forefoot from flexing 
as much, removing some stress from the metatarsals. (Note: the metatarsals 
are the finger like bones in the foot and a stress fracture along the 2nd 
or 3rd metatarsal takes a few people off the trail every year.)

However, since my metatarsal pain went away once I got over-the-counter 
orthoses (Superfeet). I think the shape of my feet changed a bit during my 
hike and the Superfeet gave my arches the support they needed. Shortly 
after, my metatarsal pain went away.

Though many people suggest the high leather upper of a boot provides 
protection from twisted ankles, this is only partially true, if at all. If 
your knee goes one way and the your foot the other, you can still pull a 
tendon or ligament. However, the upper can restrict lateral (roll as 
opposed to both pitch and yaw) movement and possibly prevent a pull or tear 
that way. However, having strained my ankle both ways in boots with high 
uppers, it's not bulletproof protection. Perhaps you have to lace the boot 
tighter than I was willing to receive this protection. Still, thick-soled 
boots with a high uppers are nice for rugged (off-trail) terrain, deep snow 
and deep mud, but as Yogi said, it's not needed for the PCT's tread. Though 
you may post-hole in the High Sierra snow, you'll usually get your leg back 
with its running shoe.

I like trail runners myself, but have to use Superfeet with them to support 
my arches. My podiatrist may be right and some people may do better with a 
boot, but I'll gravitate towards lighter shoes for as long as I'm able.

Yet another opinion is at: http://staff.washington.edu/gcthomas/foot.html

Tangent 


------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 02:42:48 -0800
From: "MONTE ANN DODGE" <montedodge@msn.com>
Subject: [pct-l] More info on cell phones
To: "pct-l" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <BAY3-DAV20jQxzmWecm000657cc@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

 USA today says 20 million Americans still use analog cell phones which they
say the FCC will phase out in 5 years. According to them , 20.5 million
prefer analog over digital. Reasons are many, such as better quality sound,
privacy etc.
  Maybe 20 million americans are as crazy as Jack Fair and myself! Your GPS
tracking phone can help you in a fix in the outdoors, verify tyour PCT hike
if you have your phone with you and can tell Uncle Sam how many trips to
Safeway you made last year!! From yogilists@hotmail.com  Sun Nov 30 16:46:04
2003
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Subject: [pct-l] contacts
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I know many hikers who wear contacts while thru-hiking.  I've met hikers who

take them out each night, but most wear the disposable contacts.  They're no

more work than they are here at home.  Actually, I took my contacts out more

often while hiking than I do here at home.  That is because while 
thru-hiking, I took them out every night I spent in town, because I knew 
that I didn't want to take them out when I was sleeping on the trail.  Here 
at home, I have the opportunity to take them out every single night, so I 
put it off.

Contact solution is readily available in trail towns.  Even the smaller 
resupply stores have a small toiletry section (tylenol, calamine, 
toothpaste, shampoo) and many have contact solution.  It may not be the 
brand you're used to using, but you can definitely find some.  Tangent may 
not have seen contact solution in the stores because he may not have been 
looking for it.

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------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 20:28:27 -0500
From: Bighummel@aol.com
Subject: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO (was Resupply Strategy California)
To: StoneDancer1@aol.com, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <6386D17D.63175D5A.02257386@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

StoneDancer1 writes:

> I will drive by it on my way to ADZPCTKO this year and 
> have news.

At the next ADZPCTKO look for the message board which last year had the
schedule and site info along with much other tidbits of info.  It will have
a "Latest Trail Info" list there for anyone coming from points north on the
trail to post this type of info for the benefit of those hiking.

Best regards,

Greg
"Strider"
Hummel

ADZPCTKO Coordinator

------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 20:44:23 -0500 (EST)
From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] gates in the Sierra
To: ilja@cs.caltech.edu
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <3FCA9CF7.000057.76891@ns.interchange.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Its my understanding that the forest service leases grazing rights to 
some areas in the national forests to local ranchers and these gates 
are used to keep cattle and goats grazing in the proper area.  the 
forest service places restrictions on the grazing so that the 
wildlife is not severely damaged; the ranchers are allowed to let 
their livestock graze on certain areas at certain times of the year 
or whatever.  Some hiker I met on the trail in the Sierra told this 
to me, so I dunno how accurate it is, but it seems accurate to 
me.  ...especially after seeing both cattle and goats in the sierra 
near the gates.

peace,
dude




> Hi,
> 
> on my last trips I had to cross primitive gates that blocked the
> trail periodically. What are those gates good for? Are they
> supposed to stop runaway horses?
> 
> Ilja.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l

_________________________________________________________________
    http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians

------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 19:04:15 -0800
From: "Ken Powers" <kdpo@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Contacts and....hiking boots??
To: "todd kimmel" <tkimmel2@hotmail.com>,
	<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <006201c3b7b7$ce79e8e0$6501a8c0@pacbell.net>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Marcia wears gas permeable contacts on all our hikes. Shes carrys cleaning
solution and wetting/soaking solution. She cleans them in filtered and
boiled water every morning on the trail. She has had no problems on the
trails. Well one problem. She ran out of wetting/soaking solution near
Sisters.  Bob Nida played trail angel for us and brought a bottle of the
solution to us at Elk Lake jundtion. Here is the picture of our package:
http://home.pacbell.net/kdpo/pct/sisters.htm

We have worn trail runners on all 3 trails. Marcia goes through 4-5 pairs on
each trail - always New Balance. I go through 2-4 pairs - several brands,
but mostly New Balance. My first pair of NB 806's on the AT this year lasted
over 1400 miles and could have gone longer. We have a convenient place to
order and receive shoes and took advantage of it. We think the added weight
of the boots is as significant as the weight being carried on your back.
Maybe even important!

Continue sending in those questions. The discussion helps all the potential
hikers.

Ken
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "todd kimmel" <tkimmel2@hotmail.com>
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 11:15 AM
Subject: [pct-l] Contacts and....hiking boots??


> As an inexperienced  hiker preparing for an '04 PCT thru-hike, I find my
> mind being consumed with hundres of questions that seem to exit my head
> shortly after entering.  I've recenetly decided to start writing these
> questions down regardless of how trivial they might be.  Anyways, here's a
> couple of things that I'm wondering about:
>
> Contacts -  For those hiker's not blessed with 20 20 vision, what is the
> best way to handle optical assistance.  Are disposable contacts fairly
> common on the trail? I suppose picking up solution along the way is not
too
> difficult?  Does proper sanitation become an  issue?  Do some people scrap
> the whole contact thing and just wear glasses?
>
> Hiking Boots -  I've heard that some people prefer sneakers/running shoes
> over hiking boots?  What is the norm on the trail?  Does anyone reccomend
> certain brands?  I have a nice pair of REI boots but I'm not sure about
> durability and lifespan.  Typically how many pairs of shoes will a
thu-hiker
> go thru?
>
>
> Thanks for all the help.....more questions to come.
>
> Todd
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Set yourself up for fun at home!  Get tips on home entertainment
equipment,
> video game reviews, and more here.
> http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx
>
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l


------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 22:21:26 EST
From: Ddd51@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <59.516b06.2cfc0db6@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

In a message dated 11/30/2003 11:16:29 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
tkimmel2@hotmail.com writes:


> <A
HREF="mailto:pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net";>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net</A
>

I've been backpacking for over 30 years, including an AT through trip, and 
until this summer have always worn boots. Beginning last spring I switched
to 
trail running shoes. I did several prep hikes with a full pack over varying 
terrain and my feet felt fine. It was in 150 mile section hike form Ebbots
Pass to 
the Devil's Post Pile that I lost my faith in shoes. The north Yosemite 
section of the PCT is very rocky, and this type of surface hurt my feet. The
day 
before I entered Yosemite I did 18 miles, but between Dorothy Lake and Glenn

Ellen I quit early every day (10 miles) because my feet were sore. This may
be 
something that one can get used to or maybe its age (I'm 53) in either case
I 
plan I returning to boots.

DDD

------------------------------

Message: 13
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 16:50:22 -0800
From: John Mertes <jmertes@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Phones
To: MONTE ANN DODGE <montedodge@msn.com>
Cc: pct-l <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <3FCA904E.5000801@verizon.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Hey Monte,

I think the DoD is already working on a chip under the skin to record 
medical information and idenity, and who knows what else. Like most 
technological advances; threre are gains and losses.  For instance, 
medical history available immediately when a wounded person brought into 
a medical facility. OTOH, easier to keep track of one. Could open 
another opportunity in the black market -- identity chips removed.

John (writing in soggy Crescent City, CA)

> 
>  On well, better a chip in your phone  than a chip in your skin! ( They
would never do that , would they???) TIC
>
>  
>




------------------------------

Message: 14
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 21:38:56 -0800
From: JAMES <jas8313@adelphia.net>
Subject: [pct-l] FYI...PCT books
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20031201053755.PQXS1464.mta11.adelphia.net@sir-james>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

the following and other PCT books are available online at a discount.

		http://www.pcthiker.com/pages/pctstore.shtml -- thru
amazon.com

just click on the picture and it will take you to the amazon site...with a
lot more
books avail...

The Pacific Crest Trail: Oregon - Washington $17.47 
The Pacific Crest Trail: Northern California $13.97 
The Pacific Crest Trail: Southern California $13.97 
Pacific Crest Trail Data Book $7.99 
Pacific Crest Trail Town Guide $7.99 

also
Guide to the John Muir Trail $11.95 

free freight over $25.00 - the also have some used but do not know about
that freight.
my order is on the way with the town guide on backorder...

You Are Never Too Old To Begin A Thru Hike
SirJames from Southern California
Candidate ... PCT Class of 2008


------------------------------

Message: 15
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 22:54:25 -0800
From: JAMES <jas8313@adelphia.net>
Subject: [pct-l] re three sisters
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20031201065324.GVJZ1464.mta10.adelphia.net@sir-james>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Map of South Sister with the PCT on the left side


http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?lat=44.0912&lon=-121.7825&s=100&size=l&syms
how=n&u=6&datum=nad83&layer=DRG25

also see maps at   http://www.hikertrash.net/
You Are Never Too Old To Begin A Thru Hike
SirJames from Southern California
Candidate ... PCT Class of 2008


------------------------------

Message: 16
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 23:51:08 -0800
From: "Marshall Karon" <m.karon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??
To: <Ddd51@aol.com>, <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000a01c3b7df$e38d1590$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

I wouldn't indict all running shoes. Each shoe is different. Yours may not
have been right for your foot. Perhaps the insole wasn't right - didn't have
enough cushion. Perhaps the sole flexed too much, wasn't stiff enough. Boots
can destroy feet too. They certainly did that to my feet. Trail runners were
much better, but even some of those caused problems.

The only sections of the PCT I found that could be a problem were those with
sharp lava - like just north of McKenzie Pass in Oregon and also a short
section coming off the Hat Creek Rim.

Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.net

----- Original Message -----
From: <Ddd51@aol.com>
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 7:21 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??


> In a message dated 11/30/2003 11:16:29 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> tkimmel2@hotmail.com writes:
>
>
> > <A
HREF="mailto:pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net";>pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net</A
>
>
> I've been backpacking for over 30 years, including an AT through trip, and
> until this summer have always worn boots. Beginning last spring I switched
to
> trail running shoes. I did several prep hikes with a full pack over
varying
> terrain and my feet felt fine. It was in 150 mile section hike form Ebbots
Pass to
> the Devil's Post Pile that I lost my faith in shoes. The north Yosemite
> section of the PCT is very rocky, and this type of surface hurt my feet.
The day
> before I entered Yosemite I did 18 miles, but between Dorothy Lake and
Glenn
> Ellen I quit early every day (10 miles) because my feet were sore. This
may be
> something that one can get used to or maybe its age (I'm 53) in either
case I
> plan I returning to boots.
>
> DDD
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l


------------------------------

Message: 17
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 07:36:57 -0500
From: Gary Wright <radar2k2@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] d....hiking boots??
To: "Marshall Karon" <m.karon@comcast.net>
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net, todd kimmel <tkimmel2@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <0D11AD8E-23FB-11D8-93AF-000393964CB4@earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed


On Nov 30, 2003, at 3:41 PM, Marshall Karon wrote:
> Many hikers shop along the way for something that fits. Better than
> totally destroying your feet. You may not get the best price, but you 
> will
> get a shoe that fits your foot at that particular time.

I was working on the assumption that it was very difficult to find
any place on the PCT to purchase shoes and that I should plan on
ordering them by phone and having them sent to a mail drop.

Can anyone provide a short list of shoe-available resupply points?


------------------------------

Message: 18
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 10:15:15 -0500 (EST)
From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??
To: Ddd51@aol.com, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <3FCB5B03.000007.51872@ns.interchange.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I don't know why you had problems or what type of trail runners you 
wore.  I once mentioned to John Vonoff (author of "Fixing your Feet") 
that perhaps some people litterally are "tenderfeet", and he seemed 
to agree that people's feet are just build differently and some are 
more delicate than others.  OTOH, Ray Jardine (author of many long 
distance hiker books) seems to think that anyone can toughen their 
feet enough to thru-hike in running shoes.

Personally, I have done the section that you are talking about in 
running shoes twice.  Both times I wore plain ole' running shoes (not 
trail runners) and both times I had no problems covering 20+ miles 
per day.

I don't think age has much to do with it, as Jardine is in his 50's 
if I am not mistaken.

Sorry I don't have any answers for you.  All I can say I sthat I 
would never hike in boots again after getting used to running shoes 
for hiking (climbing is a totally different story).  But "to each his 
own" and what works for me might not work for you.  There is no right 
or wrong footwear.

peace,
dude




> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <Ddd51@aol.com>
> To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 7:21 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??
> 
> 
>> In a message dated 11/30/2003 11:16:29 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>> tkimmel2@hotmail.com writes:
>> 
>> 
>>> <A
> HREF="mailto:pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net";>pct-l@mailman.backcoun
> try.net</A
>> 
>> 
>> I've been backpacking for over 30 years, including an AT through
>> trip, and until this summer have always worn boots. Beginning
>> last spring I switched
> to
>> trail running shoes. I did several prep hikes with a full pack
>> over
> varying
>> terrain and my feet felt fine. It was in 150 mile section hike
>> form Ebbots
> Pass to
>> the Devil's Post Pile that I lost my faith in shoes. The north
>> Yosemite section of the PCT is very rocky, and this type of
>> surface hurt my feet.
> The day
>> before I entered Yosemite I did 18 miles, but between Dorothy
>> Lake and
> Glenn
>> Ellen I quit early every day (10 miles) because my feet were
>> sore. This
> may be
>> something that one can get used to or maybe its age (I'm 53) in
>> either
> case I
>> plan I returning to boots.
>> 
>> DDD
>> _______________________________________________
>> pct-l mailing list
>> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>> unsubscribe or change options:
>> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> 
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l

_________________________________________________________________
    http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians

------------------------------

Message: 19
Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 08:55:04 -0700
From: Edmond Meinfelder <edmond@mydogmeg.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] d....hiking boots??
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20031201082714.01762708@mail.mydogmeg.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

At 07:36 AM 12/1/2003 -0500, Gary Wright wrote:
>I was working on the assumption that it was very difficult to find
>any place on the PCT to purchase shoes and that I should plan on
>ordering them by phone and having them sent to a mail drop.

My feet went from size 11.5 to 13. I still wear 13s, but they are a looser 
fit than when I was on the trail. Unless you know how much your feet will 
grow and change shape, you may wish to buy your shoes as you go.

>Can anyone provide a short list of shoe-available resupply points?

Idyllwild - 1 small outfitter and 1 shoe store. Many people left with 
Hi-Tech shoes from the shoe store.
Big Bear - a small outfitter, had an okay selection
Ridgecrest (has a Big 5 Sporting Goods store with running shoes), hitch 
East at Walker Pass
Mammoth Lakes (a great selection in 2 outfitters)
South Lake Tahoe (many outfitters in the area and a Nike outlet store) - 
You may get lucky and find a friendly person going there from Echo Lake.
Shasta City (great selection at a few outfitters) - instead of Dunsmir 
(instead of Castella)
Quincy - 1 store with mediocre selection, hitch from Belden
Ashland - Great selection at 2 outfitters
Portland - REI and many, many outfitters, hitch from Cascade Locks

Others exist, these are just the places where I stopped and noticed shoes.

Tangent



------------------------------

Message: 20
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 11:29:25 EST
From: StoneDancer1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] hiking boots??
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <42.41e6f2e7.2cfcc665@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

In a message dated 12/1/2003 7:22:27 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
dude@fastmail.ca writes:
<<<<<  All I can say I sthat I would never hike in boots again after getting

used to running shoes  for hiking . >>>>>

Absolutely!!!!!!!!!
>>>>> There is no right or wrong footwear>>>>>

Only heavy or light footwear!! My New Balance 801's were fine for snow on
the 
Sierra passes this past June, and worked fine for a side trip to climb 
Matterhorn Peak, including moderate angle rock faces, scree and boulders (
although 
on ice they fared poorly).

No Way
Ray E

------------------------------

Message: 21
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 11:32:32 EST
From: StoneDancer1@aol.com
Subject: Fwd: [pct-l] d....hiking boots??
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <79.1dcf8d38.2cfcc720@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

In a message dated 12/1/2003 7:56:09 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
edmond@mydogmeg.net writes:
>>>>>My feet went from size 11.5 to 13. I still wear 13s, but they are a 
looser 
fit than when I was on the trail. Unless you know how much your feet will 
grow and change shape, you may wish to buy your shoes as you go.<<<<<

I have a wide size 10.5-11 foot.  I simply started out with 13EEEE and
Thorlo 
lightweight running socks.  I had neither blisters nor foot problems and 
simply grew into the larger shoes, thus alleviating the problem of trying to
get 
wide shoes while ontrail.

No Way
RayE

------------------------------

Message: 22
Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 09:55:44 -0800
From: Jim Keener <jkeener@pct04.com>
Subject: [pct-l] OT - Christmas in Southern California
To: Pacific Crest Trail <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <BBF0C09F.1AEB%jkeener@pct04.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

Greetings:

I'll be spending Christmas with relatives in Santa Monica, California and
want to spend a couple of nights backpacking in the area or on the way back
to the Bay Area. Ideas?

Peace,
Jim

http://pct04.com



------------------------------

Message: 23
Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2003 09:53:25 -0800
From: "Ron Smith" <ronyon@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] pct'04 planning
To: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <004e01c3b834$05284040$6501a8c0@SMITHMOBILE>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="US-ASCII"

The Canadian are usually more friendly. A couple of times upon
re-entering the U.S. on foot, we also stopped at the Canadian station
and loaded up on confiscated fruit, which they were happy to give to us.
-Ron
> 
> On the CDT we had a bad time getting back into the US. We crossed the
day
> before they were closing Chief Mtn for the winter. We had already
cleaned
> up
> as much as possible - laundry and showers. Caught a ride to the border
and
> bravely walked up to the US border crossing station. Two guards came
out.
> Their first words were "Passports, Please." I think we fooled them
when we
> promptly pulled out both our passports. They examined the passports
and
> our...
> Ken


------------------------------

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End of pct-l Digest, Vol 8, Issue 1
***********************************