[pct-l] Milage Question

[msaenz at mve-architects.com (Mike Saenz)]

Ooooooo....sounds ominous.
But that would account for the mileage discrepancy: lots of meandering and the feeling like you're getting nowhere...

I'm planning on getting out to the trail tomorrow, but there's a slight chance that I won't actually do any miles until Saturday...
I need to get to the monument on S1 by Cuyamaca, cross the pasture to get to where I left The Trail last month, and head down towards The Borrego and Scissors. I may be facing a 25 mile day. I'm hoping that the fact that scissors is all downhill from where I'll start and that I'll have an early start, that the final climb into up Grapevine Mountain at the end of the day will be more do-able. It'll be an epic hike! But I'll do it solo, at my own pace, and should make decent time.

A more forgiving ridge/contour walk into Warner Springs on Sunday sounds more palatable.

It's gonna be a two-can celebration in Warner Springs on Sunday!
I'm gonna celebrate the completion of my first 100 miles and my first 50 mile weekend!
Feel free, all of you, to show up and help celebrate!!!


M i c h a e l   S a e n z
McLarand Vasquez Emsiek & Partners, Inc.
A r c h i t e c t u r e    P l a n n i n g    I n t e r i o r s
w  w  w  .  m  v  e  -  a  r  c  h  i  t  e  c  t  s  .  c  o  m

 -----Original Message-----
From: 	Ken Powers [mailto:kdpo@pacbell.net] 
Sent:	Thursday, March 04, 2004 10:36 AM
To:	Mike Saenz; Bill Jeffrey; PCT Mail List (E-mail)
Subject:	Re: [pct-l] Milage Question

My memory of that portion of the trail:
As Yogi says the trail after Scissors is a climb. Made worse by the fact
that you need to carry lots of water up the hill. But after the trail
reaches the top, the trail designers went out of their way to keep the trail
level. The trail wanders in and out of the washes along that stretch, always
at the same level. It becomes frustrating at times because you feel like you
are not getting anywhere. I think the guide mentions that feeling also. So
the answer to the comment below is lots of meandering, but not much grade
change after the initial climb.

I remember we camped near the gate where you can drop down to a ranch for
water. There was a water cache at the gate, but we were behind a large group
of hikers. The cache was dry. We were low on water, but decided we could
make Barrel Springs the next morning before it got hot. As I remember that
gate was quite a ways from Scissors though - close to half way between
Scissors and Barrel Springs.
Ken
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Saenz" <msaenz@mve-architects.com>
To: "Bill Jeffrey" <wjj2001@yahoo.com>; "PCT Mail List (E-mail)"
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 9:58 AM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Milage Question


Yes, and as "David hiking PCNST in bits [pcnst2001@oakapple.net]" wrote:
"Trust the data book (where Asabat got his numbers) not the Topo software."

I believe this discussion has been  hashed, re-hashed and served up with
grits before.

An as I added to the recipe before: "I've experienced about a 2% error
(short) on average on my hikes" but 37% error???

BTW- As a crow flys, it's 16.89 miles. That would suggest a DOUBLING of
mileage due to meandering turns in the trail.

The Trail through the San Felipe Hills must do a tremendous amount of tight
switchbacking and steep grade differentials to account for that kind of
error rate. I will assume a longer walk than anticipated and verify it with
my GPS. I'll give a definative report next Monday!

Sandy Flat about 8 miles up. Thanks for the tip! I'll look for it.

-Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Jeffrey [mailto:wjj2001@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 9:27 AM
To: Mike Saenz; PCT Mail List (E-mail)
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Milage Question


Mapping software does not pick up all the twists and turns in the trail. I
usually find them off about 10%. Your mileage is off much more.

Scissors to Barrel Spring is about 24 miles.
Barrel Spring to Warner Springs (south junction) is about 8 miles.
South to north junctions is another 3 or so.
Total (from memory) is 35 miles.

The good news is that Barrel Springs to the road just north of Warner
Springs is pretty easy walking.

Probably the best typical camping in the San Felipes is the sandy flat
mentioned in the guide, I think about 8 miles up. Protected from wind by
scrubby junipers IIRC. There are some spectacular pads for single tents at a
few spots on the ridge walk, but could be windy.

AsABat


Mike Saenz wrote:

I'm perplexed!

My Topo software calculates the distance from Scissors Crossing to the north
crossing of Warner Springs at 25.7 miles.

On AsABat's water site, Scissors is indicated at mile 77.7 and the north
crossing at Warner Springs at mile 112.4....
If my math skills serve me well, that's 34.7 miles....

An additional 9 miles could mean the difference of a triumphant stroll into
town and a head-to-the-trail, grunt death-march....
Not to mention that I'm trying to locate the water caches by mileage...

Anyone care to shed some light on this?

Also, trying to plan my campsite in the San Felipes. Does anyone recall any
particularly pleasant spots, say...5 miles or so north of Scissors? Are
there any trees in this area? Any nice, flat, sandy spots? With a view? Near
a bar? (ha! While I'm at it, with a jacuzzi tub too???!!!!) no, I'm not
picky about my campsites.... ;)


M i c h a e l S a e n z
McLarand Vasquez Emsiek & Partners, Inc.
A r c h i t e c t u r e P l a n n i n g I n t e r i o r s
w w w . m v e - a r c h i t e c t s . c o m
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