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[pct-l] RE: Thermo-lite reflective blanket
- Subject: [pct-l] RE: Thermo-lite reflective blanket
- From: Paul.C.Griffith at bankofamerica.com (Griffith, Paul C)
- Date: Sun Sep 14 12:17:30 2003
Rik's looking for a reflective shield to rest under during the day. Do a search on "adventure medical" and thermo-lite. They make a 5 by 7 foot reflective survival blanket that is much tougher than the 2 oz mylar blankets, but lighter than the 12 oz space blankets. They weigh 6.5 oz. I've got a bivy bag they make of the same stuff, but a simple blanket would be more useful. It could be sun-shade, tarp tent, even a rain-jacket wrapped around the shoulders. REI doesn't stock it, but search the web. It's about $10. I could see hiking the PCT with nothing but if the weather was generally good.
-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 10:00 AM
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Subject: pct-l Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Bear Killed in Section D (Lonetrail@aol.com)
2. How to avoid bears (Brian Bowlsby)
3. Re: Re: Bear Killed in Section D (Ilja Friedel)
4. Bear at Little Jimmy (dsaufley@sprynet.com)
5. Re: Bear Killed in Section D (RJC)
6. Re: Tarptent in heavy rain (Steve Setzer)
7. Re: How to avoid bears (dude)
8. Re: Tarptent in heavy rain (Bighummel@aol.com)
9. Re: How to avoid bears (Sean Crookham)
10. RE: How to avoid bears (judson)
11. Re: Bear Killed in Section D (Brick Robbins)
12. Heat Protection (Richard Hare)
13. Re: Bear Killed in Section D (Christopher Willett)
14. Re: Heat Protection (Christopher Willett)
15. RE: Heat Protection (Richard Hare)
16. Re: Heat Protection (Marshall Karon)
17. Re: Heat Protection (wandering_bob@msn.com)
18. Titanium Bear Canister (Lisa Miller)
19. RE: Titanium Bear Canister (Mark Verber)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 14:44:55 EDT
From: Lonetrail@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bear Killed in Section D
To: brick@fastpack.com, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <f7.3020850a.2c90cb27@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Brick
I spend about 4 days out of a month in the Angeles. Brick your are right
about the structure of the Angeles trash containers are the most flimsy. I often
see were bears have opened them and have trash all over the place. Last weekend
I seem picnickers large families of thirty or more all over the whole picnic
area. I got there around 5 PM it looked like a war zone. They have no respect
for our forest, trash everywhere. The remnants of barbecue bones, paper cups,
plates, cans on the ground.and left there. The trash containers all full and
trash piled around. Our parks are becoming dumps because of the large number of
family of thirty or more. A limit should be enforced and perhaps we and the
bear could again live together.
The rangers seem to be a little trigger happy. Last year they shot a mountain
lion who was caught in a wooden fence. They could have tranquilized the lion.
Within the last several months they had several mocha young men on TV saying
they had a wrestling match with bears for there food. So they shot the bear.
If a bear wants my food let him take it. Then the TV man with his eyes full of
flurry and hate saying "track down and kill that bear for our children
safety." Who was here first the bear or us. Yet we keep building and building for the
10 million increase in population.
lonetrail
> I would venture to guess that the "trash can" used was one of the "critter
> resistant" type that are common in the Angeles Forest. It is not
> unreasonable for a thru hiker to assume that a critter resistant Gov't
> provided trash can in a campground would keep any local problem bears out.
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 12:01:54 -0700
From: Brian Bowlsby <BrianBowlsby@ieice.com>
Subject: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
To: "'pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net'" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID:
<A00B28CCEC72D711A4A80003470C5EBF0FA625@pdx-mail.ieice.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
In my experience and practice, there are two ways to avoid bears in the
Sierra. The first one is don't camp in Yosemite! The second, is when you
have to camp in bear infested areas such as Yosemite, stealth camping is the
only way to avoid bears. It's not 100% foolproof, but works most of the
time.
Bears have a very sensitive sense of smell. But I think, most of the time,
it's not a matter of the bear smelling your food, but that the bear knows
where to find the food!
Bears are smart and they know where the established campsites are that
people use on a nightly basis. So, they come by every night to the same
campsites hoping to find some improperly stored food. And if I had to
guess, I'd say they probably find a lot of it, especially from the average
weekend hikers, who seem to be a little more carefree about their food,
since losing it to a bear would have less impact to them than it would for a
thru-hiker!
I recently stayed a night in the infamous Lyell Canyon in Yosemite during my
JMT thru-hike, (the one the guidebook says not to camp in if you want to
keep your food!) and had no bears. I stayed in a beautiful stealth camp
overlooking the canyon about 200 yds off the trail, fully expecting to see
bears that night, but didn't.
I used the stealth camping method for the entire JMT and only had bears in
my camp the first night, in Yosemite between Half dome and Sunrise. In that
area it's hard to get away from other campers and established campsites so
proper food storage is essential!
Along the JMT, some of our fellow thru-hikers who were staying in
established campsites had bear encounters only 1/4 mile away from where our
stealth camps were. If bears can smell a dead deer 3 miles away, they could
surely smell our food 1/4 mile away right? Why didn't we have bears in our
camp then?
Brian Bowlsby
PCT 2004
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 13:26:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ilja Friedel <ilja@cs.caltech.edu>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Re: Bear Killed in Section D
To: Jim Keener <jkeener@pct04.com>
Cc: Pacific Crest Trail <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID:
<Pine.LNX.4.33L0.0309101314001.19585-100000@orchestra.cs.caltech.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi Jim,
> I've read Tom's instructions for getting ten days food in a canister. The
> food he lists isn't food I want to eat for ten days. So far, the best I've
> been able to do is get six days food in a Bearikade Weekender.
I'm back from a ten day trip with my dad on the southern part of the JMT.
We packed 2500 calories per person and day and still had some food left.
(Expected 12 days.) Here is what we packed:
4.5kg couscous
1.5kg cashews and pecanuts
0.5kg raisins etc.
0.9kg dried apple rings
1.2kg instant pudding (shake with water for a thick drink)
0.5l olive oil
1.4kg potatoe soup
0.5kg string cheese
1.0kg granola bars
0.3kg bread mix (for one bread)
0.4kg mousse au chocolat (the only designated backpacker food)
0.6kg spices, salt, buillon cubes, rehydration mix
======
13.3kg
We supplemented with trout and mushrooms. THe bear cans weight (full) was
18 and 16 pounds. We also carried food for the first day outside of the
cans. The trick is to repackage everything in loose bags (I don't like
ziplock bags anymore. Just use the 1 gallon bread bags and close with
ties.)
At the end of the trip we where sick of the couscous. But I kept enough of
the yummy stuff (bread mix, mousse, apple rings) for the Whitney ascent.
Here some images:
http://www.cs.caltech.edu/~ilja/img/HighSierra2003/
I've lost 8-9 pounds during the trip, my dad didn't lose any weight.
Ilja.
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 13:33:09 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
From: dsaufley@sprynet.com
Subject: [pct-l] Bear at Little Jimmy
To: bighummel@aol.com, pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<7672039.1063225989422.JavaMail.root@wamui09.slb.atl.earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Greg,
I am so sad to read your post about "my" bear. I've been hearing about its campground rummaging for the past few years, and there has been a progression of frequency and intensity of its activities, especially this year. In most accounts of this bear's hauntings, it was targeting folks who were NOT thru-hiking, but other campers who were up there exhibiting unsafe food and storage practices. None of them were stealth camping, so food was being prepared and stored there.
I was afraid that the bear was killed in the fires last year, and was actually glad to hear that it was back with its antics. I wonder if the fires destroyed its natural sources of food, making the campground more important in its search for sustenance. I can only hope its demise was swift and humane, since humans (in general) are to blame for what's happened.
It's funny how we all hear Tom's passionate admonitions.
-=Donna Saufley=-
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 13:45:48 -0700
From: RJC <calliger@infolane.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bear Killed in Section D
To: Bighummel@aol.com, pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID: <v03130301bb84d9d0d5a3@[66.242.169.245]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>U.S. Forest Service spokeswoman Gail Wright said throwing rocks at bears is
>not behavior officials recommend.
>>>>>
>
\
On the official USFS, attached flyer, to my official JMT permit this year
reads in part: quoted:
"...throw rocks at the bear.."
Richard
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 16:09:56 -0600 (MDT)
From: Steve Setzer <Steven.Setzer@Colorado.EDU>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Tarptent in heavy rain
To: henry shires <hshires@jps.net>
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.53.0309101553380.8425@ooze.Colorado.EDU>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
After much debate, I still think the Tarptent is the best option out there
for a PCT thru-hike (for me anyway). Other tarps are lacking the bug
protection. Thanks for the info about wearing nylon shells and bug screen
head nets to sleep but that's not for me. I don't think I could sleep
with a head net on. Plus I like the ease of setup with the Tarptent. But
the one-person Virga is more for one small person. I would suggest to
anyone who may be thinking about getting a Tarptent to get the two person
Squall. With the extra 4oz. its still lighter than any other tarp that
has bug protection (at least as far as I know). Plus there's extra room
in case you get lucky on the trail! :) Thanks Henry, I think I will
upgrade to the Squall.
I debated going back to a tent and I think the Helliberg Akto is probably
the best lightweight tent out there (again, that's my opinion). But its
3.75 pounds and I don't want to carry the extra weight. That's a lot of
snickers bars.
Later all,
Steve
PCT 2004
On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, henry shires wrote:
> Hi Steve,
>
> I will be the first to admit that the Virga would be pretty confining at
> 6'2" and that you would need to get a bit creative to sit up, get dressed,
> and weather heavy rains. As for headroom, you might try a trekking pole or
> placing a rock under the front pole to gain a few additional inches. That's
> certainly what I do. In heavy rain, the key is, as you discovered, to pin
> the netting to the ground with rocks. The netting is sewn into the back
> corner webbing so actually you just need a well-placed rock in each front
> corner and one place along each long side. On Virgas with sewn-in flooring
> it's much less of an issue--the netting is held in place--but the netting is
> certainly free to move on the floorless model. The other rain defense,
> especially in a strong side wind/rain, is to lower the sidewalls as needed
> until you stop the splash.
>
> As I wrote you privately, I would be happy to exchange your Virga for a
> Squall. It's 4 ounces heavier but much, much roomier and will certainly
> accommodate your height/weight requirements without any danger of rain
> splash or wall contact. Anyone else out there with similar circumstances is
> welcome to contact me for an exchange.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Henry Shires
> Tarptent
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:17:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <3F5FA313.000141.01176@ns.interchange.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
is it already time to re-hash the bear issue again? :-)
_________________________________________________________________
http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:48:53 EDT
From: Bighummel@aol.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Tarptent in heavy rain
To: Steven.Setzer@Colorado.EDU, hshires@jps.net
Cc: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <68.3499137f.2c910455@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 9/10/2003 3:10:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
Steven.Setzer@Colorado.EDU writes:
> I debated going back to a tent and I think the Helliberg Akto is probably
> the best lightweight tent out there (again, that's my opinion). But its
> 3.75 pounds and I don't want to carry the extra weight. That's a lot of
> snickers bars.
>
I am still using a SD Starflight made in the 1970's. Perhaps you have seen
it at the ADZ. It is a two person, none free standing, coffin-shaped
footprint, steep pyramid design with only two poles. The design is exceptionally
strong in wind and sheds snow like a 4 season tent. I can sit up in it, and that
is saying quite a bit if you have ever met me. I have replaced the large
diameter aluminum poles with aluminum arrow shafts and replaced the original
aluminum stakes with lighter weight aluminum ones. Total weight with fly, stakes
and tyvek ground sheet is 3.5 pounds as modified. When it finally gives out I
plan to take it apart at the seams and use it as a design to remake it using
1.1 oz nylon and silnylon. I will wager that it will come in under 3 pounds at
that point. If I can figure out how to use trekking poles instead of the
arrow shafts I could drop some more weight.
However, since using a Hennessey Hammock I am not sure that I will ever carry
a tent again. Being able to use trekking poles to set up the rain fly like a
tarp makes this a flexible, light weight and incredibly comfortable option,
IMHO. 2.5 lbs. total weight, no ground sheet, half of a sleeping pad and
thinner, camp anywhere with trees, no flat ground required. This is the ultimate
Leave-No-Trace as the only thing that sits on the ground is your pack and you
don't have to clear any space for it as you would if you slept on the ground.
IMHO,
Greg
P.S. Go Buffaloes!
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 16:35:42 -0700
From: "Sean Crookham" <scrookham@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <Law15-F76WN1EJCtwZH00045d39@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
I'm used to hikinng with my Garcia and am strongly considering using it on
my entire thru-hike. At least I can protect some of my food by other means
than hanging it. Besides, the cannister makes a great camp chair!
Tick
>From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
>To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
>Subject: Re: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
>Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:17:55 -0400 (EDT)
>
>is it already time to re-hash the bear issue again? :-)
>_________________________________________________________________
> http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians
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------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:22:17 -0700
From: "judson" <judsonb@internetcds.com>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
To: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>, <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <NGBBKNGKGLFBBIOBNCFDIEEMCCAA.judsonb@internetcds.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Lets get a government grant to train all the bears. Then they can carry our
packs for us. Perhaps Homeland Security can use them for border patrol.
-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net
[mailto:pct-l-bounces@mailman.backcountry.net]On Behalf Of dude
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 3:18 PM
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Subject: Re: [pct-l] How to avoid bears
is it already time to re-hash the bear issue again? :-)
_________________________________________________________________
http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 23:33:14 -0700
From: Brick Robbins <brick@fastpack.com>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bear Killed in Section D
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20030910230854.044e46f0@fastpack.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 12:31 PM 9/10/03, Bighummel@aol.com wrote:
>Good points, particularly the one about whether it is the agency's fault
>for not providing bear-proof trash cans.
If the trash cans are ready sources of food, then whether or not the
thru-hiker carries a Garcia can becomes immaterial. The bears come to the
campgrounds for the trash cans anyway.
> I think that Tom's (and quickly becoming my own) bottom line is that
> thru-hikers are looked up to by the weekend crowd and as such can make a
> big difference in actual situations as well as in image by being extra
> careful with their food.
I think both you and Tom over estimate the importance of the thru-hiker
crowd. Most forest users don't even know there is a PCT, let alone whackos
that hike the whole thing in a year. The ones who **ARE** aware of
thru-hikers are not the ones who are causing the problems anyway, because
they are the educated ones.
Worrying about thru-hikers causing behavioral changes in the bears is a bit
like fighting thru-riders for the damage their horses do to the trail
tread. There simply aren't enough thru riders to do measurable damage. The
horse damage is caused the pack outfits that use the same section of trail
day after day.
The bear problems are caused by the weekenders in the Sierra, and by the
day users in the Angeles. There are only a couple of hundred thru-hikers,
and many of them don't make it to the Sierra, and those that do are too
early for most of the bears. There are thousands of weekenders backpacking
in prime season in the Sierra, and tens of thousands of day users in the
Angeles.
By and large, thru hikers are some of the most savvy backpackers. This
effort to "enforce" bear cans on them is a knee jerk reaction to what is
really a non-problem. The effort would probably be better spent elsewhere.
Just like the anti-horse people would be better off focusing on the
commercial pack outfits that abuse the trails, rather than the occasional
recreational long distance rider.
All IMHO of course. HYOH
--
Brick Robbins
The important things are always simple.
The simple things are always hard.
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 13:17:36 +0100
From: "Richard Hare" <richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
Subject: [pct-l] Heat Protection
To: "PCT - list" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <MABBJFHGDBJOLFPDFPKNMEKIDAAA.richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi
During a recent heatwave, I rigged by tarp in the garden and sat beneath it.
The super thin 1.1oz silnylon offered very little protection from the heat,
it's also kind of transulucent. Does anyone think it would be worth my
while rigging a mylar space blancket over the top of the tarp for the
desert? I am intending to sit out the heat of the day whenever possible, and
reakon I would probably need to use 2 at 2 oz each, is this a worthwhile
weight to take? I had not intended to use a space blanket for anything else.
Regards
Rik
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 07:28:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Christopher Willett <chwillet@indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bear Killed in Section D
To: Brick Robbins <brick@fastpack.com>
Cc: pct-l@backcountry.net
Message-ID:
<Pine.GSO.3.96.1030911072814.12130B-100000@ariel.ucs.indiana.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
I believe the trash can was supposed to be an animal proof one, not like
the one I put out on my steps on Monday mornings. How the bear got in,
I do not know.
Chris
On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Brick Robbins wrote:
> At 08:51 AM 9/10/03, Bighummel@aol.com wrote:
> >chwillet@indiana.edu writes:
> >
> > > The random dude put his food
> > > in the trash can, but the bear promptly retrieved it and kept it.
> >
> >Did his actions early in the season condition the bear to cause the "vicious"
> >attacks later in the hiking season? Very and highly possible.
> >
> >This is exactly what Tom Reynolds has been raging about for the past several
> >years; that early thru-hiker laziness with their food can and has led
> >bears to
> >be conditioned to seek out human food in anything that smells like humans.
>
>
> I would venture to guess that the "trash can" used was one of the "critter
> resistant" type that are common in the Angeles Forest. It is not
> unreasonable for a thru hiker to assume that a critter resistant Gov't
> provided trash can in a campground would keep any local problem bears out.
>
> However, the trash cans I've seen in Angeles don't look nearly as robust as
> the ones I see in Yosemite, so I'd have to assume that Angeles is not setup
> to deal with problem bears. Was the problem thru-hiker laziness, or Gov't
> negligence?
>
> Any way, despite Tom's rantings, the ratio of Thru Hikers to weekenders is
> such that the weekender's actions have MUCH more impact on the human
> interaction with the wildlife. (yes, I know that every little bit hurts,
> but fixing 0.001% of the problem usually doesn't fix much...)
>
> Strider, I bet that this post would start Tom ranting about the need to
> carry a bear can starting from Mexico, since we do have bears as far south
> as Mt Laguna now.... I've seen tracks around Lake Cuyamacca,
>
> They killed one near Julian last year, but for raiding houses, not tents,
> which is not behaviour that Tom could blame on the scofflaw thru hikers...
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
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>
>
>
----------------------
Christopher Willett
Department of Mathematics
Indiana University
831 East Third Street
Bloomington, IN. 47405-7106
(812)-855-6737
chwillet@indiana.edu
php.indiana.edu/~chwillet
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 07:49:46 -0500 (EST)
From: Christopher Willett <chwillet@indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Heat Protection
To: Richard Hare <richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
Cc: PCT - list <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID:
<Pine.GSO.3.96.1030911074757.12130F-100000@ariel.ucs.indiana.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
There were only one or two places along the 700 miles in SoCal that I
could not find some shade to sit in. I never had to sit out the heat of
the day, and only in the aquaduct crossing in section E and the walk from
the river to the tunnel under the freeway near Agua Dulce was shade very
scarce. But, if you are used to the UK heat, this might not be a bad
idea.
On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Richard Hare wrote:
> Hi
>
> During a recent heatwave, I rigged by tarp in the garden and sat beneath it.
> The super thin 1.1oz silnylon offered very little protection from the heat,
> it's also kind of transulucent. Does anyone think it would be worth my
> while rigging a mylar space blancket over the top of the tarp for the
> desert? I am intending to sit out the heat of the day whenever possible, and
> reakon I would probably need to use 2 at 2 oz each, is this a worthwhile
> weight to take? I had not intended to use a space blanket for anything else.
>
> Regards
>
> Rik
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
> http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
>
>
----------------------
Christopher Willett
Department of Mathematics
Indiana University
831 East Third Street
Bloomington, IN. 47405-7106
(812)-855-6737
chwillet@indiana.edu
php.indiana.edu/~chwillet
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:12:39 +0100
From: "Richard Hare" <richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Heat Protection
To: "Christopher Willett" <chwillet@indiana.edu>
Cc: PCT - list <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <MABBJFHGDBJOLFPDFPKNKEKJDAAA.richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks Chris
I might just keep it in for those sections you mention then send it on! I
heard about the man who charges 'fence painting' for shade and thought a
bit of shaded portable real estate might be a valuable asset on the trail!
Rik
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Willett [mailto:chwillet@indiana.edu]
> Sent: 11 September 2003 13:50
> To: Richard Hare
> Cc: PCT - list
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Heat Protection
>
>
> There were only one or two places along the 700 miles in SoCal that I
> could not find some shade to sit in. I never had to sit out the heat of
> the day, and only in the aquaduct crossing in section E and the walk from
> the river to the tunnel under the freeway near Agua Dulce was shade very
> scarce. But, if you are used to the UK heat, this might not be a bad
> idea.
>
> On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Richard Hare wrote:
>
> > Hi
> >
> > During a recent heatwave, I rigged by tarp in the garden and
> sat beneath it.
> > The super thin 1.1oz silnylon offered very little protection
> from the heat,
> > it's also kind of transulucent. Does anyone think it would be worth my
> > while rigging a mylar space blancket over the top of the tarp for the
> > desert? I am intending to sit out the heat of the day whenever
> possible, and
> > reakon I would probably need to use 2 at 2 oz each, is this a
> worthwhile
> > weight to take? I had not intended to use a space blanket for
> anything else.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Rik
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pct-l mailing list
> > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > unsubscribe or change options:
> > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ----------------------
> Christopher Willett
> Department of Mathematics
> Indiana University
> 831 East Third Street
> Bloomington, IN. 47405-7106
> (812)-855-6737
> chwillet@indiana.edu
> php.indiana.edu/~chwillet
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 06:23:26 -0700
From: "Marshall Karon" <m.karon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Heat Protection
To: "PCT - list" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <000401c37867$e26f5ea0$6401a8c0@YOUR357898FF1F>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
A lot of people take an umbrella and use a Mylar space blanket to cover it
for extra sun-blocking protection. It is a bit of a nuisance (make that big)
to attach it to the umbrella, but it will work. Then you can hike some of
the time during the day.
Otherwise, I would not think of pitching a tent during the day. You will
find shade of some type, although you may need to hike a while to find it.
Another use for the space blank is as a ground cloth inside a tent. That is
the only thing I use now. It is a bit slippery, but at less than 2 ounces, I
find it works perfectly.
Marshall Karon
Portland, OR
m.karon@comcast.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Hare" <richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>
To: "Christopher Willett" <chwillet@indiana.edu>
Cc: "PCT - list" <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 6:12 AM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Heat Protection
> Thanks Chris
> I might just keep it in for those sections you mention then send it on! I
> heard about the man who charges 'fence painting' for shade and thought a
> bit of shaded portable real estate might be a valuable asset on the trail!
>
> Rik
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Christopher Willett [mailto:chwillet@indiana.edu]
> > Sent: 11 September 2003 13:50
> > To: Richard Hare
> > Cc: PCT - list
> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Heat Protection
> >
> >
> > There were only one or two places along the 700 miles in SoCal that I
> > could not find some shade to sit in. I never had to sit out the heat of
> > the day, and only in the aquaduct crossing in section E and the walk
from
> > the river to the tunnel under the freeway near Agua Dulce was shade very
> > scarce. But, if you are used to the UK heat, this might not be a bad
> > idea.
> >
> > On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Richard Hare wrote:
> >
> > > Hi
> > >
> > > During a recent heatwave, I rigged by tarp in the garden and
> > sat beneath it.
> > > The super thin 1.1oz silnylon offered very little protection
> > from the heat,
> > > it's also kind of transulucent. Does anyone think it would be worth
my
> > > while rigging a mylar space blancket over the top of the tarp for the
> > > desert? I am intending to sit out the heat of the day whenever
> > possible, and
> > > reakon I would probably need to use 2 at 2 oz each, is this a
> > worthwhile
> > > weight to take? I had not intended to use a space blanket for
> > anything else.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > >
> > > Rik
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > pct-l mailing list
> > > pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> > > unsubscribe or change options:
> > > http://mailman.hack.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------
> > Christopher Willett
> > Department of Mathematics
> > Indiana University
> > 831 East Third Street
> > Bloomington, IN. 47405-7106
> > (812)-855-6737
> > chwillet@indiana.edu
> > php.indiana.edu/~chwillet
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> pct-l mailing list
> pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
> unsubscribe or change options:
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------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 08:05:51 -0700
From: wandering_bob@msn.com
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Heat Protection
To: "Richard Hare" <richard@hare22.demon.co.uk>, "PCT List Forum"
<PCT-L@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <BAY4-DAV8461LEdyt3c00036a0a@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
In section F Mojave to Walker Pass), we secured our big space blankets (the heavier 5x7 type with one colored side and one mylar) from a convenient Joshua tree and lay on our closed cell foam pads to escape the heat of the day. We also rigged our umbrellas in the same tree for additional shade. It worked great.
One caveat: Joshua tree leaves are long, hard, spear-like critters with a really sharp tip. Watch yourself or they'll spear you. Those tips break off in your skin and it can be a challenge getting them back out. Also, you aren't the only desert creature seeking shade under those trees so look around carefully before you just plop your self down. Not all rattlers are so courteous as to give warnings.
Wandering Bob
----- Original Message -----
Wrom: CUFPEGAUTFJMVRE
To: PCT - list
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 5:17 AM
Subject: [pct-l] Heat Protection
Hi
During a recent heatwave, I rigged by tarp in the garden and sat beneath it.
The super thin 1.1oz silnylon offered very little protection from the heat,
it's also kind of transulucent. Does anyone think it would be worth my
while rigging a mylar space blancket over the top of the tarp for the
desert? I am intending to sit out the heat of the day whenever possible, and
reakon I would probably need to use 2 at 2 oz each, is this a worthwhile
weight to take? I had not intended to use a space blanket for anything else.
Regards
Rik
_______________________________________________
pct-l mailing list
pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
unsubscribe or change options:
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------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 13:37:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lisa Miller <arwenita@yahoo.com>
Subject: [pct-l] Titanium Bear Canister
To: pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net
Message-ID: <20030909203724.23747.qmail@web10504.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I happened upon the question about a Titanium Bear Canister while doing a web search. This reply may actually start a new thread rather than follow the old one, but I do have some info about such a canister. The NPS office in Sequoia National Park had a Titanium bear canister in their rental options when I was there a couple years ago. I wrote down the company phone number and name, and don't know where that info is at the moment. If I recall correctly the name of the company was Bear-ikaid or something like that. I've never managed to find it listed on the internet, but you might call the Sequoia Park office and see if you can get info. It's the office closest to the Giant Forest..think it's the main office. I think it cost about $300. Hope that helps.
---------------------------------
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Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bear Killed... (clueless hikers)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 12:01:31 -0400 (EDT)
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> I think both you and Tom over estimate the importance of the
> thru-hiker crowd. Most forest users don't even know there is a
> PCT, let alone whackos that hike the whole thing in a year. The
> ones who **ARE** aware of thru-hikers are not the ones who are
> causing the problems anyway, because they are the educated ones.
Brick is dead on target. Most people don't know anything about the
thru-hiker subculture or even that it exists. Most people think
of "hiking" as: "I will drive to a campground and walk a mile to a
waterfall or vista, then *maybe* I will sleep on the ground in a big
stand up tent if I can figure out how to set it up." To test this
out, take a day trip to the Mist Trail in Yosemite. You will see
people hiking the 1.x miles up to Vernal falls with coolers, enormous
packs, two-burner coleman stoves, baby strollers, suitcases, fine
china, silverware, etc. They have no clue that the trail isn't paved
the entire way or that it is actually steep and rugged. "After all",
they think, "the park service would never put people at risk by
making them walk on actual rocks, would they? How else would people
get up there?"
At the Whitney Portal its the same way (or at least it was before the
lottery system; I haven't been since they instituted that). You will
see people who obviously have not trained and have no idea what it
means to actually "hike" or "climb". In 1998 we slept on the summit
and started down to the Portal at dawn. This allowed us to pass all
the people on their way up. I am talking SERIOUS COMEDY here. We
would pass these people carrying small lunch-mate Igloo coolers, lawn
chairs, folding cots, small appliances, etc. We'd start talking to
them just to see what the hell they were doing. They'd say "Oh... we
just came out to walk up to the summit and maybe catch a few rays up
there". They would have a big metal round canteen that they got from
Academy on the way out of town, some top-sider shoes, bermuda shorts,
a golf shirt, and possibly a brand new "Mt. Whitney" baseball cap
that they got at the portal store or in lone pine the day before.
They would usually be accompanied by their wife who was equally as
over-weight as they were and their pudgy Nintendo-addicted kids who
were less than happy to be peeled away from the portable TV/VCR that
they had in the travel-van where they were preparing for the trip by
watching John Candy in "The Great Outdoors". Invariably, when they
would pass us, they would ask if we'd been to the summit. When we
replied "yes", they looked hopeful, as if it were only a few hundred
yards to go and then ask "How much further?" Of course, they started
at the crack of 9am after they woofed down some pop-tarts and
powdered doughnuts, so when we passed them, they hadn't even made it
to Outpost camp. When we would tell them that they probably weren't
going to make it to the summit today, they would always look
perplexed as if we told them some astounding revelation. They'd want
to know the distance, so we'd tell them "9 more miles". Then they
say "No way! You mean we've been walking for 3 hours and we've only
covered 2 miles??" We wouldn't waste our breath trying to tell these
people that in addition to the 9 miles, it was also another 5000
vertical feet. It would have been a waste of time. They have no
understanding of what that means. Of course, when we pass the solar
outhouses along the trail people would always ask to borrow toilet
paper. I guess it never occured to them that their gastorintestinal
system would still function while they were hiking. Just the fact
that there are two locations with solar outhouses on the way up to
the summit and an additional outhouse on the summit says alot.
What's even worse is that some people DONT USE THEM. I've seen turds
just out in the open both on the summit of Half Dome and
Whitney. ...so much for "leave no trace". I've told people that I
ahve packed out my poop before and they just stare in disbelief, as
if I were some sort of disgusting freak. I guess that the thought of
visiting the Grand Canyon and seeing it filled to the rim with human
waste is more appealing to them than packing out poop. Oh yeah...
can't forget about those people who haven't been outdoors in so long
that they forgot what a sunburn is. You know you've seen these
people on the trail. The ones who are as red as a stop light and
have no clue that they are acquiring melanoma as they are talking to
you. Then when you ask them if they want to borrow sunscreen, they
say something like "Nah... I tan easy."
The last time I hiked Half Dome (July 4, 2003), we ran across dozens
of people at Nevada falls who ran out of water and needed us to filer
water for them. We saw more than one family that only had like 1
liter of water between four people. One family we saw only had one
20 oz Aquafina bottle for two adults and two kids!! All these people
are just utterly shocked that there is no water fountain at Nevada
Falls. They all say "this is ridiculous, they should put a faucet up
here." ...and I am thinking "yeah. right, lady. maybe you should
just grow a brain instead." I am telling you, people are DUMB. We
spent over an hour filtering water for people at Nevada Falls and
there was a line! We had to turn people down because if we didn't,
we would not have made it back down before dark.
You might think that I am making this up, but I am not. I am amazed
at the stupidity every time I go to a popular destination. This is
most of America. Why do you think that at the Grand Canyon, there
are signs as big as billboards posted at the trail heads that tell
people that hiking to the bottom of the canyon and back in one day is
impossible? Its not "impossible"; people trail run from the north
rim to the south rim and back in one day. Its just "impossible" for
someone who has laid on the coutch in front of the TV, then gets a
wild hair to go to the grand canyon because he saw a show on the
Discovery Channel or watched City Slickers one too many times on
TBS. I am not making this sh*t up. The park service put that huge
sign there because they got tired of rescuing people who litterally
walked themselve to exhaustion in 5 miles of downhill walking. Its
disgusting how out of shape the average american is, and also how
ignorant (s)he is. How in the hell does someone who is as fat as a
whale and hasn't walked more than 100 yards from the parking lot to
the mall in the last 10 years, think that they can just get up and go
climb Mount Whitney on a Sunday afternoon with no preparation,
training, or equipment?? I am telling you, talk to any park ranger,
they will back me up. ...or just watch a reality TV show to verify.
Of course, I have also met some really cool, intelligent, and
interesting people on the trail as well. Most everyone that I have
met in the backcountry has been really nice and fun to talk to.
peace!
dude
_________________________________________________________________
http://fastmail.ca/ - Fast Secure Web Email for Canadians
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------------------------------
Message: 19
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 21:03:29 -0700
From: "Mark Verber" <mark@verber.com>
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Titanium Bear Canister
To: "Lisa Miller" <arwenita@yahoo.com>,
<pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Message-ID: <NDBBLBEHPDCIOBGNJBECKEGBDBAA.mark@verber.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> The NPS office in Sequoia National Park had a
> Titanium bear canister in their rental options when I was there a
> couple years ago... company was Bear-ikaid or something
> like that.
The company is wild ideas, the product was called bearikade. The canisters
are made from a composite carbon fiber with a 6061 T-6 aluminum top and
bottom. The smaller units are $195, larger are $245. As far as I know,
they are the lightest hard-sided bear cannister on the market.
http://www.wild-ideas.net/products.html
--Mark
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End of pct-l Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
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