[pct-l] ULA Helix Ice Axe

[wiclimber2004 at yahoo.com (WIclimber)]

New to this group but have been climbing for many years.  Carbon fiber shafts have been used in technical ice climbing for quite some time.  Weight of the axe is important for a good swing, like a framing hammer.  One does not swing the axe during self-arrest.  I would not be concerned about the shaft.
   
  Now the aluminum head, that might be a concern.  But for hiking the PCT, I think it would be just fine.
   
  

Bob Bankhead <wandering_bob@comcast.net> wrote:
  I'm no dedicated climber either, but I've been trained in mountaineering 
with the Ptarmigans mountaineering club here in Vancouver WA and have had 
some limited glacier travel experience on Mount Hood and high-angle snow on 
other Cascade routes. If you simply fall on your axe, depending on your body 
weight to dig (push) in the point - which you would likely do for most 
snowfield falls - then I would agree with you regarding the weight 
differences.

If you are on hard frozen snow or ice, you are taught to swing the axe at 
the surface with a chopping motion to set the point of the axe, then drop 
your weight across it to help secure it and keep the tip from bouncing out 
again. For the un-initiated, this is not an overhead swing, and the time 
between the swing and your body landing is well under a second.

All this assumes that immediately prior to your fall, you've been traveling 
with your ice axe held across your body in both hands and can manage to get 
the point of the axe to hit the surface at about 90 degrees for maximum 
penetration. Greg Hummel makes another excellent point in his glissading 
example reply.

Most UL ice axes are probably quite suitable for the type of conditions most 
PCT through-hikers are likely to encounter in a normal year, at least north 
of Tuolumne Meadows. It's the strength of the carbon fiber handle that makes 
me leery, especially when it gets cold. There are titanium ice axes 
available at 13 oz or less, but they are cost-prohibitive overkill for the 
casual through-hiker. Similar to bear canisters, before investing, ask 
yourself how many times in your life are you going to be somewhere that 
could reasonably be expected to require an ice axe. Then make your choice; 
buy, rent, or take a chance.

Bob




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jerry Goller" 
To: 

Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2005 10:07 AM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] ULA Helix Ice Axe


> I'll be the first to say that I'm not a climber, I'm a backpacker. But 
> maybe
> you could clear up something I am unclear on.
>
> I can see how a heavier ice axe would do a better job of penetrating ice 
> or
> hard snow when swinging it. But I can't see how even a pound or two 
> greater
> weight on the head of the axe could increase penetration when using it for
> self-arrest considering I will already have somewhere over 100 pounds of 
> me
> pushing down on the head when self-arresting.
>
> How does that work?
>
> Jerry
>
>
> http://www.BackpackGearTest.org : the most comprehensive interactive gear
> reviews and tests on the planet.
>
>
>
> One excellent point made in their discussion: "Keep in mind that aluminum
> headed axes may not have the weight to penetrate hard snow or ice." Having
> taken a few glacier falls (hard ice), I was very happy to have had my good
> technical-rated 32 oz Charlet Moser axe with me instead of my lighter 
> weight
> basic-rated Grivel Mount Blanc. It was over-kill on that particular 
> glacier,
> but if you only get one chance to arrest a fall, you want an axe that will
> do the job, not bounce off.
>
> Wandering Bob
>
>
>
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