[pct-l] those bleeping stoves and their various fuels

[Track Wolf]

Get a Grip!

It is hard for me to grasp that so many are "addicted" to alcohol stoves.
I've used them alot over the years, but only as a back-up for my sierra zip
stove, and now I have one made of titanium.  What a wonderful contraption.
I've been packing into the woods and mountains over 50 years.  I try to
convince people about the ease and safety for the all around use of this
stove in the wilderness.  But, mostly I run into arguments about how
dangerous it is...that is just to ridiculous to even contemplate.  I think
the alcoholics have been drinking their fuel.

TF



On 3/22/07, Georgi Heitman <bobbnweav at citlink.net> wrote:
>
> L-Rod...
> Thank you...as so often happens, you not only grasp the nature of the
> problem, but know the right words to say to help explain same, and give some
> suggestions.  I'm amazed at the curfuffle my post raised, and at the same
> time very pleased...it seems to have set a bunch of people to
> thinking.  Hopefully this thought process will carry into the woods.
> As A Bat, I loved that you'd already been concerned enough to do some
> testing.  Try throwing some dried grass clippings into your fire pit and
> then spill some burning alcohol and watch what the grass clippings do, and
> how hard it is to tell if there's any fire spreading.  It would make sense
> for other hikers to experiment a bit, not only with fuels but also factoring
> in, if possible, wind...produced  by a fan perhaps on your cement
> driveway.  Eric, thank you for bringing that up.  Frankly, I hadn't really
> thought about how the very lightweight soda can stove would behave in a
> strong wind.  Good point.
> Radar and Eckert, you're right when you say that it's not necessarily the
> denatured alcohol that I  worry about, but the consequences of an accident
> while using any form of fuel.  This already very dry year could be the one
> Dennie and I have been worried about since we moved here in 1993.  Our worst
> nightmare come true.  More on that in a moment....
> And finally, Mark the Slogger...alcohol should be a sensitive subject, tho
> as mentioned above, all fuels should be handled with extra care this year,
> but especially alcohol, because of the nature of that particular beastie, be
> it denatured or not.
> Dennis is a retired firefighter, a 26 year veteran from the Oakland F.D(East Bay in the San Francisco Bay area).  The Department's most feared
> fires, other than illegal fireworks manufacturing blazes and paint stores
> were chemical fires, especially pharmaceutical company fires.  We have, over
> the years, had quite a number of such companies in the East Bay, and cities
> give mutual aid so Dennie's seen his share.  The nature of alcohol is to
> burn invisibly, especially during daylight hours, making it very difficult
> to know where the fire they're fighting is...or for that matter, to know if
> alcohol is even involved.  Foam is used extensively for chemical fires, if
> liquid alcohol has been released from containers, it can run under foam and
> then as Donna mentioned, a spark can set it off, too often behind the
> firefighters.  And too often, they don't know til their turnouts get
> hot.  Bad business, that, as you might imagine.  This one aspect of this one
> type of fuel is what scares
> me so much that I felt compelled to write what I wrote.
> Now, back to our worst nightmare...we've not had a fire through our
> immediate area since Mt. Lassen erupted in 1914.  The largest of these
> eruptions blew his side out (This Mt. is named for Peter Lassen, and is
> therefore, male) and released a melted snow, mud and ash flow that rolled
> out that side and down the mountain, following the path of least resistance,
> which happened to be Hat Creek, and starting fires all along the
> way.  Basically, some of the area around us (within a mile or so as the crow
> flies) in a pick-up stick sort of hodge-podge just waiting for the right
> moment.  It will be a horrendous. firestorm...the kind that produces it's
> own winds and weather. To that end, we have installed fire hydrant-like
> stand pipes all over our yard and three pumping systems all feeding from our
> little creek.  Will it be enough?  We don't know, we don't want to find
> out.  When we lived in Oakland, we feared a warm easterly wind above all
> other things.  I mentioned that very subject
> one morning on a dry October day  as we headed out to breakfast after
> Dennie got back home from working a 24 hour shift, saying, "I wonder if this
> is the wind we've been dreading."  About three hours later, we knew it was,
> as Dennis raced back to duty and spent the next 48 hours fighting the
> behemoth Oakland Hills fire that destroyed over 3000 homes and took 27
> lives, including those of a very good friend of mine and of a co-worker of
> Dennie's.  We'd not like to see a repeat, thank you.
> So, regardless of what you plan to cook on or what you use to cook it
> with, please do some practice runs at home under an assortment of weather
> conditions, real or concocted.  Decide that watching a bit of cowboy T.V.
> isn't necessarily needed for a good night's sleep and especially, know what
> an alcohol fire burns like when it gets away from you-  before you head out
> on the trail.  And, please spread the word about extra caution this season,
> no matter what part of the trail you're on.
> I really didn't expect the response my post has received...but, I thank
> you all for weighing in on this most important issue.
> Georgi
> Trail Angel in Old Station.
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