[pct-l] A few quick questions- Scott's comment

[kmurray at pol.net]

I can see that you don't have to let honesty or truth get in the way of
your statements.  I think if you look at the posts that you are attacking,
you will find nothing about bear cans.  I certainly don't mention them. 
They are not required, generally, on "my" forest.

What I object to is the suggestion that sleeping with your food is
something that one should strongly consider.  I think that "the currently
popular agenda" that I am pushing, is not sleeping with your food, in bear
country.

If you object to that agenda, then you ARE supporting sleeping with your
food.  The obfuscating statement that you do not, when you clearly do,
just makes you sound like yet another politician liar, trying to push a
position, while maintaining plausible deniability.

"I would ask the
self identified experts this one simple question, "Are you aware how many
people pass through bear country without a canister?" "

Yes.  We pick up the trash created by the bears when they tear up the
tents, rip apart the packs, and pass the wrappers through their digestive
system.  We take the reports of people who have been bothered by bears. 
We give up some of our food to the people who have had theirs taken.  Yep,
we know.

What do you think that YOU know about what goes on, passing through an
area in a day or two, compared to people who spend the summer, or the
year, or a decade,  residing in the area?  I'm sure you get a lot of
hearsay, but we all know what rumor is worth.

"Bonus question: "Are
you living on the friggin' moon?""

Nope, you appear to be up there pretty much by yourself.

Down here on Earth, we use actual data to make decision and recommendations.

http://www.humboldt.edu/~srm1/Research/Martin_and_McCurdy_2005Abstract.pdf
http://www.wcs.org/media/file/Yose_BE_Complete.pdf

"If you're trying to intimidate me into promoting the currently popular
agenda by ignoring the reality of what actually goes on out there, you are
failing miserably."

Wait a minute:  I'm trying to get you to agree with the currently popular
agenda of not sleeping with your food in bear country.   I've failed????
Then I guess you are saying, that in spite of my efforts, you DO support
that practice!

I love this!  Any time in, say, the next twenty years, anytime anyone gets
badly hurt or killed sleeping with their food, their family will look
online, and they will find our posts.  They will see your website, and
your self-promotion as an expert. (Where was it you worked as a bear
biologist?)

You'll never know it's coming, until you get the summons.  Every time you
hear about a bear attack, you'll wonder.  Good work.

I'm SO GLAD you are the sort that takes responsiblity for your decisions!

:)



> So far we've had 2 folks claiming to work in Yosemite and now a
> volunteer  ranger touting the evils of not carrying a bear can. Good
> work, you're doing  your job.
>
> As I said before and have always said, "I would never recommend someone
> sleeping with their food."
>
> One thing is certain, the informed are clearly out of touch. I would ask
> the  self identified experts this one simple question, "Are you aware
> how many  people pass through bear country without a canister?" Bonus
> question: "Are  you living on the friggin' moon?"
>
> If you're trying to intimidate me into promoting the currently popular
> agenda by ignoring the reality of what actually goes on out there, you
> are  failing miserably.
>
> Scott
>
>>>>>
> "As a hiker, you have to do what works for you and be responsible for
> that decision."
>
> Glad that you feel that way, Scott.  I'm wondering if a you are willing
> to let a jury consider that your posts encouraged inexperienced people
> to go without bear protection, putting their food and their lives at
> risk?
>
> I, at least, am a volunteer wilderness ranger working in bear country
> that would be happy to testify as to the ridiculous recklessness of your
> advice.
>
> And the good news is, that this post, with this offer, will be
> searchable and findable by anyone harmed by a bear, for the remainder of
> your natural life.
>
> Glad you take responsibility, Scott.
> <<<<
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