[pct-l] SPOT messenger vs McMurdo PLB

Mon Mar 28 19:14:46 CDT 2011

I will be carrying a Spot (thanks to a thoughtful friend) on my solo 2011 PCT 
hike.  I didn't want to carry the tech device, but I realized that it helped put 
my friend's mind at ease and I decided that everything about my 2011 PCT hike 
doesn't have to "be about me."  I no longer regret the extra weight and/or added 
expense and I no longer consider the techno infringement an unwanted/unnecessary 
item.  Initially, I was doing a friend a favour and now I can see that I can/may 
benefit by carrying it on my trek.  Would I have purchased this item for 
myself?  Probably not.  Would I purchase one now after having one for a while?  
Definetely ...

________________________________
From: Hillary Schwirtlich <hillary.schwirtlich at gmail.com>
To: Toby Maxwell <tmm19 at geneseo.edu>
Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
Sent: Mon, March 28, 2011 1:54:53 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] SPOT messenger vs McMurdo PLB

Lol, if my mom bought me one (and I have a feeling she would if I told her
about them, she would) I'm sure I would accept too, even if I didn't want
to... I'll just keep my mouth shut and hope she doesn't do her research. :)

On Mon, Mar 28, 2011 at 11:08 AM, Toby Maxwell <tmm19 at geneseo.edu> wrote:

> It may sound hypocritical but I agree with everyone.  In response to
> Hillary, I guess my response is that I am not as hardcore (I would accept a
> life saving heli) but, really the only reason why I will have it is because
> my mom said, "I will be much less stressed for the next 5 months if you let
> me buy you this expensive toy" given the circumstance my response was a
> semi-reluctant yes.  Although I am also funding the trip by my own work and
> savings, there is something to be said for helping people who got me to
> where I am feel as good about it as I do.  I guess because I am 99.99% sure
> I will not even touch the thing, if I do end up getting it, I'll call it my
> sentimental item for the trip, maybe put an 'I <3 mom' sticker on it for
> good measure.
>
> -toby
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 28, 2011 at 12:04 PM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Nicely said.  And I bet you make it all the way to Canada if you choose
>> to.
>>
>> Ps.  We were backpacking 35 years ago in Levis and 60lb packs. Cell
>> phones,
>> spots, and personal computers did not exist. Not much cash, believe me. We
>> did have a map and compass and cooked over fire or a later a Svea.  We had
>> a
>> great time.
>>
>> Collin Fletcher hiked all over the place including the 1st documented
>> through hike of the Grand Canyon (read Man Who Walked Through Time).  He
>> did
>> not have any of this stuff, he did have a bunch of stuff though so I am
>> not
>> sure if he would carry it today or not, maybe.  So completely ironic that
>> he
>> was hit by a car later in life which ultimately lead to his demise.
>>
>> I also totally understand and can relate to and respect Mendo's comments.
>> I am sure I was given 9 lives and have used up about 8 1/2 so I am more
>> cautious now. Youth will get you a long way.
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net
>> ]
>> On Behalf Of Hillary Schwirtlich
>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 8:24 AM
>> To: Paul Robison
>> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
>> Subject: Re: [pct-l] SPOT messenger vs McMurdo PLB
>>
>> On money:
>>
>> I've had this problem on this list before. It's hard sometimes to think
>> about other people's money situation, I guess. But I have saved enough
>> money
>> over the last year and a half to hike the trail with the amount of gear I
>> feel I need, replace the stuff that gets broken, to have a reasonable
>> amount
>> of zero days, to feed myself and eat relatively well in town, and to
>> donate
>> to trail angels when they help me out. I'm not going to be eating at 5
>> star
>> restaurants or staying in a hotel every time I'm in town, but I'm not
>> trying
>> to hike the trail for $1,000 either. I am young, however, and have not had
>> enough years/experience to get an extremely well paying job, and having
>> been
>> an volunteer for the last two years, I haven't really had much of a paying
>> job at all. So I don't have enough money to buy top of the line gear in
>> everything, and I certainly don't have enough money to spend $200 (which
>> was
>> exactly the cost of my ULA backpack, which I am going to use every day) on
>> new devices that people haven't needed for hundreds of years.
>>
>> As for "being in for a hard through hike," like I said, I've been a
>> "professional" volunteer for the last two years - I'm used to getting a
>> lot
>> out of my money.
>>
>> I agree with Diane (I'm sorry, I don't know your trail name). One of the
>> reasons I'm on the trail to get away from gadgets and as much as I can
>> from
>> the "buy buy buy!" mentality we're mostly surrounded with. Like she said,
>> keep the helicopter if it gives me some peace and quiet. Dying in the
>> woods
>> wouldn't be too terrible of a way to go, in my opinion.
>>
>> So I know only a few people on the list are going to read this, but I want
>> to respectfully suggest that it would be nice if we heard a little less
>> "money isn't an issue! if you really wanted to do this hike, you'd spend
>> $___ on this new ___." I understand if someone else wants to spend their
>> money that way. But I'm not going to and I'm not going to feel bad about
>> it
>> either.
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 27, 2011 at 1:34 PM, Paul Robison
>> <paulrobisonhome at yahoo.com>wrote:
>>
>> > Hillary,
>> > The spot is 100$. And sub. Is 99$
>> >
>> > A traditional PLB is about 500$... So I thought spot was amazingly cheap
>> > for what it does.
>> >
>> > I certainly wouldn't say they are 'really expensive'. If 100$ is a
>> stretch
>> > for you;  youre in for a hard thru hike.  That's less than the cost of
>> one
>> > zero.
>> >
>> > Just talked to two couples I hiked with last year and both spent over
>> > 16,000 ... That sufficiently scared me... I'm even considering skipping
>> > Warner springs.
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPod
>> >
>> > On 2011-03-27, at 3:36 PM, Hillary Schwirtlich <
>> > hillary.schwirtlich at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > I think this comes back to the central question of heavy trucking vs
>> > light
>> > > vs ultralight hiking: how do you mitigate risk? It's a question that
>> > doesn't
>> > > just have to do with weight though. If you are concerned about being
>> > > prepared for everything, you're going to bring more options for
>> bailing
>> > > yourself out of sticky situations.
>> > >
>> > > I don't have a SPOT and I don't plan on getting one. That's because
>> > they're
>> > > really expensive and they aren't something I think is 100% necessary
>> for
>> > my
>> > > style of hiking. Partly because I'm almost never alone, I rarely stray
>> > off
>> > > trail, and I always have a map. In other words, I'm usually as
>> prepared
>> > as I
>> > > think I can be, I have enough experience to know how to deal with most
>> > > common backcountry situations (i.e. cold, wet weather, etc), and I'm
>> not
>> > > like the guy was in 127 Hours - I see the need for human companionship
>> > and
>> > > letting someone know where I'm going.
>> > >
>> > > What happened to your friend's uncle was definitely unexpected and
>> very
>> > sad.
>> > > But that was also a very rare case. Maybe it's foolhardy of me to say
>> > that I
>> > > doubt I will be having a heart attack soon (I'm 23, female, have
>> always
>> > been
>> > > active and eaten well, and have no family history of heart problems).
>> But
>> > I
>> > > feel that the risk of that or something else like it happening to me,
>> > where
>> > > I don't have someone who can go hike for help, is small enough not to
>> > > warrant needing a SPOT. Just like the likelihood of me developing an
>> > > allergic reaction to a bee sting on the trail when I've never had an
>> > > allergic reaction to one before is possible, but unlikely, and so I'm
>> not
>> > > going to go get a prescription for an EpiPen just in case.
>> > >
>> > > That being said, I don't think you're over prepared if you do decide
>> to
>> > get
>> > > a SPOT device or something like it. I can see that having that extra
>> > safety
>> > > would make someone feel much more comfortable, especially if they
>> spent
>> a
>> > > lot of time alone. But I certainly don't think that you're a terrible
>> > person
>> > > for not having one. If everyone who every went hiking absolutely
>> needed
>> a
>> > > signaling device, 1. people wouldn't have gone hiking until the last
>> > however
>> > > many years since those signaling devices were invented, and 2. only
>> > people
>> > > who could afford the device would experience outdoor sports. And I'm
>> all
>> > for
>> > > as many people as possible exploring and appreciating the natural
>> world.
>> > >
>> > > I guess it's also a question of HYOH. :)
>> > >
>> > > On Sun, Mar 27, 2011 at 12:00 PM, Edward Anderson <
>> > mendoridered at yahoo.com>wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Jim,
>> > >> I always advise people to "expect the unexpected"- and try to be
>> > prepared
>> > >> for
>> > >> it. Trees can fall unexpectedly, for no obvious reason - even on a
>> nice
>> > day
>> > >> with
>> > >> little or no breeze. Boulders can come down, starting slides, as snow
>> > and
>> > >> ice melt from high above the trail. Anyone who has spent a lot of
>> time,
>> > >> hiking,
>> > >> climbing, and riding, in the back country, as I have, has experienced
>> > the
>> > >> unexpected. You don't have to be taking foolish risks to have the
>> > >> unexpected happen. While I lived in Mendocino an uncle of a close
>> friend
>> > >> tragically died while hiking in the Yola Bolies alone.  He was a
>> healthy
>> > >> and fit
>> > >> guy and knew the area well. He died of a Cardiac Arrest. he had no
>> way
>> > >> of summoning help. This happened about 15 years ago. If he had along
>> a
>> > way
>> > >> of
>> > >> summoning help he might have survived. Now that the technology has
>> > become
>> > >> available I hold that it is foolish not to take advantage of it. It
>> > might
>> > >> be the
>> > >> life of someone else that you save.
>> > >>
>> > >> MendoRider
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> From: "enyapjr at comcast.net" <enyapjr at comcast.net>
>> > >> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
>> > >> Sent: Sun, March 27, 2011 11:12:17 AM
>> > >> Subject: [pct-l] SPOT messenger vs McMurdo PLB
>> > >>
>> > >>> ...only a fool would not bring one, or some other reliable rescue
>> > >> signaling
>> > >>> device.
>> > >>
>> > >> Sorry, MendoRider, but I definitely have to disagree with that
>> > statement!
>> > >> With a moderate amount of experience, sufficient or adequate gear for
>> > the
>> > >> conditions
>> > >> expected or possible, and the common sense to know when to hunker
>> down
>> > or
>> > >> bail
>> > >> out or
>> > >>
>> > >> not try something too 'extreme' - one wouldn't have any need for
>> > >> "rescue"...
>> > >> Not having a SPOT or PLB does not necessarily mean that one is stupid
>> or
>> > a
>> > >> fool!
>> > >>
>> > >>> The successful TV program "I Shouldn't be Alive" would not exist if
>> all
>> > >> of
>> > >>> those
>> > >>>
>> > >>> people had had a way of calling for rescue.
>> > >>
>> > >> And how did many of those people get into such 'situations' that they
>> > >> needed
>> > >> 'rescue'?
>> > >> Sometimes it's the opposite - one goes ahead and does something one
>> > >> normally
>> > >> wouldn't
>> > >> because they do have a rescue device with them...  Plus ask some SAR
>> > folks
>> > >> what
>> > >> they
>> > >> honestly think of these rescue devices - too many times that 'rescue'
>> > >> button is
>> > >> pushed
>> > >> without THINKING over the situation first - or developing skills
>> needed
>> > >> ahead of
>> > >> time...
>> > >> The most important piece of 'gear' one carries? - the gray matter in
>> > one's
>> > >> skull
>> > >> - it's
>> > >> seems amazing that so many people nowadays don't use it (but makes
>> for
>> > >> "successful TV"
>> > >> programs, however)...
>> > >>
>> > >> There's also another 'popular' TV program - "A 1,000 Ways to Die";
>> and
>> > >> let's not
>> > >> forget
>> > >> about the annual "Darwin Awards", either...  I doubt a rescue device
>> > would
>> > >> have
>> > >> helped
>> > >> the majority of those people...
>> > >>
>> > >> What was my 'rescue device' carried many years ago (before
>> > 'electronics') &
>> > >> never once
>> > >>
>> > >> used as such - the mirror in my small sighting compass...
>> > >> All that said - I'll probably carry a SPOT - but as a COMMUNICATION
>> > device,
>> > >> NOT
>> > >> as a
>> > >>
>> > >> 'rescue' device...  It will be for the family & friends 'peace of
>> mind',
>> > >> and for
>> > >> me in
>> > >> the sense of 'sharing' my trek with them daily...
>> > >> YMMV, HYOH, ad infinitum etceteras......
>> > >>
>> > >> Happy trails!!!
>> > >> Jim (PITA)
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> Pct-L mailing list
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>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
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