[pct-l] VVR

Thu Mar 11 19:59:03 CST 2010

Well, first let's make sure everyone realizes that Mono Hot Springs is FARTHER off the trail than VVR.  You have to exit at either Florence Lake or VVR and then hike 2-4 miles more to get to Mono Hot Springs.  They do have a nice facility, but they aren't any cheaper than VVR.  They ship their stuff down the same road, they just get to stop a couple of miles sooner.  Mono Hot Springs is a Post Office, so if you send things to VVR via USPS, you actually send them to Mono Hot Springs and we pick them up.

Yes, there is a fee to pick up a resupply at VVR - we aren't a trail angel or a Post Office, we're a business.  There's also a fee at Mono Hot springs (unless you send it via USPS general delivery).  I'm sure you're all familiar with the fee at Muir Trail Ranch.  Point is... everyone has a fee for resupply unless they are actually a Post Office or a trail angel.

What I LOVE is that you heard "rumors", and when you got there you just independently decided that the rumors were true.  You didn't ask then... and here you are spreading the same rumors around.  And even after I EXPLAINED this to you in an offline email earlier today, you still post this to the list.  I was trying to give you the truth; I guess you have a different agenda, huh?  

Of course, Yogi picked up on those same rumors, did the same thing you did, and published those rumors in her guide.  So, now everybody thinks it's true, and folks like you just keep perpetuating it.  I've heard that Yogi posted an addendum to her guide to correct those rumors after a couple of years, but the damage continues when folks like you bring it up again.

The bottom line is... we NEVER take things out of the hiker resupply boxes unless either:  
1.  The hiker SPECIFICALLY tells us that they aren't coming, and that we can sell whatever we want to recoup our costs (if they don't show up, we don't get paid for the box).  or 
2.  The box is still at VVR at least 30 days past the hiker's ETA, and there is no way to contact the hiker.  

As Paul said immediately after your post, opening unclaimed packages would be criminal - and we don't do that.  

Our website CLEARLY states our policy in dealing with resupply boxes... always has.  We haven't deviated from that policy in any way.

IF the hiker calls us and tells us he's not going to show, we'll either ship the box back at his expense, or if he wants to pay for the resupply, we'll put his stuff in the hiker BARREL for everyone to share.

A lot of things go into that barrel anyway... there are only a few things from resupplies that we can sell - most of the time, hikers repackage their stuff, and we can't resell repackaged things.

So... yeah, somebody somewhere may have seen us taking things out of a resupply box and putting them on the shelves to sell.  But they probably missed the part where the hiker called us to say that he dropped off the trail and wouldn't be thru VVR, and to sell what we could out of the box and put the rest in the barrel.  We do that all the time, and there's NOTHING wrong with that.  Again, we aren't trail angels, VVR is a BUSINESS.  And if we don't make money, we won't be there next year for the next group of hikers.

The owner of VVR (Jim) is about as FAR from shady as he can be.  Obviously, you don't see 'em very well... I've known him for close to 15 years now.  MARINE in Vietnam, an avid outdoorsman, climber, backpacker, and an all around amazing guy.  I'm sure there are many on this list that will support me on that.  He truly loves VVR, and he enjoys the hikers.  Some more than others.

Quite frankly, spreading rumors and calling people "shady" just because you didn't like the guy would make me think twice about taking your advice on anything.  And the fact that after you and I traded emails and I explained things to you, you still feel like you have to post the rumor AGAIN after I disavowed it and explained it tells me you aren't really doing it simply to "help" people.  But I'll leave that to others on the list to dissect.

I apologize to those on the list for being so blatantly angry with this - but I'm really tired of this rumor, and even more so of defending against it.  

My best advice?  Hike your own hike, and don't let guys like this tell you how to do it.  In the end, you'll have a much better trip.

Bill
Webmaster, VVR

On Mar 11, 2010, at 4:20 PM, Junaid Dawud wrote:

> I've received several off list questions about my statement that i  
> felt resupplying at VVR was a mistake and that I felt the owner was  
> shady. I'll post my response to the list. Hopefully this won't ruffle  
> too many feathers, and I certainly invite the VVR folks to share their  
> side.
> 
> First off, the reason I felt vvr was a mistake for me is that I ended  
> up going to mono hotsprings on a lark. It was the 4th of July and we  
> thought the hotsprings would be nice. We got there in time to buy some  
> beer and relax in the hotsprings, it was awesome. We also found a free  
> camping area, met a really cool employee, swam in a small lake thats  
> fed by warm springs, and discovered that the general store had a PO. I  
> asked them if they would hold hiker packages, they said yes. There was  
> also a restaurant there. It was a cool place.
> 
> Then we had to bum a ride up to vvr to get our resupply packages. As I  
> recall there was a fee to pick it up. I had heard rumors that the  
> owner resold the contents of unclaimed resupply packages. When I  
> arrived, the items stocked on a few shelves indicated to me that this  
> was probably true. I also had a few interactions with the owner that  
> gave me a "shady" impression of the guy (sorry, I call em like I see  
> em). On the other hand the food was great (if you do go, eat pie) and  
> they do provide a service to the hikers that wouldn't want to detour  
> as far off trail as mono hotsprings.
> 
> So that's it, that's all, it's only worth my opinion.
> 
> Junaid
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-l mailing list
> Pct-l at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> 
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/