[pct-l] Alpenstocks and Self-Arrest Poles

[hiker97 at aol.com]

I wonder if the super light ULA Potty Trowel would work okay.  That is a neat piece of gear.  I would like to get a gear report on it.

The Switch Back



-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Adams <reddirt2 at earthlink.net>
To: Denis Stanton <denisstanton at mac.com>
Cc: PCT List List <pct-l at backcountry.net>; Deems <losthiker at sisqtel.net>; Hiker97 <hiker97 at aol.com>; joseph kisner <lostonthecrest at hotmail.com>; scott williamson <duckface99 at gmail.com>; Reinhold Metzger <reinholdmetzger at cox.net>; MONTE DODGE <montedodge at msn.com>
Sent: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 8:18 pm
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Alpenstocks and Self-Arrest Poles


A few years back I found a nice icy slope with safe run out up in the San 
orgonio Wilderness.  I practiced with and without a pack, on my back, head 
irst, head first on my back, and every other thing I could think of.  I was 
retty banged up after a bunch of these, and not without a little road rash.  No 
ood stick, aluminum pole, or other straight devise would have stopped me.  But 
etting rolled, turned or whatever and planting that axe brought me to an 
mmediate screeching halt of a self arrest, and I also noted a few times that 
he leash kept the axe with me a couple times where I think perhaps it might 
ell have been ripped out of my hands.  At another time I glissaded down Cinder 
one in Lassen Park using one of my hiking poles.  This had a safe run out, and 
ot so icy or steep, but I understood at this time that the pole would be used 
or directional trajectory and would not suffice to stop me should speeds get 
nto the red.  Anyway, my experience suggests just carry a light weight axe.  
nd don't boot ski or glissade if you have hundreds of miles and most of the 
ummer left to hike.  Not good to hurt your back or twist an ankle.       
n Nov 19, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Denis Stanton wrote:
> The words "stout stick" are important here.  I can report from experience 
cquired while descending the north side of Forester in 2008 in an 
ut-of-control glissade that planting a lightweight hike pole firmly into the 
now between my knees had no effect at all on my speed of descent.  The lower 
hird of the pole simply vanished and I continued downhill at the same speed as 
efore clutching the shortened pole.
 Fortunately he large rocks further down the slope were much more effective at 
lowing me down.
 
 Denis Stanton
 
 On 20/11/2009, at 3:39 PM, ned at pacificcrestcustombuilders.com wrote:
 
> I'm not quite sure what AsABat was using, but he said it was an Alpenstaff, 
> which was a stout stick with an iron point at the end. If you have nothing 
> else, to jamb the point into the snow/ice to affect a self-arrest is the 
> right thing to do, but because of the leverage on the shaft while doing so, 
> the stick is likely to break.
 
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