[pct-l] Trail Running Shoes so great?

[Stephen]

Hi Diane,
Ouch.  I don't know how far you all walked but with sorry feet after 
wearinga new pair of anything around the house, then the yard a little bit, 
I'll then only go for a little eveing walk around the neigborhood.  Thus I 
keep the shoes in good enough shape to return if necessarry.  If those 
little tests don't hurt too bad and I like the feel, fit, and pronation, 
I'll then take on a couple miles walk to dinner or something and maybe take 
a steep dirt trail through the park.  Then perhaps I'll take on a longer 
five to seven mile walk in them.  Sounds to me like the shoes just don't fit 
you well, but you also probably overdid it taking them right out of the box. 
I've noticed alot of trailrunners and light hikers sometimes have a high 
ankle, and sometimes not too soft.  I suggest either don't wear them or take 
a knife and cut a split straight down about a half inch where the worst 
pressure point develops, like right in the middle of the underside of the 
ankle bones.  Among all my other pains I am suceptible to bone bruising 
under the ankle there and the only real solution I found is don't hike in 
those shoes very far (under five miles) or either make the split and see if 
that helps, which really worked good for me once out in northern Yosemite, 
or as others suggest, completely cut away enough of the shoe so it doesn't 
rub there anymore.  This is one of the issues that makes me think the way I 
do about mass produced market oriented gimicky stylish shoes. For the most 
part, most of the shoes they sell wont see the kind of use maybe 5 to 10% of 
buyers will subject them to.
Bike shops count on folks buying bikes, accesories and assembly service etc, 
but youknow where most bikes end up, yeah hanging in a garage getting rusty. 
Don't listen to or believe too much of all this hype.  You hiked a big 
section and walk a lot so you should have a pretty good idea what will and 
will not work for your specific needs.  You know if your feet tend to swell 
like Monty's or do not like mine.  I can't have my foot moving around in my 
shoes although I like a little extra room for my work shoes.  I have a big 
painful bunyon on my left foot which might prompt some folks to get wide 
shoes, which doesn't work for me.  I still have to use medium width and 
break them in until they shape to my foot, which takes quite a few miles. 
Like I've said, I like my shoes best when they are about half worn out.
As far as getting your feet dirty, this suggests to me that you at least got 
some nice breathing shoes.
The other thing I noted in your list is the quick blistering.  I'm thinking 
because the shoes were too allowing the bottom of your foot to swim around 
too much, maybe because they are too wide.  If when walking across a steep 
angled hillside you have the feeling that your shoes want to roll around 
your foot don't ya think this would be asking for discomfort?  It drives 
bonkers.  To be comfortable and walk trouble free I've always found a shoe 
that moves with my foot, that myfoot does not slip around inside, and only 
very little unlaced.  In other words I could walk pretty comfortably and 
reasonably safely with the laces undone.  Which when I am in camp this is 
what I do with the laces tied very loose just so I do not trip over them.
I know there are folks like Monty who have swelling , Ray Jardine talks 
about it in his book, but I'm more inclined to think all these early trail 
blisters are from lack of training and experience, and improper shoe fit.
You all are starting in generally hot weather and when the feet get all 
sweaty and start sliding around along the sole o fthe shoe look out.  This 
is when I've experienced blistering coming on, and this was the cause when I 
realized Iwas going to get one of those deep ball blisters onthe bottom of 
my foot. Anyone ever think maybe these spongy soft running shoes are 
promoting this?  This was why I made the comment previously about liking a 
slightly heavier less spongy light hiking shoe. Asolo has made several nice 
varieties over the last few years that breathe very well, but when I 
recently tried on of thier trail running lighter shoes it seemed like making 
a shoe that is actually meant to be worn wa sout the window.
Way too high ankles, over spongy midsole, way too much foot volume, no arch 
support at all, junky poorly thought out lacing.  Look cool though.  Stylish 
even.  So I use them as casual wear after work.
Useful for hiking?  Not even close.  I went tothe New Ballance store. What a 
bunch of junk.  Just marketing crap.  It's about sales, not your feet.  If 
they do work then great, and they do for some people, the rest just don't 
know any better.  Look at all these heavy backpacking boots available, new 
styles every year, new soles treads my the dozens.  Used to be a couple 
types and companies and that was it.  There's been a huge industry develop 
in the U.S. for hiking gear over the last twenty years.  Poles, boots, 
tents, everything.  Trailrunning, Mtnbiking, it just exploded.  Every 
manufacturer jumped on the band wagon rather than fold up and new ones 
popped up.  I imaginethere are acouple people outthere working in 
theindustry that actually are trying to care for your feet and comfort, but 
the bottom line is dollars, and big dollars. Don't even hesitate to return 
or send shoes back.
Oh boy, I went off the deep end, sorry.

But hey,if you got through that,
 You must have a place there in Santa Barbara where you can torture the 
store clerks stacking up shoe boxes trying on tendifferent types and twoor 
three sizes of each, and when youfind something you like, try on three 
different pairs in that size and keep the ones that fit best.  I've had 
irritating store clerks hoovering over me making sure I don't cherry pick 
and mix and match.  It might be worth a drive one Sunday to the closest REI 
or some big outfitter.  REI is still pretty good about returns so long as 
you don't let them change your mind.  Depends on who you talk to.   I don't 
like going there unless I a lot of time, and try to do so when they are not 
busy like when they open on Sundays.  I warn the clerk I have hard to fit 
feet and that I'll be making a big pile so be patient with me.  I don't tell 
them the "or else" part.  It ussually goes well.  At the local store here 
for a while the shoe folks were also tending to the map table and this one 
guy got an attitude so after piling up a bunch of shoe boxes I really wasn't 
interested in I said I liked this one pair and watned to look at some maps 
while I see how they feel.  I had a quite an impressive assortment of maps 
stroon all about the map table when he said the magic words, "Are you going 
to buy any of those?"  "Naw, just thought you needed something to keep you 
busy while you think about your attititude."
Anyways, I think the point of this is get something that works well, and 
don't think you need to box yourself in to anyone's ideas like "light 
running shoes are the only way to go these days."  If it works then all the 
more weight off the tootsies, but I don't put much faith in ideas that are 
not working for me.
Monty's hiking with a few pounds wearing shoes two times normal.  I haul 
thirty or more on camera trips for days and my feet do not swell, and if I 
had oversize shoes I'd have problems that would prevent being able to walk. 
So there we have one extreme to the other. My main concern is folks just 
don't know what to expect, and I've been suggesting for while now that those 
that don't know what works in hot, warm, cold wet etc, are theones who will 
suffer a painfullearning curve.  For these folks I'd suggest maybe have some 
alternative contigency plan like finding out where to buy shoes enroute, 
having some dependable hikers ready to ship at home or a friend's house with 
a list of supply addresses.
And good for Diane going out and getting her feet dirty, wet, and sore. 
That's exactly what I've been all fired up about.  She learned a lot.  What 
I like is for my feet to get drity, thus the shoes breathe freely.  My best 
light hikers ever my feet got filthy everyday for two seasons I used those 
shoes and was never so comfortable and never hiked so far in comfort in hot 
weather.  They were also quite nice when wet.  But the fit was snug always. 
My concern as I keep noting is starting out with too loose of a shoe and 
developing blisters before your feet either swell, or the shoes can be 
replaced with some thing more appropriate.  Imagine walking in soft sandy 
trail with loose shoes sliding all around on your feet when they are hot and 
sweaty.  And sand gets hot!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Diane at Santa Barbara Hikes dot com" <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Trail Running Shoes so great?


>
> On Feb 21, 2009, at 7:49 AM, pct-l-request at backcountry.net wrote:
>
>> Trail Running Shoes so great?
> Ok, so I got a brand new pair of New Balance 811s in the mail the
> other day. I have never worn these shoes before. They are an EE
> width, which I've also never tried. I like the width. Feels good. I
> took out the insoles that came with them and put in the cushy old
> lady insoles I like so much.
>
> I decided to wear them on a hike today. I thought we were going on
> just a nice little hike, but it turned out to be an off-trail
> adventure instead. Here are all the things wrong with trail runners.
>
> 1. These are the ugliest shoes I've ever seen. Ok, not all trail
> runners are ugly.
> 2. I stepped in quicksand and immediately my left foot was wet.
> 3. Walking off-trail on a perpetual slope down to my left, my left
> foot was in danger of getting a blister under the big bone where your
> big toe connects. After several miles of this, my left inner ankle
> was starting to hurt where the edge of the shoe rubs against it.
> 4. While hiking off trail I got tangled in a bush and when I stepped
> down on a branch with my left foot I crushed my right foot. That hurt.
> 5. There were these white plants that stuck annoyingly to my clothes.
> These things stuck to my shoe laces and to my socks around the ankles
> and even fell down inside the shoes.
> 6. We hiked in a lot of soft, silty sand in our off-trail adventure,
> sometimes sinking in pretty far as we went down impossible canyons. I
> had to stop a few times and shake the dirt out of my shoes.
> 7. I stopped to take off my shoes to cross a creek. My feet and socks
> were incredibly dirty, especially my toes.
> 8. I didn't find them as soft and cushy as I'd like. I guess I'll add
> another old lady insole to them.
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