[pct-l] Western Section R

Wed Jun 30 15:45:49 CDT 2021

I get what you are saying. I simply disagree. Just as addressing the way people hiked the trail -the drunks and so called party-ers —got taken out of the realm of “hike your own hike “when there were so many drunk and stupid hikers that they threatened to  destroy the welcome that towns traditionally gave us.
 It became a problem for all the trail organizations to address. ALDHA has its “finish well“ out reach. In ALDHAWEST we voted in a more inclusive board specifically because we wanted all these issues addressed.   Awareness changes what is needed. There have been separate organizations formed. They still exist. I want the existing larger organizations to be inclusive. 
Thank you again for all your work in maintaining the trail. If you ran for the board I would vote for you. Your knowledge is important 
Marmot

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 30, 2021, at 10:20 AM, JimLBanks at verizon.net wrote:
> 
> Marmot, you express a great passion for what you are talking about, but I think your passion is not allowing you to see the point of my posts.  You should take your own advice and listen.  Let's assume that everything you say is accurate.  What does it have to do with the PCTA?  The PCTA was formed to do trail maintenance, not to correct perceived discrimination and certainly not to enforce laws.  The PCTA has no enforcement authority, that is the role of the Forest Service and the local sheriffs along the trail.  I am sick and tired of people hijacking organizations that were formed for a specific purpose and using them to address issues that they think are important but have nothing to do with the mission of the organizations.  Like I said before, why don't you and the other people who feel that these issues you talk about need to be addressed form a 501(c)(3) entity whose stated purpose is to do that.   Then you can go out and try to raise money and promote what you believe in.  I believe in maintaining the PCT properly and I joined an organization whose stated purpose is to do just that, but whose current administration and Board think other things are more important.
> 
> I-Beam   
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: marmot marmot <marmotwestvanc at hotmail.com> 
> Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2021 11:54 PM
> To: JimLBanks at verizon.net
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Western Section R
> 
> Concerning the recent PCTA article:
> Because white predominantly male humans have made the decisions about the parks and trails ,I agree with being quiet and listening to people with a different experience tell what they have encountered out there. This is all just beginning. It’s is the time to pay attention. Trust that people who have a different life experience are telling the truth. Just as in the beginning at the Gatherings and  ADZPCTKO ,when I ran woman’s hiking groups ,men were not allowed to attend. At those groups women felt comfortable talking about what really bothered them on the trail and what they were really concerned about. No one told them they should not feel that way. Then,over the years (when the women ,themselves ,asked for a change)men were allowed to listen but not speak. That is what was needed so that the new voices could be heard. Calling the trail the most welcoming place is your experience. It is not mine. Some people are welcoming. Just because I want changes is no reason to imagine that I would not want to hike the trails.   Why would I ever question Crystal Gail Welcome’s desire to be out on trails and in nature?  Just because she complains and wants a better experience does not mean she does not want to be out there.  Other people’s prejudice and lack of awareness is their problem not hers. And she has the right to state the truth of her experience without being told she should not feel that way. For the first 20 years that I hiked long trails I never saw a non-northern euro face. Bizarre. Where did the world go? And there are my dear friends who are a lesbian couple who ,out of fear,were so careful to never allow anyone on the trail to know they were a couple. This is a reality. When people are systematically written out of history it’s time to ask questions and sit back and listen to the answers. Find out real history. Yes,things are starting to change but it’s slow and it’s new. 
> Read the experiences of people ( there are some good recent books and articles)who had to endure mindless nasty racist comments in town, at camp, in shelters. They shouldn’t have to feel grateful that it wasn’t worse.  Listen to the truth because if you have benefited from being the type of voice usually listened to, it is time now to be quiet. Calling what she said gibberish without asking her what she meant is at a minimum inappropriate. I want to know her references and what she is basing that statement on. For the most part I don’t need to ask because I already have seen it daily in my job and in my personal life. Just like I want to know the statistics you base your observations on concerning the lack maintenance. To me if the trail hasn’t been worked on in over a year it’s remarkable that it isn’t worse. In the East in my opinion the ATC should move every single trail crew to two or three states and clean up a dangerous mess.  But then again I’m not privy to the whole picture and that could be a mistake. I’m willing to hear what the experts say about it. 
> I’m guessing that when you walked out of town you didn’t worry that you might be followed( as one friend was) and have to hide so that your potential rapists could not find you.  She listened to them discussing her and what they were going to do. Maybe town’s people followed you into the woods to assault you. Did that happen? Then if it did you have had the same experience that many women have had or are a understandably afraid of having. 
> No one is disputing what you have given to the trail. Please do not dismiss other people’s experience. 
> If now current trail hikers are able to hike without being assaulted by racism or assaulted physically then I am cheering. This is new. I ,for one, am going to wait, watch and listen. And hope   And hike because it’s the best place to be. 
> Marmot
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 29, 2021, at 8:56 PM, JimLBanks at verizon.net wrote:
>> 
>> Marmot, the trail is open to anyone and my experience has been that the trail is probably one of the least racist and most welcoming places you could find.  Sure there are always some jerks on the Facebook trail pages, but I think most of them are just trolls and not really hikers.  Please read the blog post on the PCTA's website by Crystal Gail Welcome posted June 19, 2021.  This is her opinion of the trail:  "the parks and trails that people built are based on racist ideologies and practices.  Meaning they are, at their core, institutional."  To me this is just gibberish.  How in the hell was the building of the PCT based on racist ideologies?  If she feels that way I don't understand why she would want to hike on the trail.  The worst part of the post was the PCTA's introduction saying that "we stand behind her and as a result, we will not allow commenting for this post on social media."  I guess the PCTA's CEO thinks she has the power to trump the 1st Amendment.  What are they afraid of, that someone will point out the fallacy of her comments?  It also makes the PCTA look foolish when they say "we stand behind her" when she makes a comment that the trail was based on racist ideologies.  
>> 
>> The issue is why does an organization that was formed to maintain the trail have to spend precious resources on things not related to trail maintenance?  If people want to promote the use of the trail by minorities, then they should form an organization whose stated purposes is to do just that.  More power to them.  The Articles of incorporation of the PCTA state that the purpose of the PCTA is "the maintenance, conservation, and safe public use of the PCT."  Somehow, under the current administration, and without a vote of the members, the original language is no longer used, but rather has been replaced by the "Mission Statement" which provides that the mission of the PCTA is to "protect, preserve, and promote the PCT."  You may think the change is trivial, but it is not.  It completely drops the reference to trail maintenance and adds promote which allows for all kinds of various things depending on your interpretation.
>> 
>> While it is true that some of the backlog of maintenance is due to the Covid-19 pandemic restricting trail work, it is really just a small part of the backlog.  It has been building up for years because there are not enough volunteers to do the work.  You probably are aware of this, but for those who are not, almost all of the maintenance on the trail is done by volunteers.  Why is it that the PCTA has no employees that actually do trail maintenance?  It has approximately 30 full time employees.  The problem is that the entire model that the PCTA has for maintenance is flawed.  They have full time employees for everything but maintenance but leave the maintenance, the thing the PCTA was formed to do, to volunteers.  Now the volunteers do an absolutely fantastic job given the enormous job that it is and the relatively small number of us considering how long the trail is.  Just to head off any comments about well why don't you get out there, I have been doing trail maintenance since 2008.  I am one of the crew leaders for the Cajon Pass Chapter of the Trail Gorillas.  In 2018 I was awarded the Extra Mile Award for "remarkable volunteer service."  In 2020 I had the 4th highest number of hours of trail maintenance on the entire trail with 716 hours, and that was in a year that we were prevented from working for a good portion of the year.  See PCT Communicator Spring 2021 edition, page 21.  I have hundreds of hours so far this year.  So I think I can speak about this with some authority.  I welcome your statement that "this is a time to build the trail or contribute financially,"  (I assume that by build you mean maintenance).  However it would take a 20 fold increase, maybe more, in the number of volunteers to get the job done and we just don't see it happening.  There are a lot of old timers that have retired from trail maintenance recently and they are not being replaced.  This is the reason for the overgrown trail in the Grider Creek area that David was talking about in the original post.  The guy who use to organize projects in that area retired and no one replaced him.   
>> 
>> Your suggestion about running for the Board of the PCTA would be a good one, except that the system is rigged.  Ever notice that each year when we vote for Directors the number of people nominated always exactly matches the number of vacancies?  That is because it is the current board that does the nominations.  It is a closed system.  If the current board doesn't like your positions then you just never get nominated.  The board is hand picked by Liz Bergeron the CEO.  The By Laws only allow for one other way to get nominated.  You have to circulate a petition and have at least 100 other members in good standing sign it.  Now how many of us know 100 other members well enough to be able to communicate with them and send them an email or a letter.  And even if you did get 100 signatures I can guaranty you that the current administration would undermine you.  The current board, with maybe one exception, consists of people who are not trail maintainers, but rather, in my opinion, want to pump up their resumes.   
>> 
>> Instead of looking for and standing behind people who want to trash talk the trail, the PCTA should declare a maintenance emergency and devote all its resources to getting the maintenance level of the trail back to an acceptable standard. 
>> 
>> I-Beam
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: marmot marmot <marmotwestvanc at hotmail.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2021 5:08 PM
>> To: JimLBanks at verizon.net
>> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
>> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Western Section R
>> 
>> You’ve got to be kidding me. Since 1987, every time I was on any of the trails I wondered where the rest of the world went. No people of color.  Virtually every hiker out there was northern Euro decent and the vast majority male. That has just barely started to change. We should be celebrating the change not complaining (with no back up figures and statistics) that money is being diverted from trail maintenance to so -called extraneous expenses.  Each bit of education taught in a work place makes all us safer. It is not in any way unnecessary.  I saw the change in my industry.  I’m a painter in the Motion Picture Union so you can see what I mean. Understanding the issues makes all the difference in the world. 
>> I cheer every time I see the diversity of the hikers grow. I think it is magical. 
>> 
>> We have an over grown trail because of over a year of a challenging pandemic. It will take awhile to remedy. It’s hard in the meantime. It takes us all back in time when the trails weren’t finished and there were constant blow downs to crawl over. I walked through miles and miles of poison ivy and nettles that I had to beat back with my hiking stick on the AT in ‘91. The PCT ,in ‘94,luckily was finished but not very well maintained. I had ripped and repaired  hiking clothing from the needles in the  chaparral which covered hundreds of miles in southern Calif  Of course the CDT in ‘96 was just a southward ramble with map and compass hitting marked trail randomly about 1/3 of the way. I still feel lucky on each trail these days when the way is clear. I whine when they build stairs instead of switch backs. That’s just because I’m not a trail building expert and have to guess the reason for that is there might be a structural issue of which I am unaware. But,I still whine ‘ cause I hate stairs. I moan and complain every time I have to crawl over a downed tree. As my kid used to say when he was a teenager “ Oh Well !!”
>> I hope everyone remembers what the reality of why the trail maintenance is behind. We need to avoid inappropriate  transference from one practice( sensitivity training of all types that people often misunderstand and something that causes some people to be afraid) to a situation that has a different cause. We have all had to grow up and take a hard look at our preconceived ideas. 
>> This is a time to help build the trail or contribute to the PCTA financially. I’m sure there is a way to earmark a donation for trail maintenance only if you are worried. Ask the office. 
>> The other choice might be to run for the PCTA  board. I spend 16 years on the ALDHAWEST board. I didn’t alway agree with the final decisions by the board but at least I had input. Show up at PCT days. Help. Volunteer Hope to see you all at the next ALDHAWEST “in person” gathering or like I usually do—on some trail. I leave next week for my first long hike since this whole COVID mess started.
>> Can’t get the grin off my face
>> Marmot
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Jun 29, 2021, at 2:34 PM, JimLBanks at verizon.net wrote:
>>> 
>>> David, the trail conditions you describe are becoming more and more 
>>> common from one end of the trail to the other.  The original purpose 
>>> of the PCTA was to maintain the trail.  However,  the PCTA has become 
>>> an organization more concerned with "social justice" and sponsoring a 
>>> hiker who writes on the PCTA blog that the trail itself was built "on 
>>> racist ideologies and practices."  The PCTA gets almost $1 million a 
>>> year from the US Forest Service to maintain the trail, but spends its 
>>> money on more and more staff (none of which actually do trail 
>>> maintenance as their job), fancy offices, and racial sensitivity 
>>> training for the staff.  The trail maintenance volunteers are out 
>>> there busting their asses working on the trail, but there are just 
>>> not enough volunteers to get the job done, especially with all the 
>>> damage done to the trail in the last 10 years or so from so many huge devasting fires.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I-Beam
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Pct-L mailing list
>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
>>> To unsubscribe, or change options visit:
>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>>> 
>>> List Archives:
>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>>> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
>>> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>> 
> 