From barg at shaw.ca Thu Jul 1 14:10:47 2021 From: barg at shaw.ca (Marvin and Shirley Barg) Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 12:10:47 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] Organizational drift Message-ID: <000001d76eac$cd0a17e0$671e47a0$@shaw.ca> I like to think that my background of philosophy, history, theology, psychology, education, construction, quality improvement and yes, nursing (RN) (long story that involves far too many years in uni and an unhealthy tendency to change professions every 5 years.) has given me some ability to pontificate with a high degree of accuracy about most topics and trends. Despite all that, I know my place and it definitely is not one of influence. On the other hand, to borrow an quote from CS Lewis, "When the whole world is running towards a cliff, I want to be the one who is running in the opposite direction and appears to have lost his mind." My take. During the last few years, I've seen signs of organizational drift within the PCTA. Personally, I think it's due to institutional hubris. I believe it's condemnation of many in the hiking community who believed (and is now confirmed-indoor aerosolized C19 virus concentrations is responsible for infections) that it was safe to thru with common sense precautions, was a glaring signal as to how far the PCTA has become politicized. On it's current course, I predict the PCTA will gradually lose relevance. As the PCTA devolves, it will become even easier to acquire permits apart from the PCTA. Perhaps more local trail maintenance chapters will form 'to take care of the trail'. If, in 10 years, this prediction is bollocks, then perhaps the PCTA has found its way once again. GK From pctl at oakapple.net Thu Jul 15 10:35:49 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:35:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] northern California small hikes Message-ID: <202107151535.16FFZnCL020889@server-f.oakapple.net> As part my rehike of the PCT in bits and pieces, I'm thinking of filling in some gaps next week. Fires seem to be limiting the possibilities in sec M and N and anywhere in southern Oregon. But what about the following? J 24mi Ebbetts Pass to Blue Lakes P 18mi Gumboot to Dog trailhead Q 32mi Etna Summit to Paradise Lake or Buckhorn Spring I'm wondering if anybody has any recent updates to be aware of. There's nothing on the PCTA website. I'm not aware of any major fire or smoke issues in these immediate areas. In J, there was some hard ice on the north side of Raymond Mountain that blocked me last year in June. Should be less of an issue now. In Q, beyond Buckhorn Spring it's well known that the descent into Grider Canyon is a your worst nightmare come true. One mile of that from the other end was enough for me. Another option is to finish the Tahoe Rim Trail from Brockway Summit to Spooner Summit - 44 mi. David Hough From pctl at oakapple.net Thu Jul 15 23:21:16 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2021 21:21:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] through hiking bad for your health? Message-ID: <202107160421.16G4LGOS016398@server-f.oakapple.net> https://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/hiking-and-backpacking/how-get-most-out-every-hike/ Does the same apply on the Camino eating el menu del peregrino twice a day? From JimLBanks at verizon.net Tue Jul 20 21:07:21 2021 From: JimLBanks at verizon.net (JimLBanks at verizon.net) Date: Tue, 20 Jul 2021 19:07:21 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] Access Road Information References: <000401d77dd5$25209f80$6f61de80$.ref@verizon.net> Message-ID: <000401d77dd5$25209f80$6f61de80$@verizon.net> I will be starting a north-bound section hike in August at the trailhead just off Forest Road 23 north of Trout Lake, Washington. I will be parking my motorcycle at White Pass trailhead and then driving my truck down to the trailhead just off Forest Road 23. My question is does anyone have any information on the condition of Forest Road 23 north of where the trail crosses? The road continues on north to the town of Randle on Highway 12. Somewhere north of the trail crossing the road ceases to be paved. Anyone driven this lately? What was the condition? Thanks, I-Beam From pctl at oakapple.net Thu Jul 22 21:43:26 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2021 19:43:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] report from Dunsmuir Message-ID: <202107230243.16N2hQpG016242@server-f.oakapple.net> I didn't notice any obvious through hikers walking the streets of Dunsmuir today in 90+ heat. There was one guy with a pack hitching south near the freeway. If there were any others, they might have had a pretty smokey time in section O. P and Q ahead look clear of smoke for the time being. Brush and logs are definitely an issue in Grider Canyon and perhaps elsewhere. They might have been disappointed. The brewpub is supposed to be open unil at least 7pm, 5 days a week, but after arranging to be there today - they were closed Mon-Thurs this week only. The Burger Barn is closed Thursdays, too. The Pizza Factory, with a few craft brews on tap, and La Perla Mexican were open. The Dunsmuir Lodge was functional enough but a bit expensive by pre-covid standards for hikers, and shares many common faults with other older lodgings - not enough electrical outlets, not enough grounded electrical outlets. Today some people might have wished for a swimming pool. From gary at hbfun.org Fri Jul 23 16:29:40 2021 From: gary at hbfun.org (gary at hbfun.org) Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2021 14:29:40 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] report from Dunsmuir In-Reply-To: <202107230243.16N2hQpG016242@server-f.oakapple.net> References: <202107230243.16N2hQpG016242@server-f.oakapple.net> Message-ID: Thanks for reporting. It's a tough last couple of years. It's depressing how much of the Sierra has burned. Gary On 2021-07-22 19:43, David Hough reading PCT-L wrote: > I didn't notice any obvious through hikers walking the streets of > Dunsmuir today in 90+ heat. There was one guy with a pack hitching > south > near the freeway. > If there were any others, they might have had > a pretty smokey time in section O. P and Q ahead look clear of smoke > for the time being. Brush and logs are definitely an issue in Grider > Canyon and perhaps elsewhere. > > They might have been disappointed. The brewpub is supposed to be > open > unil at least 7pm, 5 days a week, but after arranging to be there today > - > they were closed Mon-Thurs this week only. The Burger Barn is > closed > Thursdays, too. The Pizza Factory, with a few craft brews on tap, > and La Perla Mexican were open. > > The Dunsmuir Lodge was functional enough but > a bit expensive by pre-covid standards for hikers, > and shares many common faults with other older > lodgings - not enough electrical outlets, not enough grounded > electrical > outlets. Today some people might have wished for a swimming pool. From mark at treecycler.org Sat Jul 24 14:49:13 2021 From: mark at treecycler.org (mark at treecycler.org) Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2021 14:49:13 -0500 Subject: [pct-l] FOUND nice sleep item Message-ID: <5df8104028c1b8ed2977d03f14effa7f@treecycler.org> I packed out a very nice sleep item from the high Sierra of California several miles off the PCT. Found July 11 or 12. Packed out on July 22. If you tell me the brand, colors, features and where you lost it I will return it to you. Email me directly. From laurie_h1234 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 24 18:52:10 2021 From: laurie_h1234 at yahoo.com (Laurie Hallum) Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2021 23:52:10 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [pct-l] report from Dunsmuir In-Reply-To: References: <202107230243.16N2hQpG016242@server-f.oakapple.net> Message-ID: <1771974524.596107.1627170730776@mail.yahoo.com> ? ? ?The good news is that a PCT crew that I was with made 2.85 miles of Grider Creek area trail so much nicer to hike. ?One could even find the trail. ?We worked brushing in the heat for five days with two in the crew in their 50's and three in their late 60's and mid 70's. ?I know that 2.85 miles doesn't seem like much compared to 2,650 miles, but if more people pitch in now that COViD restrictions have loosened, the trail can be made more easily traveled. ??Happy trails,Lady Pegasus On Saturday, July 24, 2021, 04:13:56 PM PDT, gary at hbfun.org wrote: Thanks for reporting. It's a tough last couple of years. It's depressing how much of the Sierra has burned. Gary On 2021-07-22 19:43, David Hough reading PCT-L wrote: > I didn't notice any obvious through hikers walking the streets of > Dunsmuir today in 90+ heat.? ? There was one guy with a pack hitching > south > near the freeway. > If there were any others, they might have had > a pretty smokey time in section O.? P and Q ahead look clear of smoke > for the time being.? ? Brush and logs are definitely an issue in Grider > Canyon and perhaps elsewhere. > > They might have been disappointed.? ? The brewpub is supposed to be > open > unil at least 7pm, 5 days a week, but after arranging to be there today > - > they were closed Mon-Thurs this week only.? ? The Burger Barn is > closed > Thursdays, too.? The Pizza Factory, with a few craft brews on tap, > and La Perla Mexican were open. > > The Dunsmuir Lodge was functional enough but > a bit expensive by pre-covid standards for hikers, > and shares many common faults with other older > lodgings - not enough electrical outlets, not enough grounded > electrical > outlets.? ? Today some people might have wished for a swimming pool. _______________________________________________ Pct-L mailing list Pct-L at backcountry.net To unsubscribe, or change options visit: http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l List Archives: http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/ All content is copyrighted by the respective authors. Reproduction is prohibited without express permission. From pctl at oakapple.net Sat Jul 24 23:12:42 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2021 21:12:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] section P[123] report Message-ID: <202107250412.16P4Cgsm028881@server-f.oakapple.net> On July 23-24 I backpacked from Gumboot trailhead to Dog Trailhead. 15 years ago this was a dayhike. Now it's an overnight. Trees - the trail is mostly remarkably clean. There was one tree down above 6000', not a barrier to man or beast. Around 3900' there were several trees down, one of which was a potential problem for stock - its sharp end pointed out across the trail, next to a steep brushy canyon. A hiker could shimmy around, stock I don't know enough to say. Water - Over this 18 miles there were only two spots with water near the trail. Burstarse Creek is barely flowing among pools that suggest water treatement before drinking. But it is flowing. Nice campsites near. Gully Spring is THE place. 2L/minute flow, lots of mud on the trail so you don't miss it, and no more water on trail for at least 12 miles. It's the first place in section P to meet Darlingtonia, and it's a spectacular display. As far as I can remember, Darlingtonia, a carnivorous plant, is only in section P, and it may be the only carnivorous plant on the PCT. A genuine USFS Interpretive Sign around Kangaroo Lake, further west on section P, indicated that Darlingtonia is very particular about its locale, and demands clean cold clear water. So seeing it near a spring is a good sign. The "Disappearing Creek 150 ft" sign tempted me to investigate, but I met a guy coming back with a full water bottle before I got far. I don't know how far he had to go or how difficult access was. Nice campsites nearby. There were other off-trail water sources that nobody I spoke to had investigated. Me neither. There were lots of family campers coming back from Seven Lakes, which is off the PCT. After passing their junction, I encountered few through hikers until late afternoon - when I realized that this was the time that hikers starting from Castle Crags would be arriving. At 5pm it was like the Santa Monica Freeway at that hour, at Gully Spring. After I left a deputy rattlesnake came out at the spring to disperse the loiterers. Rattlers get thirsty too. This whole trip was a scam. Weather promised clear air but the day I started switched to hazy and smoky through tomorrow (Sunday). But the wind shifted overnight and alleviated some of the smoke. David Hough From pctl at oakapple.net Sat Jul 24 23:16:54 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2021 21:16:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] a reason to go to Weed Message-ID: <202107250416.16P4GsB0003317@server-f.oakapple.net> After several misses I finally connected with the Mt Shasta Brewery which is located in Weed. The beer is good and the food is good but beware their kitchen closes pretty early on weekdays. There was a fair number of locals and a few other tourists today. And quite a few dogs, outdoors. This despite the 90 degree weather and orange skies. Everybody seemed to have a good time. David Hough From JimLBanks at verizon.net Sun Jul 25 20:43:44 2021 From: JimLBanks at verizon.net (JimLBanks at verizon.net) Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2021 18:43:44 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] A reason to go to Weed References: <000401d781bf$abe27280$03a75780$.ref@verizon.net> Message-ID: <000401d781bf$abe27280$03a75780$@verizon.net> The Mt. Shasta Brewery is a great spot, but every time I have been there it has been at least 90 degrees and the place doesn't have air conditioning. Another great brewery along the trail is Caldera in Ashland, Washington. Just off the freeway behind the Holiday Inn Express. They have dozens of their beers on tap. If you like a pilsner type beer with a low IBU, try the lawnmower beer. Very refreshing after a hot day on the trail and goes great with their pizza. I-Beam From pctl at oakapple.net Tue Jul 27 10:47:22 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 08:47:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] A reason to go to Weed Message-ID: <202107271547.16RFlME3003033@server-f.oakapple.net> Caldera in Ashland is great too. Last time I was there it was closed though for some reason. Maybe their day off. From pctl at oakapple.net Tue Jul 27 10:49:59 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 08:49:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] late bloomers Message-ID: <202107271549.16RFnxuj003077@server-f.oakapple.net> Though I'm not planning on any more long hikes, much less through hikes, I wonder - how many people 70 or older have had first through hike on a major trail at that age? The Grandma Gatewoods who have been doing it all their lives just keep on doing it, but is it even possible to keep up that level of exertion if you haven't been doing it? From pctl at oakapple.net Tue Jul 27 11:14:16 2021 From: pctl at oakapple.net (David Hough reading PCT-L) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 09:14:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [pct-l] middle of section Q Message-ID: <202107271614.16RGEGO6003715@server-f.oakapple.net> July 25 and 26 I dayhiked between Marble Valley, Paradise Lake, and the Tyler Meadows trail junction. I had planned to backpack but the iffy weather dissuaded me and it did rain a little bit last night in Yreka. Flowers - the flowers are still at peak state on the PCT in this region. Through hikers should capture the images to bolster them as they descend into Grider Hell the next day. Trees - only one tree down on the PCT between Marble Valley and Paradise Lake, and it was no trouble. After the Kelsey headwaters spring, there is a brief stretch of about a dozen trees across the trail in a fire zone. You could plainly see that none were obstacles to stock as stock had built bypasses for several of them. It was but a slight foretaste of what is to come in the descent to and ascent from Seiad Valley. And the trail here was not overgrown. Water - the creek next to the Marble Valley cabin was almost dried up and looked useless. Maybe there was other water nearby. The first good spring - in evidence from the through hikers gathered there late in the day - is WA1625, easily 4L/min. Paradise Lake is shallow, warm, and greenish in tint. Excellent for swimming but the water bears treatment perhaps. The outlet creek might be better than dipping in the lake. There is a small water source shortly after that is worth skipping. Kelsey Creek Tributaries is an excellent small creek, more than a spring, and not looking at all seasonal now, with at least 10L/min if you could capture all the branches. There is also a nice small source just before it running about 3L/min with a convenient drop for gathering water, but at a narrow spot in the trail. The trail junction marked Turk Lake Trail on halfmile is actually a junction to Bear Lake in the other direction and is marked with a bandaged sign. The trail down to Turk Lake from that point was not marked or obvious. Turk Lake didn't look worth the trouble. Access - for day hikers and section hikers and trail maintainers - the Paradise Trailhead is at 4850' and rises to 6200' in about 1.7 miles. It's about as nice as it could be within those parameters - shady and no steps, just very steep in most places. Lovers Camp parking has a couple of nice short walk-in campsites with tables and tent space and a clean outhouse in the parking lot. The trail up to Marble Valley is about 4 miles and mostly not steep, but where it is steep there are a lot of steps to make things easier for the stock packing parties up to Marble Valley and Sky High Lakes. It does have one wonderful water source - a little waterfall into a little pool next to the trail - which is less than a mile below Marble Valley but many steps below to climb back up. David Hough From rod at rodmiller.com Tue Jul 27 12:21:21 2021 From: rod at rodmiller.com (Rod Miller) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 10:21:21 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] late bloomers In-Reply-To: <202107271549.16RFnxuj003077@server-f.oakapple.net> References: <202107271549.16RFnxuj003077@server-f.oakapple.net> Message-ID: At 75 I completed a three piece sectional hike over a five year period of the Bibbulmun Track in Western Australia, 1K KM. https://www.bibbulmuntrack.org.au/ My last backpack was at 79, carried about 30 lbs 7 miles over 3 ridges, total elevation change was 1400 feet up and 1400 feet down. At 82 did that same trip this June with a 15 lb pack and the rest on a mule. Fires permitting I have plans for a short full backpacking trip later this year. On 7/27/21 08:49, David Hough reading PCT-L wrote: > > Though I'm not planning on any more long hikes, much less through hikes, > I wonder - how many people 70 or older have had first through hike on > a major trail at that age? The Grandma Gatewoods who have been doing it > all their lives just keep on doing it, but is it even possible to keep up > that level of exertion if you haven't been doing it? > _______________________________________________ > Pct-L mailing list > Pct-L at backcountry.net > To unsubscribe, or change options visit: > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l > > List Archives: > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/ > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors. > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission. > -- Rod Miller Handcraftsman === Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More http://www.rodmiller.com Guidelines for a civil discourse: Pay attention Listen Be inclusive Don't gossip Show respect Be agreeable Apologize Give constructive criticism Take responsibility Please pass them on. From JimLBanks at verizon.net Tue Jul 27 12:37:07 2021 From: JimLBanks at verizon.net (JimLBanks at verizon.net) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 10:37:07 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] A reason to go to Weed In-Reply-To: <202107271547.16RFlME3003033@server-f.oakapple.net> References: <202107271547.16RFlME3003033@server-f.oakapple.net> Message-ID: <000601d7830e$06211090$126331b0$@verizon.net> They are closed Mondays and Tuesdays. I-Beam -----Original Message----- From: David Hough reading PCT-L Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2021 8:47 AM To: JimLBanks at verizon.net; pct-l at backcountry.net Subject: Re: [pct-l] A reason to go to Weed Caldera in Ashland is great too. Last time I was there it was closed though for some reason. Maybe their day off. From gary at hbfun.org Tue Jul 27 19:18:50 2021 From: gary at hbfun.org (gary at hbfun.org) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2021 17:18:50 -0700 Subject: [pct-l] late bloomers In-Reply-To: <202107271549.16RFnxuj003077@server-f.oakapple.net> References: <202107271549.16RFnxuj003077@server-f.oakapple.net> Message-ID: <9bb989cfc1cf9984a0b579ab239d132e@hbfun.org> Lightened Up is no spring chicken and he's still grinding out LASHes like a kid. I can't keep up with him. No Doubt, I believe, started as a very late bloomer. Those two guys are monsters. Gary On 2021-07-27 08:49, David Hough reading PCT-L wrote: > Though I'm not planning on any more long hikes, much less through > hikes, > I wonder - how many people 70 or older have had first through hike on > a major trail at that age? The Grandma Gatewoods who have been doing > it > all their lives just keep on doing it, but is it even possible to keep > up > that level of exertion if you haven't been doing it? > _______________________________________________ > Pct-L mailing list > Pct-L at backcountry.net > To unsubscribe, or change options visit: > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l > > List Archives: > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/ > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors. > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.