[pct-l] Friend's of Bill on the PCT?
Nathan Frank
nathanfrank2 at gmail.com
Mon Mar 12 18:31:27 CDT 2012
Anybody friend's of Bill on here who know of AA meetings in or around trail
towns on the PCT or of any sober trail angels? Thanks.
nathanfrank2 at gmail.com
On Mon, Mar 12, 2012 at 1:00 PM, <pct-l-request at backcountry.net> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. A little Ruess (mark utzman)
> 2. map 6 (Carl Richardson)
> 3. Re: map 6 (Jim Banks)
> 4. Re: Contributing to Common Ground
> (Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes)
> 5. 2012 PCT Short Video Festival at the Kickoff (Ryan Christensen)
> 6. shoe size question (Ben Ulsh)
> 7. A Little Ben Rumson (Robert E. Riess)
> 8. Interested in Section Hiking the PCT? (Douglas P. Bouche)
> 9. Interested in Section Hiking the PCT? (Douglas P. Bouche)
> 10. To All Those Hikers in the Eugene Area! (Evan Blom)
> 11. Re: Contributing to Common Ground (Scott Williams)
> 12. Re: To All Those Hikers in the Eugene Area! (Lisa Peru)
> 13. Re: shoe size question (Scott Williams)
> 14. Re: shoe size question (Tim Gustafson)
> 15. Re: A Little Ben Rumson (CHUCK CHELIN)
> 16. Re: shoe size question (Scott Williams)
> 17. Looking for 1999 PCT thru-hiker "Troubadour" (Lawton Grinter)
> 18. Re: shoe size question (Hillary Schwirtlich)
> 19. Horse etiquette (Christopher Swope)
> 20. Re: Horse etiquette (Scott Williams)
> 21. Re: A Little Ben Rumson (Nathan Miller)
> 22. Feathered Friends Sleeping Bags for Sale from Spiderwoman
> (Jennifer Zuber)
> 23. A little A.A. Milne (Scott Williams)
> 24. Re: shoe size question (Eric Lee)
> 25. Re: How many socks? (dnlcyclone at aol.com)
> 26. Re: Anyone on the list from Virginia (giniajim)
> 27. Fw: Horse etiquette (Edward Anderson)
> 28. Re: Fw: Horse etiquette (Charles Williams)
> 29. Fw: Horse etiquette (Brian Brossmer)
> 30. Re: Fw: Horse etiquette (Edward Anderson)
> 31. Re: Fw: Horse etiquette (Edward Anderson)
> 32. Re: How many socks? (Bob Bankhead)
> 33. (no subject) (morgan rucks)
> 34. Re: shoe size question (ned at mountaineducation.org)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 11:56:39 -0700
> From: mark utzman <blackbelthiker at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] A little Ruess
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAJ9hrMVkB+BJPV4NW3+m-X2cM6kHpediZQo7HFKc-d=rn0yFyw at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> "I have not tired of the wilderness; rather I enjoy it's beauty and the
> vagrant life I lead, more keenly all the time. I prefer the saddle to the
> street car and the star sprinkled sky to a roof, the obscure and difficult
> trail, leading into the unknown, to any paved highway, and the deep peace
> of the wild to the discontent bred by cities.....Say that I starved; that I
> was lost and weary; that I was burned and blinded by the desert sun;
> footsore, thirsty, sick with strange diseases; lonely and wet and
> cold...but that I kept my dream!"
> Everett Ruess
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 12:03:31 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Carl Richardson <cprsurfer at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] map 6
> To: "Pct-L at backcountry.net" <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331492611.67262.YahooMailNeo at web161202.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> just wondering for the maps that are sold threw the PCTA website store,
> why there is not a map 6, and i there is where do i find it, and if there
> is not what maps can i supplement it with?
>
> -Carl
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 12:06:01 -0700
> From: "Jim Banks" <jbanks4 at socal.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] map 6
> To: "'Carl Richardson'" <cprsurfer at yahoo.com>, <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <000601ccffba$00a2a200$01e7e600$@rr.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Map 6 is not done yet. Rumor is that it will be done "soon."
>
> I-Beam
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
> On Behalf Of Carl Richardson
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 12:04 PM
> To: Pct-L at backcountry.net
> Subject: [pct-l] map 6
>
> just wondering for the maps that are sold threw the PCTA website store, why
> there is not a map 6, and i there is where do i find it, and if there is
> not
> what maps can i supplement it with?
>
> -Carl
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 12:24:00 -0700
> From: Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Contributing to Common Ground
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <828ABBD9-C455-421C-B13C-A70AFD267CD8 at santabarbarahikes.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
> I remember slowly coming to realize that my hike was not selfish. It
> was not even completely mine. The people I met who gave me rides and
> helped me a long the way were so grateful to me for what I was doing,
> for reminding them of dreams they meant to fulfill someday or
> bringing back memories of adventures they had forgotten over the
> years. Some saw in me possible answers to their own current problems,
> even though I really had no answers and didn't offer what I was doing
> as any kind of solution to anything. Most people were just really
> happy to meet someone doing something they always wanted to do and
> getting a little information on how to do it so they could start
> planning their own adventure. People followed my blog online as I
> hiked and said that I brought them something to look forward to in
> their own lives mired in workaday stuff. Your hike serves a purpose
> that isn't all about you.
> On Mar 11, 2012, at 10:00 AM, pct-l-request at backcountry.net wrote:
> >
> > Hey Miss Information, Day_Late here - remember me from '09.
> >
> > I think this is a great idea but I did have one issue with what you
> > said.
> >
> > to quote:
> >
> > "There
> > were times when I felt as if I wasn't contributing to the world
> > around me
> > though, and that bothered me. I imagine that there may be people
> > who want
> > to undertake a long hike, but may be stopped by a feeling that to
> > do such a
> > thing is "too selfish" to justify. "
> >
> > All I can say is that if more people started contributing a bit
> > less and
> > instead went out and did something to improve who they are the
> > world would
> > need many less contributors.
> >
> > If I hadn't been thru hiking, like you in 2009, I would have been
> > working.
> > Works great and all, but in the grand scheme of things every I do
> > at work
> > will end up in the landfill within 20 years. Spending 5 plus
> > months on the
> > PCT (and 5+ on AT too) has transformed me into a better person.
> > The value
> > to me and probably to society as well has been increased by my thru
> > hikes.
> >
> > We thru hikers should realize that we are soooo lucky and
> > privileged to be
> > able to do what we do. At my workplace I regularly have folks come
> > up to
> > me to discuss my ability to take 6 months off and go do something I
> > love.
> > With few exceptions most people just can't truly imagine the
> > possibilities. They haven't yet learned what is really important
> > in life.
> >
> > Day-Late
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 13:04:34 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Ryan Christensen <yosemiteryan at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] 2012 PCT Short Video Festival at the Kickoff
> To: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331496274.22579.YahooMailNeo at web111416.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
>
>
> Its that time of year again to submit your
> short Pacific Crest Trail related videos for the 2012 Pacific Crest Trail
> Short Video Festival at the Kick Off!?
>
> We are looking for short videos that are related to the PCT. We are not
> looking
> for videos that were mindlessly thrown together; we are looking for videos
> that
> have story?videos that show that you have something to say. For example:
> the
> video could be funny, painful, uplifting, scenic, adventurous?or even
> romantic.
> It could offer a vignette into a particular aspect of hiking the trail; it
> could explore a particular place or person; it could explore a particular
> incident?but the most important requirement is that it relates to the
> Pacific
> Crest Trail.
>
> Videos will be judged and four awards will be
> given out this year:
> * Best of Festival
> * Best Spirit of the PCT
> * Best Leave No Trace Message
> * Most Humorous
>
> For 2012 all videos MUST be under 10 minutes.
> It is a short video festival and we want to allow time for many different
> people to have their videos up on the giant tyvek screen at the Kickoff.
>
> Videos must be received by Friday April 13th. The preferred
> format to submit the video is via digital file. The file could be burned to
> disk and mailed in, sent via Dropbox or another file delivery service such
> as
> YOUSENDit.? Playable DVD?s will be
> accepted as well. It can be in wide-screen 16x9 or 4x3 aspect ratio. The
> total
> running time and the video-creators contact information should be written
> on
> the disk.
>
> The selection of videos to be
> shown is per the discretion of ProDeal. Submissions may be retained for
> future
> use or discarded. No DVDs will be returned. No video will be used for any
> other
> use without the permission of the video creator.
>
> Send your video submissions to:
>
> Ryan Christensen
> 874 Lee St.
> Apt. B
> Bishop, CA 93514
> ?
> Dropbox, YOUSENDit or another
> file delivery service: yosemiteryan at yahoo.com
>
> Again, they must be received by April 13th.
>
> We are looking forward to screening your creations!
>
> Ryan "ProDeal" Christensen
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 13:43:38 -0700
> From: Ben Ulsh <ulshbdbd at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CANOHRQXBAo2h07pCV4i+nBMMyqf-HiWXoRWy5YOePJ6t3RhfEw at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I am stocking up for a thru hike in 2013 and I am about to buy a pair or
> two of Brooks cascadias. I have one hang up though.....I don't know how
> what size to buy to account for feet swelling. It feels so wrong to buy a
> half size or even a size too big. It seems that if you buy a shoe that is
> too big you risk extra movement and slippage which could lead to blisters
> etc. I know I am over thinking this but if anyone can offer some wisdom
> about choosing the right shoe size to account for the inevitable swelling
> of a long distance hike that would be very much appreciated. Thank you all
> in advance!!
> Best,
> Ben
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 14:16:00 -0700
> From: "Robert E. Riess" <robert.riess at cox.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] A Little Ben Rumson
> To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <B9FDC1FA47B24BED9052D7D2A7515594 at RobertERiessPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Mud can make you prisoner and the plains can bake you dry,
> Snow can burn your eyes but only people make you cry,
> Home?s a place for coming from with dreams of going to,
> Which with any luck will never come true.
>
> Wandering Star from Paint Your Wagon
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 07:12:36 -0700
> From: "Douglas P. Bouche" <dpbouche at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] Interested in Section Hiking the PCT?
> To: "'pct-l'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <000001ccff91$035bcb30$0a136190$@net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> PCT Section Hikers:
>
>
>
> If you are an experienced backpacker and are interested in section hiking
> the PCT, two trips are planned for this summer. One is two weeks long from
> South Lake Tahoe (Barker Pass) up to Buck?s Lake from July 23 to August 6
> (resupply at Sierra City), the other is 1 ? weeks from Buck?s Lake to Old
> Station from August 25th to September 4th (resupply at Drakesbad Guest
> Ranch). Each trip averages 10 miles per day. Refer to
> http://www.backpacker.com/pct which is an excerpt from Backpacker
> Magazine.
> Section 25 (starting at Barker Pass) through Section 33 describe these
> trips.
>
>
>
> If you are interested in either or both of these trips, please send me an
> e-mail for more details.
>
>
>
> Doug
>
> dpbouche at earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 08:57:01 -0700
> From: "Douglas P. Bouche" <dpbouche at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] Interested in Section Hiking the PCT?
> To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <000501ccff9f$9907cd10$cb176730$@net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
>
>
>
> PCT Section Hikers:
>
>
>
> If you are an experienced backpacker and are interested in section hiking
> the PCT, two trips are planned for this summer. One is two weeks long from
> South Lake Tahoe (Barker Pass) up to Buck?s Lake from July 23 to August 6
> (resupply at Sierra City), the other is 1 ? weeks from Buck?s Lake to Old
> Station from August 25th to September 4th (resupply at Drakesbad Guest
> Ranch). Each trip averages 10 miles per day. Refer to
> http://www.backpacker.com/pct which is an excerpt from Backpacker
> Magazine.
> Section 25 (starting at Barker Pass) through Section 33 describe these
> trips.
>
>
>
> If you are interested in either or both of these trips, please send me an
> e-mail for more details.
>
>
>
> Doug
>
> dpbouche at earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 13:43:51 -0700
> From: Evan Blom <evanmblom at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] To All Those Hikers in the Eugene Area!
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAA6r_NPT8RH79Mwz5GHGWwk4XGQz=yLWxeznSg_-609GrUhWiA at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> I don't know if anyone on PCT-L has already set up a meeting in either
> Eugene or Springfield this year (I skimmed the archives, it didn't seem
> like it), so I would like to propose that all aspiring/past/current PCTers
> come meet up next week in Eugene if you're near! I was thinking that we
> should meet up at the Ninkasi Brewery this Friday, *March 16th* at 7:00 PM
> to talk about plans, gear, start dates, advice, fears, etc. The address is
> 272 Van Buren Street in Eugene. People from Portland, Salem, Bend, etc.
> please feel free to join us! The more the merrier. Please let me know if
> you can make it, email me at evanmblom at gmail.com, and if you have any
> other suggestions of times/places to go, feel free to suggest it.
>
> Thanks, and hope to see everyone there!
>
> Evan
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 15:04:47 -0700
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Contributing to Common Ground
> To: Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAGxcj108isem_2p26Ap+H2n5+2C-VpNZV+7Kr342UimTOtpzSQ at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Beautiful Diane, and particularly poignant on this blustery, grey day in
> Martinez, as I've just come down from a hike of the Franklin Hills above
> Muir's home. As he started off on his young man's Thousand Mile Walk to
> the Gulf, I'm sure the great walker had no idea where his vagabond, simply
> walking lifestyle would eventually lead, or how profoundly his writings
> would influence America. In a sense, each one of us provides a vicarious
> touch of a real life, an intense experience, to others who may never go
> further than a day hike, but will always dream of the great adventure. How
> incredible that we get to actually live it.
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 12:24 PM, Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes <
> diane at santabarbarahikes.com> wrote:
>
> > I remember slowly coming to realize that my hike was not selfish. It
> > was not even completely mine. The people I met who gave me rides and
> > helped me a long the way were so grateful to me for what I was doing,
> > for reminding them of dreams they meant to fulfill someday or
> > bringing back memories of adventures they had forgotten over the
> > years. Some saw in me possible answers to their own current problems,
> > even though I really had no answers and didn't offer what I was doing
> > as any kind of solution to anything. Most people were just really
> > happy to meet someone doing something they always wanted to do and
> > getting a little information on how to do it so they could start
> > planning their own adventure. People followed my blog online as I
> > hiked and said that I brought them something to look forward to in
> > their own lives mired in workaday stuff. Your hike serves a purpose
> > that isn't all about you.
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:05:06 -0500
> From: Lisa Peru <lisaperu2011 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] To All Those Hikers in the Eugene Area!
> To: Evan Blom <evanmblom at gmail.com>
> Cc: "pct-l at backcountry.net" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <9334A7D6-2F35-4BAA-97F8-0335A7DAF2D7 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Oh, I wish I were anywhere near. Ninkasi is the bestest!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 11, 2012, at 3:43 PM, Evan Blom <evanmblom at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hello everyone,
> >
> > I don't know if anyone on PCT-L has already set up a meeting in either
> > Eugene or Springfield this year (I skimmed the archives, it didn't seem
> > like it), so I would like to propose that all aspiring/past/current
> PCTers
> > come meet up next week in Eugene if you're near! I was thinking that we
> > should meet up at the Ninkasi Brewery this Friday, *March 16th* at 7:00
> PM
> > to talk about plans, gear, start dates, advice, fears, etc. The address
> is
> > 272 Van Buren Street in Eugene. People from Portland, Salem, Bend, etc.
> > please feel free to join us! The more the merrier. Please let me know if
> > you can make it, email me at evanmblom at gmail.com, and if you have any
> > other suggestions of times/places to go, feel free to suggest it.
> >
> > Thanks, and hope to see everyone there!
> >
> > Evan
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 15:23:11 -0700
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: Ben Ulsh <ulshbdbd at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAGxcj13Pd2h3YP+aEVqKN9RHMuddQMfLYnikEGNu=OyOrwkW-w at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Over the years, the more miles I put on my feet, the looser I've needed my
> shoes to be. I used to lace everything up tight when I wore boots and even
> some of the early street runners and trail runners. But I've come to
> really appreciate my foot flopping around in my shoe now, more like a loose
> sandal or a moccasin might be worn. They are supremely uncomfortable with
> any tension in the laces at all at this point, and the only time I really
> lace them up tight is when crossing a rushing stream where they can get
> snatched right off my feet by the current. The minute I hit the bank
> however, I loosen them immediately. That may not be where you're at with
> shoes, but believe me, too small, or too tight will cause trouble and
> blisters, whereas you may even come to liking looser shoes. The one caveat
> is that my feet are old and grizzled, and don't blister easily as I walk a
> lot. Yours may not be toughened yet, so go with what works, but remember,
> you can always buy the next pair at a trail town via the Internet or phone
> call and have it shipped General Delivery to your following stop, where
> they will be waiting for you in a larger size if that seems appropriate.
> After my feet grew from a size 9.5 (all my adult life) to their current,
> clownish, solid size 12, I had to give several brand new pairs away to a
> friend.
>
> Happy hiking,
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 1:43 PM, Ben Ulsh <ulshbdbd at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > I am stocking up for a thru hike in 2013 and I am about to buy a pair or
> > two of Brooks cascadias. I have one hang up though.....I don't know how
> > what size to buy to account for feet swelling. It feels so wrong to buy
> a
> > half size or even a size too big. It seems that if you buy a shoe that
> is
> > too big you risk extra movement and slippage which could lead to blisters
> > etc. I know I am over thinking this but if anyone can offer some wisdom
> > about choosing the right shoe size to account for the inevitable swelling
> > of a long distance hike that would be very much appreciated. Thank you
> all
> > in advance!!
> > Best,
> > Ben
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 15:37:16 -0700
> From: Tim Gustafson <tjg at tgustafson.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CACMcHMeAYYLuXrN31quLw0dwyruOTgdQq3JGi1PExN5KPMA=Xg at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> > After my feet grew from a size 9.5 (all my adult life) to their current,
> > clownish, solid size 12, I had to give several brand new pairs away to a
> > friend.
>
> Hah! If 12 is clownish, what are my feet, coming in at a solid size
> 15 (without even allowing for the +1 shoe size that everyone talks
> about after you've been hiking a while)?
>
> --
>
> Tim Gustafson
> tjg at tgustafson.com
> http://tgustafson.com/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 16:20:10 -0700
> From: CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] A Little Ben Rumson
> To: "Robert E. Riess" <robert.riess at cox.net>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CABc=HNknvPraOuRzMZyZG=CekrbXX6WmrspJyKD4ODgVzeAkOQ at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> Good afternoon, Bob,
>
> When Ben was told that there are two kinds of people ? those who stay and
> those who go ? he replied that that is wrong: There are two kinds of
> people, but they are those going somewhere and those going nowhere.
>
> Here?s to all of us who are going somewhere.
>
> That?s a great movie; filmed, by the way, near Baker City, OR. Where else
> do we get to see Mr. Macho, Clint Eastwood, singing a sappy love song?
>
> Steel-Eye
>
> -Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09/
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 2:16 PM, Robert E. Riess <robert.riess at cox.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Mud can make you prisoner and the plains can bake you dry,
> > Snow can burn your eyes but only people make you cry,
> > Home?s a place for coming from with dreams of going to,
> > Which with any luck will never come true.
> >
> > Wandering Star from Paint Your Wagon
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 16:40:29 -0700
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: Tim Gustafson <tjg at tgustafson.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAGxcj11twVGxF=Zn1gMK7W24fYsuMisKFH6r6fnndBmoK0mj2g at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> That would make yours uber clownish. The longer my feet, the better I hike
> and the funnier I get on trail!! Now that I've left those dainty 9.5s
> behind, I really get some speed. Count your blessings. The most beautiful
> feet on trail in 2010 belonged to Bigfoot who padded along softly on those
> size 15 or 16 boats. Now my 12's seem so insignificant. darn.
>
> Shroomer
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Tim Gustafson <tjg at tgustafson.com> wrote:
>
> > > After my feet grew from a size 9.5 (all my adult life) to their
> current,
> > > clownish, solid size 12, I had to give several brand new pairs away to
> a
> > > friend.
> >
> > Hah! If 12 is clownish, what are my feet, coming in at a solid size
> > 15 (without even allowing for the +1 shoe size that everyone talks
> > about after you've been hiking a while)?
> >
> > --
> >
> > Tim Gustafson
> > tjg at tgustafson.com
> > http://tgustafson.com/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 18:10:42 -0600
> From: Lawton Grinter <lawtong at hotmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Looking for 1999 PCT thru-hiker "Troubadour"
> To: pctl <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <BAY146-W32C1FD0FFE70176F533933A75B0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> Does anybody know how I could get in touch with 1999 PCT thru-hiker
> "Troubadour"?
> Thanks!
> -Disco
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 20:30:20 -0400
> From: Hillary Schwirtlich <hillary.schwirtlich at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CAKGf7Uu6yMHCgeu1G6HHUovNgtmt=mHe_oV=tT7mWYZT4HTtKA at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> i wore a 10 in brooks cascadia when off the trail i wear a 9 in the same
> shoe. Although now that I'm used to them being loose I think I'd be happier
> in a 9.5. :)
>
> Seahorse
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 7:40 PM, Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > That would make yours uber clownish. The longer my feet, the better I
> hike
> > and the funnier I get on trail!! Now that I've left those dainty 9.5s
> > behind, I really get some speed. Count your blessings. The most
> beautiful
> > feet on trail in 2010 belonged to Bigfoot who padded along softly on
> those
> > size 15 or 16 boats. Now my 12's seem so insignificant. darn.
> >
> > Shroomer
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Tim Gustafson <tjg at tgustafson.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > > After my feet grew from a size 9.5 (all my adult life) to their
> > current,
> > > > clownish, solid size 12, I had to give several brand new pairs away
> to
> > a
> > > > friend.
> > >
> > > Hah! If 12 is clownish, what are my feet, coming in at a solid size
> > > 15 (without even allowing for the +1 shoe size that everyone talks
> > > about after you've been hiking a while)?
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Tim Gustafson
> > > tjg at tgustafson.com
> > > http://tgustafson.com/
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 19
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 21:32:30 -0500
> From: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Horse etiquette
> To: Pacific Crest Trail List <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <CANTbeO6=dmOA+W+aJoiC=+K0WR0VD=uQ5AbfmTo5Jap9iqY70w at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Before my hike in 2010, I wish I had the sense to ask this list about
> proper horse etiquette before I hit the trail.
>
> Maybe one of the knowledgeable horse people on this list could go over
> what's expected of hikers and riders when they meet one another on the
> trail? I'm a little embarrassed to say, I still am not entirely sure what
> best practices are, other than:
>
>
> - don't scare the horse.
> - don't get kicked by a horse.
>
>
> Anyhow, someone is sure to be helped out with this info.
>
>
>
> Swope
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 20:56:34 -0700
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Horse etiquette
> To: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>
> Cc: Pacific Crest Trail List <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <CAGxcj12z6H_bzA66Le_WQBFS2UD6=gv+NNgjQMSAqqy1P=fmKQ at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> My horse loving friends taught me to pass a rider by waiting (or walking,
> if the trail is wide enough) on the downhill side of the trail when the
> path traverses a hill. We can usually scramble out of the way if a horse
> gets spooked whereas a rider and horse loosing its footing on the downhill
> side may cause serious injury to both as they tumble down a slope or
> cliff. A horse getting spooked and bolting up hill is not quit so
> dangerous.
>
> I also quiet my poles and voice and try not to look the horse in the eye
> right off as we are predator in the natural scheme of things -- two eyes
> that look straight ahead in a narrow field of vision -- and they are prey,
> -- eyes on both sides of their heads for a broader view of the world and
> predators.
>
> I'm one of those hikers who actually love seeing horses on trail. I don't
> mind the horse crap in the trail so much if it means seeing these
> magnificent animals ride past. I'm just a damn romantic where it comes to
> these great beasts. They are beautiful and I always get a thrill seeing
> horse and rider in the wilderness. Takes me back a few thousand years on
> the planet and is always a treat.
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 7:32 PM, Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Before my hike in 2010, I wish I had the sense to ask this list about
> > proper horse etiquette before I hit the trail.
> >
> > Maybe one of the knowledgeable horse people on this list could go over
> > what's expected of hikers and riders when they meet one another on the
> > trail? I'm a little embarrassed to say, I still am not entirely sure what
> > best practices are, other than:
> >
> >
> > - don't scare the horse.
> > - don't get kicked by a horse.
> >
> >
> > Anyhow, someone is sure to be helped out with this info.
> >
> >
> >
> > Swope
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 21
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 21:08:37 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Nathan Miller <erccmacfitheal at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] A Little Ben Rumson
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net, "Robert E. Riess" <robert.riess at cox.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331525317.59334.YahooMailClassic at web120401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Where are we goin' I don't know
> When will we get there I ain't certain
> All that I know is I am on my way!
> Where are we goin' I don't know
> When will we get there I ain't sure
> What will I get I ain't equipped to say
> But who gives a damn I'm on my way!
>
> -Nate the Trail Zombie
> Newberg, OR
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 22
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 21:25:19 -0700
> From: Jennifer Zuber <jennzuber at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Feathered Friends Sleeping Bags for Sale from
> Spiderwoman
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <CA+HfPTo-cbDw-NL7yBkM7ofNWZmcExMgTfaKMkC61=kx9fBf3g at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hey backpackers! I'm changing it up again and thought I'd see if any of you
> are looking for a sleeping bag. Thanks! Jennifer Spiderwoman Zuber
>
>
> 1. Sleeping Bag, Feathered Friends Vireo.
>
> 68" Vireo Bag. Hood snaps. Nanosphere fabric. Custom bag -- had a bit more
> down added to bring it to a 25-35 rating. It was used for a week and is in
> great condition. I'm selling because it's too narrow for me. Have original
> receipt.
>
> http://www.featheredfriends.com/Picasso/Bags/Layering.html
>
> $150 Firm.
>
>
>
> 2. Sleeping Bag, Feathered Friends Petrel.
>
> Purchased summer 2011. Used only once -- SHR for 3 weeks. Shoes froze solid
> but the bag kept me toasty warm! I'm selling because I got a dog recently
> and am going to go the quilt-route.
>
> Custom Bag (via conversations with Feathered Friends' Factory Manager):
> Less down in hood, more in torso. Overstuffed draft collar. Continuous
> baffling. 65%/35% split in down distribution (btwn top and bottom of bag).
> Pertex UL fabric (breathable, wind and water resistant, ultralight, allows
> bag to dry quickly).
>
> It has been stored very, very nicely -- in my closet in the oversized
> Feathered Friends bag. Has never been stuffed into a tiny stuff sack -- on
> the hike it was loose in the bottom of my pack, protected by a plastic
> garbage bag. It's in perfect condition. Have original receipt. Paid $530.
>
> http://www.featheredfriends.com/Picasso/Bags/Product/10Degree.html
>
> $450 Firm.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 23
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 22:05:16 -0700
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] A little A.A. Milne
> To: "<Pct-l at backcountry.net>" <Pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <CAGxcj10STquSjdbyD=2qMPcy-y1-+eDx8A-sEunSk+Mc=L1zLA at mail.gmail.com
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> This one always resonated with me as a little kid when my dad read it to me
> before bed. It fits my life so well now. Some of you old hippies may
> recognize Jefferson Airplane lyrics taken from this child's poem.
>
>
>
> Spring Morning
>
> Where am I going? I don't quite know.
> Down to the stream where the king-cups grow --
> Up on the hill where the pine-trees blow --
> Anywhere, anywhere. I don't know.
>
> Where am I going? The clouds sail by,
> Little ones, baby ones, over the sky.
> Where am I going? The shadows pass,
> Little ones, baby ones, over the grass.
>
> If you were a cloud, and sailed up there,
> You'd sail on water as blue as air,
> And you'd see me here in the fields and say:
> "Doesn't the sky look green today?"
>
> Where am I going? The high rooks call:
> "It's awful fun to be born at all."
> Where am I going? The ring-doves coo:
> "We do have beautiful things to do."
>
> If you were a bird, and lived on high,
> You'd lean on the wind when the wind came by,
> You'd say to the wind when it took you away:
> "That's where I wanted to go today!"
>
> Where am I going? I don't quite know.
> What does it matter where people go?
> Down to the wood where the blue-bells grow --
> Anywhere, anywhere. I don't know.
>
> A.A. Milne
>
>
> Shroomer
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 24
> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 22:09:22 -0700
> From: Eric Lee <saintgimp at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: "'Ben Ulsh'" <ulshbdbd at gmail.com>, <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <BAY145-ds1B9B9FED26644C87E1484BD5B0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Ben wrote:
> >
> It seems that if you buy a shoe that is too big you risk extra movement and
> slippage which could lead to blisters etc. I know I am over thinking this
> but if anyone can offer some wisdom about choosing the right shoe size to
> account for the inevitable swelling of a long distance hike that would be
> very much appreciated. Thank you all in advance!!
> >
>
> Feet are one of those things that are so individualistic that what works
> for
> one person may be horrible for another, so it's really up to the
> particulars
> of your own body.
>
> That said, I think the majority of blisters you'll see on new thru-hikers
> are caused by shoes that are too small, not shoes that are too big. I know
> that it's a long-accepted piece of conventional wisdom that shoes that
> slide
> around on your feet are the most common cause of blisters, and I don't know
> - maybe that's true, or was true in the boots-built-like-a-battle-tank era.
> But in my own experience of wearing lightweight boots and in meeting lots
> of
> people wearing trail runners, I don't think I've ever personally heard
> someone complain that their shoes were too big. Too small - oh yeah,
> plenty
> of times.
>
> If you've an avid runner or have a lot of long-distance hiking under your
> belt already then your feet might not spread out at all on your thru-hike
> (because they've already done all the spreading they're likely to do.) If
> this is your first major foot-powered adventure then you might see some
> significant increase in the size of your feet; or maybe not. Not everyone
> does.
>
> Since you still have a year to go, I'd suggest buying one pair of shoes
> that
> are maybe half a size larger than what you normally wear then start doing a
> lot of training hikes in them. Even if you live in an urban environment
> and
> can't easily hit the trails, you can still hike the sidewalks. See what
> your feet do and how the shoes feel. Once you wear out those shoes, decide
> if another half-size bump would be a good idea or not. I wouldn't buy
> multiple pairs of anything until you get closer to your departure date.
>
> Eric
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 25
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:55:41 -0400 (EDT)
> From: dnlcyclone at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] How many socks?
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID: <8CECE66904F6928-22D4-684B at webmail-m146.sysops.aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
> I'd have to respectfully disagree on the one pair of socks for 300 miles,
> than second pair for next 600. For Skurka, that may work, but I think
> we're getting a little carried away with the lightweight craze. If there's
> anything that you carry multiple of...carry multiple socks. You don't need
> multiple of any other article of clothing, but socks are one thing that it
> never hurts to have at least three pair. I used to do the 2 pair
> method...but I realized this: they're socks. They don't weigh much. It's
> nice to have dry, comfortable feet. To each their own for sure. If you
> can get by on one pair of socks, by all means do it. With four pairs of
> socks, you can be more proactive with changing socks up through the day,
> and really go a long way toward inhibiting blisters, etc. Before our
> daughter was born, my wife and I were in the ultralight category, but after
> our trip with our daughter, we learned that it's not that hard to carry a
> couple more "luxuries" and still pack
> light, if those luxuries weighed as much as a couple extra pairs of
> socks. If you end up not using the extra socks...send them home, but it's
> my guess that you'll be glad you had them. Uber-ounce-counting often leads
> to uber-overthinking, and ultimately sacrificing some basic necessities
> such as dry, healthy feet. Only my two cents. Getting jealous of all you
> hikers hitting the trail here in the next month. Hopefully we'll see some
> of you out there this summer!
>
> David Liechty (The Three Bears)
> www.backcountryfamily.blogspot.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 26
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 10:37:25 -0400
> From: "giniajim" <jplynch at crosslink.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Anyone on the list from Virginia
> To: "giniajim" <jplynch at crosslink.net>, <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <44633736BBE743858DDB590910275717 at HomePC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Thanks. Here's a comment that someone posted: "As a state park facility,
> this rail-trail would become a significant recreation and transportation
> resource for many thousands of County residents and for millions of
> Virginians."
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "giniajim" <jplynch at crosslink.net>
> To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 11:42 AM
> Subject: [pct-l] Anyone on the list from Virginia
>
>
> > Anyone on the PCT list from Virginia. I'd like to solicit your help with
> > advocating for a rails-to-trails project (involves sending a quick
> email).
> > Thanks!
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 27
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:06:15 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>, "pct-l at backcountry.net"
> <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331564775.3991.YahooMailNeo at web111613.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> ?
>
>
> Hello Christopher,
> ?
> I appreciate, since I am a rider,?that you inquired regarding horse
> etiquette. The advice that Schroomer gave you is excellent.
> I?can add some thoughts. All horses, like humans, are different. Some will
> react to seeing things that might not spook other
> horses - who might be spooked by something else. My horse, Primo, was not
> spooked by anything on the PCT except seeing llamas
> from the side view in Washington. He was terrified - went ballistic and
> ran off to escape at a full gallop. Sometime in his past?he must?
> have had a scary?experience. Perhaps a male llama had attacked him.
> Or,?when he was five, his original owner had rejected him from?
> endurance racing (he was too hard to ride in a race) and turned him loose
> on the desert north of Bend, Oregon. He might have experienced?
> angry stallions, ready to fight. They hold their heads high and their
> necks are almost vertical. Llamas, from the side, look like that.
> ?
> ?Something else that has spooked some horses (not Primo) is the sight of
> backpackers with HIGH packs. I have an equestrian friend who?
> ?had this specific?problem with her horse - who was OK with most
> everything else.?She had to spend the time to desensitize him to
> ?that.? I have had horses which also had that same problem.? The solution,
> if the horse suddenly stops and is obviously nervous on
> ?seeing your approach,is to?TALK to the rider - so the horse will realize
> that you are a person and not some strange horse-eating predator.
> ?
> ?Thanks, again, for asking,
> ?MendoRider-Hiker
> ?
> ?
>
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> To: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>
> Cc: Pacific Crest Trail List <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Horse etiquette
>
> My horse loving friends taught me to pass a rider by waiting (or walking,
> if the trail is wide enough) on the downhill side of the trail when the
> path traverses a hill.? We can usually scramble out of the way if a horse
> gets spooked whereas a rider and horse loosing its footing on the downhill
> side may cause serious injury to both as they tumble down a slope or
> cliff.? A horse getting spooked and bolting up hill is not quit so
> dangerous.
>
> I also quiet my poles and voice and try not to look the horse in the eye
> right off as we are predator in the natural scheme of things -- two eyes
> that look straight ahead in a narrow field of vision -- and they are prey,
> -- eyes on both sides of their heads for a broader view of the world and
> predators.
>
> I'm one of those hikers who actually love seeing horses on trail.? I don't
> mind the horse crap in the trail so much if it means seeing these
> magnificent
> animals ride past.? I'm just a damn romantic where it comes to
> these great beasts.? They are beautiful and I always get a thrill seeing
> horse and rider in the wilderness.? Takes me back a few thousand years on
> the planet and is always a treat.
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 7:32 PM, Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Before my hike in 2010, I wish I had the sense to ask this list about
> > proper horse etiquette before I hit the trail.
> >
> > Maybe one of the knowledgeable horse people on this list could go over
> > what's expected of hikers and riders when they meet one another on the
> > trail? I'm a little embarrassed to say, I still am not entirely sure what
> > best practices are, other than:
> >
> >
> >? - don't scare the horse.
> >? - don't get
> kicked by a horse.
> >
> >
> > Anyhow, someone is sure to be helped out with this info.
> >
> >
> >
> > Swope
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 28
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:30:27 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Charles Williams <charlesnolie at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: PCT list <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331566227.90252.YahooMailClassic at web160306.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> All good info.? But I'll add a couple things:? I saw on a pct video once a
> hiker wearing a lightweight poncho.? It was in extreme wind.? A lot of
> horses would come unglued watching a hiker approach them wearing a poncho
> in the wind.? Even though we use tarps to desensitize them it is something
> that is difficult to reproduce.?
> ?
> Also about standing on the down-hill side...that is excellent advice
> because of the reasons given.? But also if a hiker stands on the uphill
> side (where a predator would stand to stalk them) it could drive the horse
> to the outside and more fragile part of the trail.? More damage would be
> done by a horse on the outside edge of the trail than if they spooked to
> the uphill side of the trail.?
> ?
> QuincyRider
>
> --- On Mon, 3/12/12, Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: "Christopher Swope" <sswwooppee at gmail.com>, "pct-l at backcountry.net" <
> pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Date: Monday, March 12, 2012, 8:06 AM
>
>
> ?
>
>
> Hello Christopher,
> ?
> I appreciate, since I am a rider,?that you inquired regarding horse
> etiquette. The advice that Schroomer gave you is excellent.
> I?can add some thoughts. All horses, like humans, are different. Some will
> react to seeing things that might not spook other
> horses - who might be spooked by something else. My horse, Primo, was not
> spooked by anything on the PCT except seeing llamas
> from the side view in Washington. He was terrified - went ballistic and
> ran off to escape at a full gallop. Sometime in his past?he must?
> have had a scary?experience. Perhaps a male llama had attacked him.
> Or,?when he was five, his original owner had rejected him from?
> endurance racing (he was too hard to ride in a race) and turned him loose
> on the desert north of Bend, Oregon. He might have experienced?
> angry stallions, ready to fight. They hold their heads high and their
> necks are almost vertical. Llamas, from the side, look like that.
> ?
> ?Something else that has spooked some horses (not Primo) is the sight of
> backpackers with HIGH packs. I have an equestrian friend who?
> ?had this specific?problem with her horse - who was OK with most
> everything else.?She had to spend the time to desensitize him to
> ?that.? I have had horses which also had that same problem.? The solution,
> if the horse suddenly stops and is obviously nervous on
> ?seeing your approach,is to?TALK to the rider - so the horse will realize
> that you are a person and not some strange horse-eating predator.
> ?
> ?Thanks, again, for asking,
> ?MendoRider-Hiker
> ?
> ?
>
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> To: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>
> Cc: Pacific Crest Trail List <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Horse etiquette
> ?
> My horse loving friends taught me to pass a rider by waiting (or walking,
> if the trail is wide enough) on the downhill side of the trail when the
> path traverses a hill.? We can usually scramble out of the way if a horse
> gets spooked whereas a rider and horse loosing its footing on the downhill
> side may cause serious injury to both as they tumble down a slope or
> cliff.? A horse getting spooked and bolting up hill is not quit so
> dangerous.
>
> I also quiet my poles and voice and try not to look the horse in the eye
> right off as we are predator in the natural scheme of things -- two eyes
> that look straight ahead in a narrow field of vision -- and they are prey,
> -- eyes on both sides of their heads for a broader view of the world and
> predators.
>
> I'm one of those hikers who actually love seeing horses on trail.? I don't
> mind the horse crap in the trail so much if it means seeing these
> magnificent
> animals ride past.? I'm just a damn romantic where it comes to
> these great beasts.? They are beautiful and I always get a thrill seeing
> horse and rider in the wilderness.? Takes me back a few thousand years on
> the planet and is always a treat.
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 7:32 PM, Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Before my hike in 2010, I wish I had the sense to ask this list about
> > proper horse etiquette before I hit the trail.
> >
> > Maybe one of the knowledgeable horse people on this list could go over
> > what's expected of hikers and riders when they meet one another on the
> > trail? I'm a little embarrassed to say, I still am not entirely sure what
> > best practices are, other than:
> >
> >
> >?? - don't scare the horse.
> >?? - don't get
> kicked by a horse.
> >
> >
> > Anyhow, someone is sure to be helped out with this info.
> >
> >
> >
> > Swope
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
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>
> List Archives:
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> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 29
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:51:29 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Brian Brossmer <brian_f_b at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: "pct-l at backcountry.net" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331567489.24245.YahooMailNeo at web130203.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Regarding stepping downhill of the trail, from the Grand Canyon National
> Park Hiking Tips page (http://www.nps.gov/grca/planyourvisit/hike-tips.htm
> ):
>
> "
>
> Mules and Hikers
> MULES HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY.
> Several recent encounters between hikers and mules resulted in injuries to
> packers and the death of some mules. To ensure safety for yourself, other
> trail users, and mule riders, when encountering mules on the trails:
> * Step off the trail on the uphill side away from the edge.*? Is
> this a difference of horses v. mules, or between the steepness of the Grand
> Canyon v. (many parts of the) PCT?
>
>
> Additionally, NPS recommends:
>
> * Follow the direction of the wrangler. Remain completely quiet and
> stand perfectly still.
> * Do not return to the trail until the last mule is 50 feet (15
> meters) past your position."
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 30
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:58:33 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: Charles Williams <charlesnolie at yahoo.com>, "pct-l at backcountry.net"
> <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331567913.37222.YahooMailNeo at web111603.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Those are good points Charles. Another would be if you are carrying one of
> those very shiney sun umbrellas, especially if there is also wind,
> please close it if horses are approaching. Primo was very concerned when
> he saw one of those on Section B in So. Calif.
> ?
> MendoRider-Hiker
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Charles Williams <charlesnolie at yahoo.com>
> To: PCT list <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 8:30 AM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
>
> All good info.? But I'll add a couple things:? I saw on a pct video once a
> hiker wearing a lightweight poncho.? It was in extreme wind.? A lot of
> horses would come unglued watching a hiker approach them wearing a poncho
> in the wind.? Even though we use tarps to desensitize them it is something
> that is difficult to reproduce.?
> ?
> Also about standing on the down-hill side...that is excellent advice
> because of the reasons given.? But also if a hiker stands on the uphill
> side (where a predator would stand to stalk them) it could drive the horse
> to the outside and more fragile part of the trail.? More damage would be
> done by a horse on the outside edge of the trail than if they spooked to
> the uphill side of the trail.?
> ?
> QuincyRider
>
> --- On Mon, 3/12/12, Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: "Christopher Swope" <sswwooppee at gmail.com>, "pct-l at backcountry.net" <
> pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Date: Monday, March 12, 2012, 8:06 AM
>
>
> ?
>
>
> Hello Christopher,
> ?
> I appreciate, since I am a rider,?that you inquired regarding horse
> etiquette. The advice that Schroomer gave you is excellent.
> I?can add some thoughts. All horses, like humans, are different. Some will
> react to seeing things that might not spook other
> horses - who might be spooked by something else. My horse, Primo, was not
> spooked by anything on the PCT except seeing llamas
> from the side view in Washington. He was terrified - went ballistic and
> ran off to escape at a full gallop. Sometime in his past?he must?
> have had a scary?experience. Perhaps a male llama had attacked him.
> Or,?when he was five, his original owner had rejected him from?
> endurance racing (he was too hard to ride in a race) and turned him loose
> on the desert north of Bend, Oregon. He might have experienced?
> angry stallions, ready to fight. They hold their heads high and their
> necks are almost vertical. Llamas, from the side, look like that.
> ?
> ?Something else that has spooked some horses (not Primo) is the sight of
> backpackers with HIGH packs. I have an equestrian friend who?
> ?had this specific?problem with her horse - who was OK with most
> everything else.?She had to spend the time to desensitize him to
> ?that.? I have had horses which also had that same problem.? The solution,
> if the horse suddenly stops and is obviously nervous on
> ?seeing your approach,is to?TALK to the rider - so the horse will realize
> that you are a person and not some strange horse-eating predator.
> ?
> ?Thanks, again, for asking,
> ?MendoRider-Hiker
> ?
> ?
>
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> To: Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com>
> Cc: Pacific Crest Trail List <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Horse etiquette
> ?
> My horse loving friends taught me to pass a rider by waiting (or walking,
> if the trail is wide enough) on the downhill side of the trail when the
> path traverses a hill.? We can usually scramble out of the way if a horse
> gets spooked whereas a rider and horse loosing its footing on the downhill
> side may cause serious injury to both as they tumble down a slope or
> cliff.? A horse getting spooked and bolting up hill is not quit so
> dangerous.
>
> I also quiet my poles and voice and try not to look the horse in the eye
> right off as we are predator in the natural scheme of things -- two eyes
> that look straight ahead in a narrow field of vision -- and they are prey,
> -- eyes on both sides of their heads for a broader view of the world and
> predators.
>
> I'm one of those hikers who actually love seeing horses on trail.? I don't
> mind the horse crap in the trail so much if it means seeing these
> magnificent
> animals ride past.? I'm just a damn romantic where it comes to
> these great beasts.? They are beautiful and I always get a thrill seeing
> horse and rider in the wilderness.? Takes me back a few thousand years on
> the planet and is always a treat.
>
> Shroomer
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 7:32 PM, Christopher Swope <sswwooppee at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Before my hike in 2010, I wish I had the sense to ask this list about
> > proper horse etiquette before I hit the trail.
> >
> > Maybe one of the knowledgeable horse people on this list could go over
> > what's expected of hikers and riders when they meet one another on the
> > trail? I'm a little embarrassed to say, I still am not entirely sure what
> > best practices are, other than:
> >
> >
> >?? - don't scare the horse.
> >?? - don't get
> kicked by a horse.
> >
> >
> > Anyhow, someone is sure to be helped out with this info.
> >
> >
> >
> > Swope
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> > Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 31
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 09:12:27 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
> To: Brian Brossmer <brian_f_b at yahoo.com>, "pct-l at backcountry.net"
> <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <1331568747.32042.YahooMailNeo at web111614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> That Grand Canyon advise would obviously?also apply if there is a drop-off
> below the trail on the PCT. Don't risk falling over a cliff. ?But, there
> would be no difference between mule's and
> horse's reactions to your standing ABOVE them. If it is at all possible,
> stand BELOW the trail. Standing higher up can be scary to some horses and
> mules. If there is a drop-off below the trail, and you are above it, you
> could spook the horse and cause a fall.
> ?
> MendoRider-Hiker
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Brian Brossmer <brian_f_b at yahoo.com>
> To: "pct-l at backcountry.net" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 8:51 AM
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Horse etiquette
>
> Regarding stepping downhill of the trail, from the Grand Canyon National
> Park Hiking Tips page (http://www.nps.gov/grca/planyourvisit/hike-tips.htm
> ):
>
> "
>
> Mules and Hikers
> MULES HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY.
> Several recent encounters between hikers and mules resulted in injuries to
> packers and the death of some mules. To ensure safety for yourself, other
> trail users, and mule riders, when encountering mules on the trails:
> ??? * Step off the trail on the uphill side away from the edge.*? Is this
> a difference of horses v. mules, or between the steepness of the Grand
> Canyon v. (many parts of the) PCT?
>
>
> Additionally, NPS recommends:
>
> ??? * Follow the direction of the wrangler. Remain completely quiet and
> stand perfectly still.
> ??? * Do not return to the trail until the last mule is 50 feet (15
> meters) past your position."
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 32
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 09:35:28 -0700
> From: "Bob Bankhead" <wandering_bob at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] How many socks?
> To: <dnlcyclone at aol.com>, <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <003801cd006e$22a56680$67f03380$@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Totally agree with you, David.
>
> Clean, dry socks - or relatively clean, dry socks - go a long ways toward
> preventing blisters and keeping feet clean and dry.
>
> I always carry at least three pair; two pair for hiking and one pair
> reserved only for sleeping. Type and thickness change with the hiking
> conditions anticipated.
>
> I change my hiking sock every other hour if hiking uphill or on the level;
> every hour if hiking downhill (more slippage and friction on the foot going
> downhill). I rinse out the pair not in use whenever possible and let them
> dry on my pack as I walk. Unfortunately, the weather will not always allow
> for drying. Damp and clean beats dry but dirty. Trailside laundry in camp
> as
> needed - 2 drops of Dr. Bonners soap in a 1 gallon ziplock bag, add 2
> liters
> creek water, add socks, seal, shake vigorously. Let stand for a few
> minutes.
> Repeat. Drain, Rinse well. Wring dry and hang to finish drying. My feet are
> happier and the flowers no longer wilt when I walk past them.
>
> Wandering Bob
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
> On Behalf Of dnlcyclone at aol.com
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 5:56 AM
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] How many socks?
>
>
> I'd have to respectfully disagree on the one pair of socks for 300 miles,
> than second pair for next 600. For Skurka, that may work, but I think
> we're
> getting a little carried away with the lightweight craze. If there's
> anything that you carry multiple of...carry multiple socks. You don't need
> multiple of any other article of clothing, but socks are one thing that it
> never hurts to have at least three pair. I used to do the 2 pair
> method...but I realized this: they're socks. They don't weigh much. It's
> nice to have dry, comfortable feet. To each their own for sure. If you
> can
> get by on one pair of socks, by all means do it. With four pairs of socks,
> you can be more proactive with changing socks up through the day, and
> really
> go a long way toward inhibiting blisters, etc. Before our daughter was
> born, my wife and I were in the ultralight category, but after our trip
> with
> our daughter, we learned that it's not that hard to carry a couple more
> "luxuries" and still pack light, if those luxuries weighed as much as a
> couple extra pairs of socks. If you end up not using the extra
> socks...send
> them home, but it's my guess that you'll be glad you had them.
> Uber-ounce-counting often leads to uber-overthinking, and ultimately
> sacrificing some basic necessities such as dry, healthy feet. Only my two
> cents. Getting jealous of all you hikers hitting the trail here in the
> next
> month. Hopefully we'll see some of you out there this summer!
>
> David Liechty (The Three Bears)
> www.backcountryfamily.blogspot.com
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
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>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
> Reproduction is prohibited without express permission.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 33
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 09:54:01 -0700
> From: morgan rucks <rucksmtr at msn.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] (no subject)
> To: <cs at nols.edu>, <fouromeara at jps.net>, <pappy at bu.edu>,
> <passion4fashion at hotmail.com>, <plupus at callatg.com>,
> <pct-l at mailman.backcountry.net>, <rangerphil at sbcglobal.net>
> Message-ID: <BLU129-W14E18C1B168661B5AA095AD25B0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> http://promptcmds.com/blog/wp-content/plugins/info.php?beneath176.bmp
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 34
> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 09:59:13 -0700
> From: <ned at mountaineducation.org>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
> To: "Scott Williams" <baidarker at gmail.com>, "Ben Ulsh"
> <ulshbdbd at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID: <BA4BF804E4E94F2783E5C3997CD1936C at PacificCrestPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> I don't know why it works for my wife and myself, but in 30 years of
> teaching wilderness skills courses, we have always used one size bigger
> than
> our feet and laced up "comfortably." Our feet have never gotten bigger
> since
> high school...
>
>
>
> "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
>
> Ned Tibbits, Director
> Mountain Education
> South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> P: 888-996-8333
> F: 530-541-1456
> C: 530-721-1551
> http://www.mountaineducation.org
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Williams" <baidarker at gmail.com>
> To: "Ben Ulsh" <ulshbdbd at gmail.com>
> Cc: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 3:23 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] shoe size question
>
>
> > Over the years, the more miles I put on my feet, the looser I've needed
> my
> > shoes to be. I used to lace everything up tight when I wore boots and
> > even
> > some of the early street runners and trail runners. But I've come to
> > really appreciate my foot flopping around in my shoe now, more like a
> > loose
> > sandal or a moccasin might be worn. They are supremely uncomfortable
> with
> > any tension in the laces at all at this point, and the only time I really
> > lace them up tight is when crossing a rushing stream where they can get
> > snatched right off my feet by the current. The minute I hit the bank
> > however, I loosen them immediately. That may not be where you're at with
> > shoes, but believe me, too small, or too tight will cause trouble and
> > blisters, whereas you may even come to liking looser shoes. The one
> > caveat
> > is that my feet are old and grizzled, and don't blister easily as I walk
> a
> > lot. Yours may not be toughened yet, so go with what works, but
> remember,
> > you can always buy the next pair at a trail town via the Internet or
> phone
> > call and have it shipped General Delivery to your following stop, where
> > they will be waiting for you in a larger size if that seems appropriate.
> > After my feet grew from a size 9.5 (all my adult life) to their current,
> > clownish, solid size 12, I had to give several brand new pairs away to a
> > friend.
> >
> > Happy hiking,
> >
> > Shroomer
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 1:43 PM, Ben Ulsh <ulshbdbd at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi everyone,
> >>
> >> I am stocking up for a thru hike in 2013 and I am about to buy a pair or
> >> two of Brooks cascadias. I have one hang up though.....I don't know how
> >> what size to buy to account for feet swelling. It feels so wrong to buy
> >> a
> >> half size or even a size too big. It seems that if you buy a shoe that
> >> is
> >> too big you risk extra movement and slippage which could lead to
> blisters
> >> etc. I know I am over thinking this but if anyone can offer some wisdom
> >> about choosing the right shoe size to account for the inevitable
> swelling
> >> of a long distance hike that would be very much appreciated. Thank you
> >> all
> >> in advance!!
> >> Best,
> >> Ben
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >> All content is copyrighted by the respective authors.
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> >>
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> End of Pct-L Digest, Vol 51, Issue 13
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