[pct-l] Pct-L Suggestions for place to park for > 2 wks and ride to Campo
William Cahal
pctfreak at gmail.com
Mon Mar 14 02:08:55 CDT 2011
Greetings all
Myself and a friend will be attempting, once again to section hike the first
115-150 miles starting in Campo..
Attempted this in April 2010, but my partner thought it would be fun to
break his foot about 12 miles in.
Needless to say, we had to abort (the wimp).
Anyway we are planning to start on April 3rd, but the person that was going
to help us with transportation is unable to do so,
so we are looking for some help. We were planning on parking the truck
somewhere around Warner Springs, then would like
to get a ride down to Campo.
Any ideas, thoughts, help, would be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks......... William (Freak)
On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:30 PM, <pct-l-request at backcountry.net> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality of
> the
> whole mess (Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes)
> 2. Re: Large Scale Maps (dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com)
> 3. Re: Traction--Katoola choices (dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com)
> 4. Rides to & from ADZPCTKO offered (Edward Anderson)
> 5. Avoiding Bear Problems (CHUCK CHELIN)
> 6. Trail Angel (jomike at cot.net)
> 7. Re: Pack weight? (Gerry Zamora)
> 8. Re: Pack weight? (Gerry Zamora)
> 9. List down again? (Alphabetsoup)
> 10. Resupplies (Csilla Tabor)
> 11. Re: Magic Moleskin-CORRECTION (tom aterno)
> 12. Kerosene/ fuels in general (Benjamin Grunbaum)
> 13. Re: Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality of the
> whole mess (Scott Williams)
> 14. Re: Traction--Katoola choices (Jason Moores)
> 15. Mt San Jacinto and 5 others - Feb 28,2011 (mikea)
> 16. Re: Traction--Katoola choices (ned at mountaineducation.org)
> 17. One Last Joke (again) (abiegen at cox.net)
> 18. Re: List down again? (Bob Bankhead)
> 19. Re: Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality of the
> whole mess (Gerry Zamora)
> 20. Re: Large Scale Maps (CHUCK CHELIN)
> 21. Re: Best iphone gps app (Will M)
> 22. Re: Best iphone gps app (Paul Robison)
> 23. Re: Best iphone gps app (Jim Keener ( J J ))
> 24. Re: Best iphone gps app (Halfmile)
> 25. ADZPCTKO (Alphabetsoup)
> 26. Re: Best iphone gps app (Ron)
> 27. Re: ADZPCTKO (Kevin Renfrow)
> 28. Re: ADZPCTKO (Alphabetsoup)
> 29. Re: ADZPCTKO (Randy Forsland)
> 30. Re: ADZPCTKO (Eric)
> 31. Re: ADZPCTKO (Kevin Renfrow)
> 32. Re: Resupplies (Kevin Renfrow)
> 33. Re: One Last Joke (again) (Austin Williams)
> 34. Fw: Rides to & from ADZPCTKO offered (Edward Anderson)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 06:31:55 -0800
> From: Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality
> of the whole mess
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <037C3FF9-A5C7-424D-A5A7-A92FCD5C34E0 at santabarbarahikes.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
> Granted I went through in 2008, a normal snow year, but this does not
> mirror my experience at all.
>
> Mornings were lucky to have that nice consolidated snow that your
> feet stick to. But within a few hours or less, it was soft and a
> little bit slippery.
>
> Most of the time there were deep sun cups. You step on the ridges,
> not in the cups. The only "postholing" on sun cups would be to step
> in the cups.
>
> Approaching a pass, the snow became more expansive, hiding the trail.
> It was wet but firm. I never postholed unless I stepped too close to
> a big boulder.
>
> Going over a pass too early meant the snow could be icy on the north
> side. At that time, the traction aids would be useful. Crampons are
> really hard to walk on over rocks and the snow was usually patchy,
> forcing you to walk a long way over rocks, then a ways over snow,
> then back to rocks. If your crampons weren't easy to put on and take
> off, it was likely you wouldn't bother with them. This could be a
> mistake.
>
> Most of the time, traction aids were not needed unless you summitted
> a pass too early and someone had glissaded on their bottoms all over
> the north side leaving only ice chutes to walk on. Without crampons,
> you'll either slide in the ice chutes, which hurt and aren't fun, or
> you'll have to sit up there for a few hours and wait.
>
> Going over a pass later in the afternoon meant my feet got a lot
> wetter in the wet snow. I still rarely postholed. Maybe it was
> because I am short, small and relatively light (compared to a larger
> man with a larger pack.)
>
> So, the conditions vary a lot depending on what the snow is like. I'd
> say if you get to Forester and it's just a bunch of sun cups to the
> base, a bit of clear trail, and a small, no-big-deal snowfield at the
> top that leaves you wondering what all the fuss is about, then you
> probably won't have the kind of experience Ned described.
>
>
> On Mar 11, 2011, at 8:56 PM, pct-l-request at backcountry.net wrote:
>
> > Consider this daily, Springtime Sierra scenario:
> >
> > It was almost freezing last night, so you get started in the
> > morning on a
> > light crust of hardened and consolidated snow that is easy to walk
> > on when
> > the going is flat. But, of course, most of the route (note, not
> > "trail,"
> > since we are almost always going up or down in the Sierras) is not
> > only not
> > flat, but sloped either up, down, or sideways to one degree or too
> > many. So,
> > you have to be a little cautious with every step since the outer snow
> > surface is slippery (depending on your footwear, its lug pattern
> > and depth,
> > and whether you have any traction aide device available). Now,
> > think, have
> > you ever walked on an ice arena; now, tip it a little bit...).
> >
> > Within a few hours, or maybe even just one, depending on how
> > intense the sun
> > is, whether the thaw has truly started, if you are in shade, the
> > aspect of
> > the slope you are on, and the proximity of the submerged objects just
> > beneath your feet that have been warming, too, the surface of the
> > snow will
> > start softening, half an inch, an inch, two inches, then as time
> > goes by
> > (maybe by 9 or 10 o'clock in the morning, you will find yourself
> > popping
> > through the recent freeze-layer that is beneath the surface freeze-
> > layer to
> > greater depths on your leg, which is what we affectionately call,
> > "post-holing."
> >
> > Ok, at first this is no big deal. You have soft-soled trail runners
> > on with
> > low "dirty-girl" gaitors that rise up to just above your ankles and
> > at this
> > point you only feel the cold and wet of the snow against your lower
> > legs
> > since you're wearing shorts. You've got your microspikes on and you're
> > primarily concerned about choosing a route up the south side of
> > Mather Pass.
> > The snow is still "good" and you only pop through to mid-shin once
> > in a
> > while, sometimes noticing rocks at the bottom of the holes. Edge
> > control up
> > the Pass was a serious issue, but you make it and celebrate on top
> > with
> > friends.
> >
> > Now it is about noon and hot. When you start out again, the snow is
> > very
> > slippery because of how loose and wet it has become on top and you
> > post-hole
> > almost immediately once you leave the dry haven you enjoyed for
> > lunch on top
> > of a big, flat boulder. No big deal. "I'll just glissade my way
> > down to the
> > dry trail below," is your plan. Just to get over to the crest of
> > the slope
> > where you can begin a, hopefully, safe slide down that pitch, you
> > have to
> > suffer through several deep posts that rise above the knees. You
> > also look
> > ahead and see that once the glissade-able pitch ends, you will have
> > 4 or 5
> > miles of moderately sloped snow "over" which to walk on suncups in the
> > afternoon sun. Joy!
> >
> > As you post awhile in the noon sun-warmed snow, you realize that
> > the inner,
> > lower layer of old frozen snow seriously scrapes your legs, almost
> > to the
> > point of cutting them in numerous places. You ignore it, largely,
> > because
> > your legs are numb to a degree, anyway. You struggle out of one
> > post hole
> > just to plunge into the next, however this time your leg slides
> > down the
> > granite edge of a large, submerged boulder that you didn't notice
> > as it was
> > just a hump in the surface snow. Your leg is stuck beneath it and
> > bleeding.
> > With a little wrestling and rolling about on the snow, you are able
> > to get
> > out of the hole and do a damage assessment. You'll be fine, but
> > cursing
> > nevertheless.
> >
> > How to avoid such a routine, daily injury? Wear taller gaitors and
> > pants
> > that will protect your legs from abrasion and the sun. Consider
> > starting
> > your hike earlier in the season so that you cruise through the high
> > elevation snow while it is still hard, before the thaw starts
> > (don't forget,
> > once the thaw starts and finds you in the deep, long canyons of the
> > Sierra
> > where there is lots of collective run-off, the creeks will become
> > deep,
> > fast, and dangerous to the untrained and unpracticed) and post-holing
> > becomes a daily mess. Consider starting your day earlier so that
> > you not
> > only get over the Pass while the snow is hard, but you can get down
> > and over
> > the 5-mile descent to "dry" trail before post-holing starts. Do not go
> > faster in slippery conditions for obvious reasons. Reduce your
> > daily mileage
> > needs. Double your food intake so you have the energy to deal, make
> > sound
> > decisions, and think before you move ahead.
> >
> > Mountain Education video-documented this whole daily routine last year
> > during "thru hiker season" (still tied up in production) over each
> > of the
> > major Sierra Passes from Cottonwood to Muir, complete with showing the
> > skills to safely climb and descend the Passes and cross the creeks.
> > We've
> > been teaching Sierra snow-travel safety since 1982. Been there,
> > done that,
> > now want to help other be safer out there. Now it is your turn as a
> > PCT thru
> > hiker, 2011--listen to, take, and apply our advice and experience
> > to your
> > trip preparation and daily choices or not. What was written above
> > is usually
> > the "reality" of the day in the high, Spring Sierra.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 07:34:21 -0700
> From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Large Scale Maps
> To: <halfmile at pctmap.net>, "'CHUCK CHELIN'" <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> Cc: 'PCT-L' <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <9ABFE1051D0A41669A452A0BED57B872 at DB2>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
>
> Chuck - this 1:500k seems like it might be the scale I am looking for.
>
> 1. Do you need multiple maps at this scale to cover a section, how many
> approx for a section?
> 2. Are the maps good at showing access roads etc. in case of bailout or
> re-supply?
> 3. Did you have to overlay the PCT on your 1:500K maps or did it come with
> that when you bought the software?
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: loncooper at gmail.com [mailto:loncooper at gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> Halfmile
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 8:44 AM
> To: CHUCK CHELIN
> Cc: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; PCT-L
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Large Scale Maps
>
> Steel-Eye,
> I will look into doing this. Does this scale typically cover a PCT
> section on a single page?
> -Halfmile
>
> On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 7:27 AM, CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> wrote:
> > Good morning,
> >
> > For the large-view purpose you describe I prefer to carry prints of USGS
> > 1:500,000 maps from my National Geographic TOPO! software. ?Since I
> already
> > have the PCT route and related information displayed on TOPO! it?s easy
> to
> > print a 1:500k map for each resupply segment.
> >
> > For those who do not have TOPO! for the entire three-state distance maybe
> > HalfMile could be persuaded to add this type of overview to his trail map
> > offering.
> >
> > Enjoy your planning,
> >
> > Steel-Eye
> >
> > Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
> >
> > http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
> >
> > http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 7:01 AM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
> >
> >> I am looking for large scale maps to supplement the Half Mile maps. ?I
> like
> >> the Tom Harrison San Diego Backcountry map which covers Campo to Warner
> >> Springs and almost to Hwy 74. ?This map clearly shows the PCT, trail
> >> mileage
> >> and surrounding main roads and back roads. ?I do not see that he has a
> >> continuation map of this type going north from HWY 74. ?This is not for
> >> following the trail but mainly to see road access points etc. in
> relation
> >> to
> >> the trail. ?Question pertains to CA only.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> This topic may have already been addressed and if so sorry for the
> double
> >> up.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Ps. ?Thank you Half Mile for your maps.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
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> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 08:21:03 -0700
> From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
> To: <ned at mountaineducation.org>, "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <E97C41401DBE4CF08133D09BA6023A13 at DB2>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I am still checking this out. Sounds like the KTS Alum crampons are the
> most
> likely option unless I get some better feedback on the micro spikes. The
> microspikes are interesting. Looks like they would certainly be good for
> some things.
>
> Ned raises concern about the microspikes rolling off on a side slope and I
> have the same concern just by looking at how they attach with the rubber
> band. I also have a concern on the size of these as medium ends at mens
> 10.5 and large starts at 10.5. I wear a 10.5 to 11 and would be concerned
> that the large would be on the loose end and even more likely to have a
> "roll off" problem but I also need to be able to get them on. There is no
> way for me to know if these will actually work unless they have been tested
> in these mountain conditions, not just sidewalks and flat trails.
>
> I would be interested in feedback from anyone who has used these micro
> spikes in the Sierra Conditions to be faced on the PCT in summer months.
> And
> what size is recommended for a 10.5-11.0 mens boot.
>
> Sorry to ask so many questions on this but I don't like to experiment with
> life safety equipment on the trail and that is exactly what I will be doing
> with these snow situations whether I like it or not, unless I can avoid
> them
> by sectioning.
>
> Yes I will probably asking what Ice Ax to get.
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 2:03 PM
> To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
>
> The jury is still out, but we have some concerns about their Aluminum vs.
> Steel KTS crampons. (We hope to be product testing them for ourselves this
> Spring after the Kickoff in SoCal).
>
> As we see it, with a keen eye on what we know you need in the Springtime
> Sierra for safety, these are the issues:
>
> - length of points: you do not need long points, so go with the Aluminum.
>
> - method of attachment: (this is our biggest concern) you do need good
> strapping over the shoe for those wild, "catch-your-balance" steps (make
> sure the darn thing doesn't come off your foot just when you need it the
> most!).
>
> - fit to the width of your shoe: (the next biggest concern) Their
> "LeafSpringR extender bar" must hold to the width of your shoe so it
> doesn't
>
> slide side-to-side in the crampon. You must be able to make sudden side
> steps without your shoe moving in the crampon.
>
> - front points: (real important safety issue) are not necessary for the
> thru
>
> hiker and can even cause severe injury to the other foot if you aren't
> constantly aware of where your feet are moving. The Aluminum model's front
> points are more down than forward, so that would, again, be our choice.
>
> - they may ball-up more than the Microspikes since the points are longer
> (balling-up is the adhesion of wet snow to the metal under foot creating a
> "ball" under there and making footing much less traction difficult).
> Depends
>
> on the condition of the snow.
>
> Be careful not to walk on rock with the aluminum model, for obvious
> reasons.
>
> Now, to their Microspikes:
>
> We are very leery about several issues:
>
> - will they stay on your foot (not roll right off) when you have to catch
> your balance with a wild sideways step? Will the "rubber band" allow the
> rotation of the spikes clear off your foot? Maybe not, but that is the
> moment when you need traction the most. Maybe add another strap higher on
> the shoe, from instep on one side to the same on the other....
>
> - they are only good for icy/crusty conditions at the surface of the
> snowpack and, we suspect, will not deal well with the typical Sierra
> "soft-snow-on-the-surface, hard-frozen-layer-down-below," this is where
> balling-up gets in the way of adherence to the crust below (late morning
> thru afternoon issue). Sure, they are good on the sidewalk, but how do they
> do in "Sierra Cement"?
>
> If you need a traction aide, because your footwear does not have the lug
> pattern nor torsional stiffness to handle edge control well on hard-ish,
> steep surfaces, we'd go with the KTS, aluminum model (at least you'll have
> some edge to work with).
>
>
> "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
>
> Ned Tibbits, Director
> Mountain Education
> 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> P: 888-996-8333
> F: 530-541-1456
> C: 530-721-1551
> http://www.mountaineducation.org
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> To: <ned at mountaineducation.org>; "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:21 PM
> Subject: RE: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
>
>
> >
> >
> > OK I looked at them both - which one is best KTS Crampons (aluminum or
> > steel) KTS micro spikes??? I wear a light low top boot if that matters.
> > Vasque Breeze. Any opinions?? Thx
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:11 PM
> > To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >
> >>From the point of view of hiker safety, carry both self-arrest and
> >>traction
> >
> > devices up from the Palms to Pines highway 74 just prior to San Jacinto.
> >
> > If you feel that the snow/ice conditions are too much for your skill
> > level,
> > stay on the ridge and don't follow the trail. Remember, regarding snow
> > travel, you only need to know where the trail is and not that you have to
> > be
> >
> > on top of it all the time! If by following the ridge to circumvent the
> > dangerous snow/ice, you come back to the trail, then it all worked out
> ok.
> >
> > Do not take the instep crampons if they will not have enough "purchase"
> on
> > the snow/ice when at an angle. This will only be a false sense of
> security
> > that may fail you when you need them on a steep slope. Better to have the
> > Katoola KTS or microspikes.
> >
> > The Black Diamond Whippet will serve you well as long as you know how to
> > use
> >
> > it. Just remember, it is not the tool for self-belaying straight up a
> snow
> > climb (like Forester-if the chute is not ice), you'll need an ice axe for
> > doing that, nor is it the best self-arrest tool for that ever-needed,
> > uphill-handed, traverse anchor, since it has a basket, is not designed
> for
> > lateral torque (it will bend), and its shaft will not plunge deep into
> the
> > snow to secure you in place while crossing a steep traverse on "iffy"
> > snow.
> >
> > For the snow, and you will have plenty even before you get to Kennedy
> > Meadows, take an ice axe, some form of traction device that will not roll
> > off your foot on a steep traverse, good gaitors, sun screen, a
> > wide-brimmed
> > hat, great glasses, leg protection (for those post-holing days), and
> > experience.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
> >
> > Ned Tibbits, Director
> > Mountain Education
> > 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> > South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> > P: 888-996-8333
> > F: 530-541-1456
> > C: 530-721-1551
> > http://www.mountaineducation.org
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> > To: "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 7:43 AM
> > Subject: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> Are the San Jacinto and specifically Fuller Ridge, the 1st location that
> >> foot traction devices and self arrest tool might be needed?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I plan to carry an old pair of Swiss 4 spike instep crampons and a Black
> >> Diamond Whippet in lieu of ice axe.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> It is understood that checking weather conditions and snow pack prior to
> >> entering the San Jacinto is a prerequisite.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Dave
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 14:18:57 -0800 (PST)
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Rides to & from ADZPCTKO offered
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID: <392902.73512.qm at web111617.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> I live in Agua Dulce and am planning to?drive to the KICKOFF - ADZPCTKO.?I
> will
> have room for up to four hikers with their packs.?My plan is to pick up
> hikers
> at the Saufleys at 10:30 AM on Friday, 4-29-11.? Next stop will be at
> McDonalds,
> Cajon Pass for lunch. We should be there by about noon. If?I don't already
> have
> four,?I can take more from McDonalds.?We will be passing Warner Springs and
> if
> there is still room?I?could pick up from there too. We should be at Lake
> Morena
> by around 4:30 PM.?
>
>
> On Sunday morning, 5-1-11?we will leave to drive north by around 9:30 AM.
>
> This should allow some of those who want to start their hikes early?and
> avoid
> the "Herd" to still be able to go to the Kickoff.?Saturday is the biggest
> day.
>
> Please email me or call me to confirm.? My phone number is 1(661) 268-1932
> .
>
> MendoRider/Ed Anderson
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 15:35:46 -0800
> From: CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] Avoiding Bear Problems
> To: PCT listserve <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikx7dc52Eq0LviDF0-43fFdnohD6pe-WMj=Gaim at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> Good afternoon, all,
>
> With spring, and the hiking season, rapidly approaching it won?t be long
> before bears will be moving up-country or coming out of hibernation; as
> hungry as they can be. One of the better cures for a pesky bear is to get
> proactive: Find a frozen lake and cut a 2-foot hole in the middle. Next,
> sprinkle some peas around the edge of the hole and hide yourself a little
> ways away. Finally, when the bear comes to take a pea you sneak up and
> kick
> him in the ice-hole.
>
> Another good way to keep bears away from your stuff is to use peanut
> butter:
> Just smear it on someone else?s tent -- or so I've been told....
>
> Steel-Eye
>
> Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 09:38:01 -0800
> From: <jomike at cot.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] Trail Angel
> To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <E1DADEC5DF4B4433A03428188063DCA4 at arewethereyePC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Just a final reminder I'll be glad to help where I can up here in
> California's sections o,p and q. I help with transportation, provide a soft,
> clean place to take a zero and if interested, we'll see you get to Shasta
> for a climb of our spectacular mountain. We have also baby sat vehicles for
> section hikers. Give me a call with any questions: JoAnn Michael
> 530-905-0507.
>
> are we there yet
>
>
> ...going to the mountains is going home.
>
> John Muir
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 14:13:43 -0700
> From: Gerry Zamora <gerry0625 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Pack weight?
> To: Timothy Nye <timpnye at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net, David Thibault <dthibaul07 at gmail.com>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=zyHUn4kmUPX+CGWiQ52qXPNkfo9+o2XeKZPsu at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> ?
> On Mar 12, 2011 10:39 AM, "Gerry Zamora" <gerry0625 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Ok looks like I got my weight for just my pack, tent and sleeping bag
> down
> > to 12lbs. Maybe 11lbs. I lost 5lbs without adding any cost just a lil
> > shopping around. Thanks for all the input it has helped I really don't
> want
> > to hike with more than 35lbs when im fully loaded starting my hike and
> now
> I
> > can see its possible. Before I wasn't so sure. My comfort level isn't
> > quite there for ul I like some creature comforts.
> > Thanks
> > Gerry0625
> > On Mar 10, 2011 7:12 PM, "Timothy Nye" <timpnye at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Once again, ladies and gentleman, another advantage. In case of
> emergency
> >>> the system transforms into an emergency locater beacon. Just add flame
> > and
> >>> stand back. *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> *System good for single use only in emergency situations.
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 10:39:18 -0800
> From: Gerry Zamora <gerry0625 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Pack weight?
> To: Timothy Nye <timpnye at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net, David Thibault <dthibaul07 at gmail.com>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikpv90iJy9DEeVcmYJfhC088t6FPCt_ib0JHbw8 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Ok looks like I got my weight for just my pack, tent and sleeping bag down
> to 12lbs. Maybe 11lbs. I lost 5lbs without adding any cost just a lil
> shopping around. Thanks for all the input it has helped I really don't
> want
> to hike with more than 35lbs when im fully loaded starting my hike and now
> I
> can see its possible. Before I wasn't so sure. My comfort level isn't
> quite there for ul I like some creature comforts.
> Thanks
> Gerry0625
> On Mar 10, 2011 7:12 PM, "Timothy Nye" <timpnye at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Once again, ladies and gentleman, another advantage. In case of
> emergency
> >> the system transforms into an emergency locater beacon. Just add flame
> and
> >> stand back. *
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *System good for single use only in emergency situations.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 17:24:27 -0800
> From: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] List down again?
> To: pct-l <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikGbQbdswMAYpLsHFRC=A5yGz4ohxn+gJ95u8vq at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I'm guessing the list is experiencing technical difficulties again...
> --
> *Alphabetsoup*
> *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> *
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 12:49:37 -0500
> From: Csilla Tabor <csilla.tabor at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Resupplies
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTimt23c7FmCXJVBv3N6eiGo5wcDbsHNro_=iLPqQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I just called several non-post office resupply spots I found on
> planyourhike.com to make sure I had accurate information, and everyone I
> talked to was super nice and helpful. I didn't think it was possible for me
> to be more excited to get going, but now I am!
> ~Csilla~
>
> .....hiking in 39 days!
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 17:21:15 -0800 (PST)
> From: tom aterno <nitnoid1 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Magic Moleskin-CORRECTION
> To: Ken Murray <kmurray at pol.net>, Bob Bankhead
> <wandering_bob at comcast.net>
> Cc: "." <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <347825.50656.qm at web33501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> That is where I use CToB, on my feet, before I start the hike, to help
> Leukotape
> and Moleskin adhere for days, despite frequent stream crossings. The stuff
> prolongs the lifetime of tape products, so you can pack less of it, and
> therefore save weight.
>
>
> The Incredible Bulk, who hiked in the snow and ice in Massachusetts today,
> and
> had a ball!
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Ken Murray <kmurray at pol.net>
> To: Bob Bankhead <wandering_bob at comcast.net>
> Cc: . <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Fri, March 11, 2011 10:15:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Magic Moleskin-CORRECTION
>
> Thanks for the nice note, Bob.
>
> I'd like to say that my superior training and experience is responsible for
> my
> knowledge on this particular issue....
>
> however, it is actually because I bought a bottle of the wrong stuff, and
> couldn't figure out why it didn't work! Doh! I ended up doing some
> research on
> the subject.
>
> By the way, I'm really happy you brought the subject up, as I think
> Compound
> Tinture of Benzoin borders on magic, in helping get tape to stick to skin
> in bad
> situations, like on a foot, where moisture really sabotages most adhesive
> products.
>
> Ken
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Bankhead" <wandering_bob at comcast.net>
> To: "Ken Murray" <kmurray at pol.net>, "." <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 9:43:20 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
> Subject: RE: [pct-l] Magic Moleskin-CORRECTION
>
> My thanks to Dr. Murray for explaining the difference. I stand corrected in
> both fact and spelling.
>
> FWIW, on Feb 23, he also posted a VERY impressive response to an earlier
> thread entitled "Stitches - Don't Do It". I strongly recommend others read
> it before just grabbing dental floss and a carpet needle.
>
> As a surgeon and med school instructor, he knows of what he speaks.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
> On Behalf Of Ken Murray
> Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 9:09 AM
> To: .
> Subject: [pct-l] Magic Moleskin-CORRECTION
>
> Actually, the correct product is
>
> "COMPOUND tinture of benzoin"
>
> (Different brands will have the "compound" word in different places, but
> COMPOUND *must* be there.)
>
> Which is a skin protectant and adhesive.
>
> "Tinture of benzoin" is a respiratory inhalant, and has no adhesive
> properties at all.....in fact, stuff tends not to stick to skin to which it
> is applied.
>
> This is a common mistake, even among medical professionals.
>
>
>
> ==================
> Tincture of benzoin - get it at any drug store; no Rx required.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at
> backcountry.net] On Behalf Of Vicky mattson
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 11:39 AM
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Subject: [pct-l] magic moleskin
>
> I was leading a Sierra Club trip a while back and a chemist told me about a
> liquid that when you paint it on your skin than put the moleskin on it
> sticks forever through water sweat for days and days. So my senior moment
> i
> CAN'T FOR THE LIFE OF ME REMEMBER WHAT IT WAS. Does this sound familiar
> to anyone?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pct-L mailing list
> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
>
> List Archives:
> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 14:24:01 -0800
> From: Benjamin Grunbaum <bengrunbaum at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Kerosene/ fuels in general
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=gALKuDX89kPuOgeJfAAFf+8EQszODZspcv6q_ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hello All
> Unfortunately I will not be making it out for a thru hike this year. In a
> year or two I hope to join the club although I am not looking forward to
> the
> side effects upon finishing (CHD). Anyways, I have an Optimus Nova stove
> and was curious as to the availability of fuel like kerosene along the
> trail. It seems to be one of the most commonly available fuels anywhere
> people tend to car camp (Coleman brand). The manual says the nova is
> designed solely for petroleum based fuels. Are there any others aside from
> car gasoline (sooty and hazardous) that one could find along the trail and
> use safely.
>
> Ben
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 10:28:23 -0800
> From: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality
> of the whole mess
> To: Mike Beaty <mike_beaty at q.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTin1AmTy4oM_7ZNOfU_xCzjxpXneCk_PmposrxTE at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Well, one of the best post holing stories I've heard recently was told the
> day after the Muir tour and BBQ, while I was hiking Mt. Diablo with Huff n
> Puff and Coyote. It seems their group kind of liked naked hiking day in
> 2008 (June 21), especially Huff n Puff, and they continued nakedly walking
> the High Sierra as often as they could get away with it. One day Huff n
> Puff was blithely stepping from sun cup to sun cup in his altogether, when
> he broke through and posted up to his nuts in the crunchy stuff. Given the
> scratchiness of the snow on his unprotected parts, he couldn't extricate
> himself from the hole, and he needed the help of Coyote, and some other
> equally beautiful naked woman to reach between his legs and lift him out.
> Coyote swears she didn't look, and tried not to touch, but it was to save
> life and limb. It's a very funny story to hear them tell it, and all the
> more reason to hike naked in post holing conditions with a co-ed group, and
> just one more reason for leaving the snowshoes behind. I think JMT
> Reinhold
> and the Pirate could learn something from this. I mean, what's a post hole
> among friends.
>
> Shroomer
>
>
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 17:47:51 -0600
> From: Jason Moores <jmmoores1 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=Eqgy0qUffooGXOUFJQJ3i6pGqmaHHKAJm9mF2 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I have used micro spikes for the past two summers and found them very
> useful, I wear size 11, so the first pair I bought were the large and they
> were too large. They didn't stay in place when on an incline, so I tried
> the
> medium. Perfect. I had no problem with the spikes "rolling" on even the
> steepest slopes.
>
> Jackass
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 8:21 AM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
>
> > I am still checking this out. Sounds like the KTS Alum crampons are the
> > most
> > likely option unless I get some better feedback on the micro spikes. The
> > microspikes are interesting. Looks like they would certainly be good for
> > some things.
> >
> > Ned raises concern about the microspikes rolling off on a side slope and
> I
> > have the same concern just by looking at how they attach with the rubber
> > band. I also have a concern on the size of these as medium ends at mens
> > 10.5 and large starts at 10.5. I wear a 10.5 to 11 and would be
> concerned
> > that the large would be on the loose end and even more likely to have a
> > "roll off" problem but I also need to be able to get them on. There is no
> > way for me to know if these will actually work unless they have been
> tested
> > in these mountain conditions, not just sidewalks and flat trails.
> >
> > I would be interested in feedback from anyone who has used these micro
> > spikes in the Sierra Conditions to be faced on the PCT in summer months.
> > And
> > what size is recommended for a 10.5-11.0 mens boot.
> >
> > Sorry to ask so many questions on this but I don't like to experiment
> with
> > life safety equipment on the trail and that is exactly what I will be
> doing
> > with these snow situations whether I like it or not, unless I can avoid
> > them
> > by sectioning.
> >
> > Yes I will probably asking what Ice Ax to get.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> > Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 2:03 PM
> > To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
> >
> > The jury is still out, but we have some concerns about their Aluminum vs.
> > Steel KTS crampons. (We hope to be product testing them for ourselves
> this
> > Spring after the Kickoff in SoCal).
> >
> > As we see it, with a keen eye on what we know you need in the Springtime
> > Sierra for safety, these are the issues:
> >
> > - length of points: you do not need long points, so go with the Aluminum.
> >
> > - method of attachment: (this is our biggest concern) you do need good
> > strapping over the shoe for those wild, "catch-your-balance" steps (make
> > sure the darn thing doesn't come off your foot just when you need it the
> > most!).
> >
> > - fit to the width of your shoe: (the next biggest concern) Their
> > "LeafSpringR extender bar" must hold to the width of your shoe so it
> > doesn't
> >
> > slide side-to-side in the crampon. You must be able to make sudden side
> > steps without your shoe moving in the crampon.
> >
> > - front points: (real important safety issue) are not necessary for the
> > thru
> >
> > hiker and can even cause severe injury to the other foot if you aren't
> > constantly aware of where your feet are moving. The Aluminum model's
> front
> > points are more down than forward, so that would, again, be our choice.
> >
> > - they may ball-up more than the Microspikes since the points are longer
> > (balling-up is the adhesion of wet snow to the metal under foot creating
> a
> > "ball" under there and making footing much less traction difficult).
> > Depends
> >
> > on the condition of the snow.
> >
> > Be careful not to walk on rock with the aluminum model, for obvious
> > reasons.
> >
> > Now, to their Microspikes:
> >
> > We are very leery about several issues:
> >
> > - will they stay on your foot (not roll right off) when you have to catch
> > your balance with a wild sideways step? Will the "rubber band" allow the
> > rotation of the spikes clear off your foot? Maybe not, but that is the
> > moment when you need traction the most. Maybe add another strap higher on
> > the shoe, from instep on one side to the same on the other....
> >
> > - they are only good for icy/crusty conditions at the surface of the
> > snowpack and, we suspect, will not deal well with the typical Sierra
> > "soft-snow-on-the-surface, hard-frozen-layer-down-below," this is where
> > balling-up gets in the way of adherence to the crust below (late morning
> > thru afternoon issue). Sure, they are good on the sidewalk, but how do
> they
> > do in "Sierra Cement"?
> >
> > If you need a traction aide, because your footwear does not have the lug
> > pattern nor torsional stiffness to handle edge control well on hard-ish,
> > steep surfaces, we'd go with the KTS, aluminum model (at least you'll
> have
> > some edge to work with).
> >
> >
> > "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
> >
> > Ned Tibbits, Director
> > Mountain Education
> > 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> > South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> > P: 888-996-8333
> > F: 530-541-1456
> > C: 530-721-1551
> > http://www.mountaineducation.org
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> > To: <ned at mountaineducation.org>; "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:21 PM
> > Subject: RE: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > OK I looked at them both - which one is best KTS Crampons (aluminum or
> > > steel) KTS micro spikes??? I wear a light low top boot if that
> matters.
> > > Vasque Breeze. Any opinions?? Thx
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> > > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:11 PM
> > > To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> > > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> > >
> > >>From the point of view of hiker safety, carry both self-arrest and
> > >>traction
> > >
> > > devices up from the Palms to Pines highway 74 just prior to San
> Jacinto.
> > >
> > > If you feel that the snow/ice conditions are too much for your skill
> > > level,
> > > stay on the ridge and don't follow the trail. Remember, regarding snow
> > > travel, you only need to know where the trail is and not that you have
> to
> > > be
> > >
> > > on top of it all the time! If by following the ridge to circumvent the
> > > dangerous snow/ice, you come back to the trail, then it all worked out
> > ok.
> > >
> > > Do not take the instep crampons if they will not have enough "purchase"
> > on
> > > the snow/ice when at an angle. This will only be a false sense of
> > security
> > > that may fail you when you need them on a steep slope. Better to have
> the
> > > Katoola KTS or microspikes.
> > >
> > > The Black Diamond Whippet will serve you well as long as you know how
> to
> > > use
> > >
> > > it. Just remember, it is not the tool for self-belaying straight up a
> > snow
> > > climb (like Forester-if the chute is not ice), you'll need an ice axe
> for
> > > doing that, nor is it the best self-arrest tool for that ever-needed,
> > > uphill-handed, traverse anchor, since it has a basket, is not designed
> > for
> > > lateral torque (it will bend), and its shaft will not plunge deep into
> > the
> > > snow to secure you in place while crossing a steep traverse on "iffy"
> > > snow.
> > >
> > > For the snow, and you will have plenty even before you get to Kennedy
> > > Meadows, take an ice axe, some form of traction device that will not
> roll
> > > off your foot on a steep traverse, good gaitors, sun screen, a
> > > wide-brimmed
> > > hat, great glasses, leg protection (for those post-holing days), and
> > > experience.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
> > >
> > > Ned Tibbits, Director
> > > Mountain Education
> > > 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> > > South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> > > P: 888-996-8333
> > > F: 530-541-1456
> > > C: 530-721-1551
> > > http://www.mountaineducation.org
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> > > To: "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> > > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 7:43 AM
> > > Subject: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> > >
> > >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Are the San Jacinto and specifically Fuller Ridge, the 1st location
> that
> > >> foot traction devices and self arrest tool might be needed?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> I plan to carry an old pair of Swiss 4 spike instep crampons and a
> Black
> > >> Diamond Whippet in lieu of ice axe.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> It is understood that checking weather conditions and snow pack prior
> to
> > >> entering the San Jacinto is a prerequisite.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Dave
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Pct-L mailing list
> > >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >>
> > >> List Archives:
> > >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 18:28:56 -0800
> From: mikea <mike.aken at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Mt San Jacinto and 5 others - Feb 28,2011
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikZSQ9r8xL6Deh-Tbsvs3fuQBozf=QFZGUtNDwL at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> http://www.nwhikers.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7989777
>
> --
> http://www.engel.org/ihwm (Courtesy of my friend Glenn Engel)
>
> "I hike alone sometimes.Its during these Mike Aken
> solo hikes that the number of arrogant N7OUJ
> and ignorant people I have to deal
> with is reduced to one".
> Jack Hampson
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 17:00:14 -0700
> From: <ned at mountaineducation.org>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
> To: "Jason Moores" <jmmoores1 at gmail.com>, <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <4DB8BAB3EE704FBE8B03EE7510ADF067 at PacificCrestPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Thanks, Jason! Good to hear. So, is it safe to say that if you down-size
> one
> from what you'd normally order, the things will stay on?
>
>
> "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
>
> Ned Tibbits, Director
> Mountain Education
> 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> P: 888-996-8333
> F: 530-541-1456
> C: 530-721-1551
> http://www.mountaineducation.org
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Moores" <jmmoores1 at gmail.com>
> To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2011 4:47 PM
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
>
>
> >I have used micro spikes for the past two summers and found them very
> > useful, I wear size 11, so the first pair I bought were the large and
> they
> > were too large. They didn't stay in place when on an incline, so I tried
> > the
> > medium. Perfect. I had no problem with the spikes "rolling" on even the
> > steepest slopes.
> >
> > Jackass
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 8:21 AM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
> >
> >> I am still checking this out. Sounds like the KTS Alum crampons are the
> >> most
> >> likely option unless I get some better feedback on the micro spikes. The
> >> microspikes are interesting. Looks like they would certainly be good for
> >> some things.
> >>
> >> Ned raises concern about the microspikes rolling off on a side slope and
> >> I
> >> have the same concern just by looking at how they attach with the rubber
> >> band. I also have a concern on the size of these as medium ends at mens
> >> 10.5 and large starts at 10.5. I wear a 10.5 to 11 and would be
> >> concerned
> >> that the large would be on the loose end and even more likely to have a
> >> "roll off" problem but I also need to be able to get them on. There is
> no
> >> way for me to know if these will actually work unless they have been
> >> tested
> >> in these mountain conditions, not just sidewalks and flat trails.
> >>
> >> I would be interested in feedback from anyone who has used these micro
> >> spikes in the Sierra Conditions to be faced on the PCT in summer months.
> >> And
> >> what size is recommended for a 10.5-11.0 mens boot.
> >>
> >> Sorry to ask so many questions on this but I don't like to experiment
> >> with
> >> life safety equipment on the trail and that is exactly what I will be
> >> doing
> >> with these snow situations whether I like it or not, unless I can avoid
> >> them
> >> by sectioning.
> >>
> >> Yes I will probably asking what Ice Ax to get.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> >> Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 2:03 PM
> >> To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> >> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction--Katoola choices
> >>
> >> The jury is still out, but we have some concerns about their Aluminum
> vs.
> >> Steel KTS crampons. (We hope to be product testing them for ourselves
> >> this
> >> Spring after the Kickoff in SoCal).
> >>
> >> As we see it, with a keen eye on what we know you need in the Springtime
> >> Sierra for safety, these are the issues:
> >>
> >> - length of points: you do not need long points, so go with the
> Aluminum.
> >>
> >> - method of attachment: (this is our biggest concern) you do need good
> >> strapping over the shoe for those wild, "catch-your-balance" steps (make
> >> sure the darn thing doesn't come off your foot just when you need it the
> >> most!).
> >>
> >> - fit to the width of your shoe: (the next biggest concern) Their
> >> "LeafSpringR extender bar" must hold to the width of your shoe so it
> >> doesn't
> >>
> >> slide side-to-side in the crampon. You must be able to make sudden side
> >> steps without your shoe moving in the crampon.
> >>
> >> - front points: (real important safety issue) are not necessary for the
> >> thru
> >>
> >> hiker and can even cause severe injury to the other foot if you aren't
> >> constantly aware of where your feet are moving. The Aluminum model's
> >> front
> >> points are more down than forward, so that would, again, be our choice.
> >>
> >> - they may ball-up more than the Microspikes since the points are longer
> >> (balling-up is the adhesion of wet snow to the metal under foot creating
> >> a
> >> "ball" under there and making footing much less traction difficult).
> >> Depends
> >>
> >> on the condition of the snow.
> >>
> >> Be careful not to walk on rock with the aluminum model, for obvious
> >> reasons.
> >>
> >> Now, to their Microspikes:
> >>
> >> We are very leery about several issues:
> >>
> >> - will they stay on your foot (not roll right off) when you have to
> catch
> >> your balance with a wild sideways step? Will the "rubber band" allow the
> >> rotation of the spikes clear off your foot? Maybe not, but that is the
> >> moment when you need traction the most. Maybe add another strap higher
> on
> >> the shoe, from instep on one side to the same on the other....
> >>
> >> - they are only good for icy/crusty conditions at the surface of the
> >> snowpack and, we suspect, will not deal well with the typical Sierra
> >> "soft-snow-on-the-surface, hard-frozen-layer-down-below," this is where
> >> balling-up gets in the way of adherence to the crust below (late morning
> >> thru afternoon issue). Sure, they are good on the sidewalk, but how do
> >> they
> >> do in "Sierra Cement"?
> >>
> >> If you need a traction aide, because your footwear does not have the lug
> >> pattern nor torsional stiffness to handle edge control well on hard-ish,
> >> steep surfaces, we'd go with the KTS, aluminum model (at least you'll
> >> have
> >> some edge to work with).
> >>
> >>
> >> "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
> >>
> >> Ned Tibbits, Director
> >> Mountain Education
> >> 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> >> South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> >> P: 888-996-8333
> >> F: 530-541-1456
> >> C: 530-721-1551
> >> http://www.mountaineducation.org
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> >> To: <ned at mountaineducation.org>; "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> >> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:21 PM
> >> Subject: RE: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > OK I looked at them both - which one is best KTS Crampons (aluminum or
> >> > steel) KTS micro spikes??? I wear a light low top boot if that
> >> > matters.
> >> > Vasque Breeze. Any opinions?? Thx
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: ned at mountaineducation.org [mailto:ned at mountaineducation.org]
> >> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 6:11 PM
> >> > To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; 'PCT-L'
> >> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >> >
> >> >>From the point of view of hiker safety, carry both self-arrest and
> >> >>traction
> >> >
> >> > devices up from the Palms to Pines highway 74 just prior to San
> >> > Jacinto.
> >> >
> >> > If you feel that the snow/ice conditions are too much for your skill
> >> > level,
> >> > stay on the ridge and don't follow the trail. Remember, regarding snow
> >> > travel, you only need to know where the trail is and not that you have
> >> > to
> >> > be
> >> >
> >> > on top of it all the time! If by following the ridge to circumvent the
> >> > dangerous snow/ice, you come back to the trail, then it all worked out
> >> ok.
> >> >
> >> > Do not take the instep crampons if they will not have enough
> "purchase"
> >> on
> >> > the snow/ice when at an angle. This will only be a false sense of
> >> security
> >> > that may fail you when you need them on a steep slope. Better to have
> >> > the
> >> > Katoola KTS or microspikes.
> >> >
> >> > The Black Diamond Whippet will serve you well as long as you know how
> >> > to
> >> > use
> >> >
> >> > it. Just remember, it is not the tool for self-belaying straight up a
> >> snow
> >> > climb (like Forester-if the chute is not ice), you'll need an ice axe
> >> > for
> >> > doing that, nor is it the best self-arrest tool for that ever-needed,
> >> > uphill-handed, traverse anchor, since it has a basket, is not designed
> >> for
> >> > lateral torque (it will bend), and its shaft will not plunge deep into
> >> the
> >> > snow to secure you in place while crossing a steep traverse on "iffy"
> >> > snow.
> >> >
> >> > For the snow, and you will have plenty even before you get to Kennedy
> >> > Meadows, take an ice axe, some form of traction device that will not
> >> > roll
> >> > off your foot on a steep traverse, good gaitors, sun screen, a
> >> > wide-brimmed
> >> > hat, great glasses, leg protection (for those post-holing days), and
> >> > experience.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Just remember, Be Careful out there!"
> >> >
> >> > Ned Tibbits, Director
> >> > Mountain Education
> >> > 1106A Ski Run Blvd
> >> > South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
> >> > P: 888-996-8333
> >> > F: 530-541-1456
> >> > C: 530-721-1551
> >> > http://www.mountaineducation.org
> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> > From: <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com>
> >> > To: "'PCT-L'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> >> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 7:43 AM
> >> > Subject: [pct-l] Self Arrest - Instep Crampons
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Are the San Jacinto and specifically Fuller Ridge, the 1st location
> >> >> that
> >> >> foot traction devices and self arrest tool might be needed?
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> I plan to carry an old pair of Swiss 4 spike instep crampons and a
> >> >> Black
> >> >> Diamond Whippet in lieu of ice axe.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> It is understood that checking weather conditions and snow pack prior
> >> >> to
> >> >> entering the San Jacinto is a prerequisite.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Dave
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> _______________________________________________
> >> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >> >>
> >> >> List Archives:
> >> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >> >
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 20:08:49 -0400
> From: <abiegen at cox.net>
> Subject: [pct-l] One Last Joke (again)
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID: <20110313200849.48GOM.40385.imail at fed1rmwml46>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> So Switchback is a thru-hiker through and through. Hiked most of the long
> trails, some more than once. Being a through hiker has cost him though, in
> terms of job opportunities and relationships. Keeping jobs just long enough
> to get some money for the next thru. Mattress testing, pool lapping, lap
> dancing, looting hiker booty and putting the odd damsel into distress just
> doesn't pay very much and you really can't afford to buy a house or have any
> permanent relationships. So Switchback lived at home with his mother,
> Talkback, his brother Laidback and his cat Kyphosis. He cared very deeply
> for them. On his thru hikes when he got to towns he would always call home
> to chat with his loved ones.
>
> Starting out on another thru hike of the PCT, Switchback made his first
> stop at Lake Morena. After putting up his tarp and arranging his gear,
> consuming some donuts and setting a few traps for unsuspecting hikers, he
> called home. Laidback answered the phone.
>
> "So, how's it going?" Switchback asked.
>
> His brother Laidback answered, "Kyphosis is dead."
>
> Switchback went ballistic. "My favorite cat died and you just tell me like
> that? You knew I was going to be gone for five months. You knew I would be
> calling at each town I passed through. You could have broken it to me
> gently, darn it. The first time I called you could have said 'Kyphosis is on
> the roof and we can't get her down.'
>
> When I called from Mount Laguna you could have said that the fire
> department had come over but they were having trouble catching the cat on
> the roof. When I called from Warner Springs you could have said that the
> firemen caught Kyphosis but the cat fell and was slightly injured. When I
> called from Idyllwild You could have said that the cat was in the pet
> hospital, but the outlook still was good. When I called from Wrightwood you
> could have told me that the she took a turn for the worse but the best
> veterinary surgeons were working on her. When I called from Agua Dulce you
> could have told me that they tried their best but Kyphosis died quietly in
> her sleep."
>
> "You break things like this gently, you don't just blurt it out! "
> Switchback went on. " I don't know why you are so insensitive. I'm just fed
> up with you! I don't want to talk to you any more! Put Mom on the phone."
>
> Laidback replied, "Mom's on the roof and we can't get her down."
>
> TrailHacker
> "*Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Comedy is know who to throw it
> at.*"
> -Proverb
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 17:17:18 -0700
> From: "Bob Bankhead" <wandering_bob at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] List down again?
> To: "'Alphabetsoup'" <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>, "'pct-l'"
> <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <004901cbe1dd$2ec67090$8c5351b0$@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> The DNS server was down. None of the backcountry.net forums were on lnie.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
> On Behalf Of Alphabetsoup
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 5:24 PM
> Man of the HouseSubject: [pct-l] List down again?
>
> I'm guessing the list is experiencing technical difficulties again...
> --
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 19
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 17:29:56 -0700
> From: Gerry Zamora <gerry0625 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Traction on snow, gaitors, pants, and the reality
> of the whole mess
> To: Scott Williams <baidarker at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net, Mike Beaty <mike_beaty at q.com>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikP7DxUNPHxJ+uLeM_Ay_GjO_x2kSsza9X4WSoW at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Ouch.
> On Mar 13, 2011 4:25 PM, "Scott Williams" <baidarker at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, one of the best post holing stories I've heard recently was told
> the
> > day after the Muir tour and BBQ, while I was hiking Mt. Diablo with Huff
> n
> > Puff and Coyote. It seems their group kind of liked naked hiking day in
> > 2008 (June 21), especially Huff n Puff, and they continued nakedly
> walking
> > the High Sierra as often as they could get away with it. One day Huff n
> > Puff was blithely stepping from sun cup to sun cup in his altogether,
> when
> > he broke through and posted up to his nuts in the crunchy stuff. Given
> the
> > scratchiness of the snow on his unprotected parts, he couldn't extricate
> > himself from the hole, and he needed the help of Coyote, and some other
> > equally beautiful naked woman to reach between his legs and lift him out.
> > Coyote swears she didn't look, and tried not to touch, but it was to save
> > life and limb. It's a very funny story to hear them tell it, and all the
> > more reason to hike naked in post holing conditions with a co-ed group,
> and
> > just one more reason for leaving the snowshoes behind. I think JMT
> Reinhold
> > and the Pirate could learn something from this. I mean, what's a post
> hole
> > among friends.
> >
> > Shroomer
> >
> >
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 08:02:20 -0800
> From: CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Large Scale Maps
> To: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com
> Cc: PCT-L <pct-l at backcountry.net>, halfmile at pctmap.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikxWForGD3Jz0w5UQFMUnEd=wq5uY1NuiJP6ZSR at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> Good morning, Dave,
>
> I usually format, print, and carry one overview map per section. A feature
> of TOPO! software is that the print scale can be adjusted to allow me to
> fit
> a section ? large or small ? on one 8.5? x 11? page. I can also save the
> image to a file, a sample of which is attached for reference, but I can't
> post it to PCT-L.
>
> The sample is printed in ?portrait? orientation, but for some sections
> where
> the trail extends substantially east-and-west I can also print in
> ?landscape? orientation.
>
> I have the PCT waypoints shown as a route on my file, and I save that
> configuration ? in this case ?California PCT.tpo? that you see at the top
> of
> the sample. The PCT route is shown as the red line.
>
> The little star graphics near the trail, bottom and top, are the location
> of
> Kennedy Meadows and Tuolumne Meadows respectively. They are for my
> reference, and help me when I set up the print.
>
> Note I also have small, red, dotted-line trails shown for Mt. Whitney and
> Kearsarge Pass. These trails do not show on a 1:500K map series so I
> traced
> them on the map at the 7.5? Map level and opted to display them on the
> 1:500K level. Similarly, I can enter and display any number of label
> boxes,
> such as the one identifying ?Kearsarge Pass?. I could also easily trace
> and
> identify any of the other intersecting trails in a section.
>
> In addition to showing an overview of the roads and towns relative to the
> PCT, this map would show me that bailing off the trail north of Whitney to
> follow Wallace Creek, and subsequently Kern River downstream to
> civilization, is probably going to be a daunting task.
>
> Steel-Eye
>
> Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
>
> http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 6:34 AM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Chuck - this 1:500k seems like it might be the scale I am looking for.
> >
> > 1. Do you need multiple maps at this scale to cover a section, how many
> > approx for a section?
> > 2. Are the maps good at showing access roads etc. in case of bailout or
> > re-supply?
> > 3. Did you have to overlay the PCT on your 1:500K maps or did it come
> with
> > that when you bought the software?
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: loncooper at gmail.com [mailto:loncooper at gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> > Halfmile
> > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 8:44 AM
> > To: CHUCK CHELIN
> > Cc: dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com; PCT-L
> > Subject: Re: [pct-l] Large Scale Maps
> >
> > Steel-Eye,
> > I will look into doing this. Does this scale typically cover a PCT
> > section on a single page?
> > -Halfmile
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 7:27 AM, CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
> > wrote:
> > > Good morning,
> > >
> > > For the large-view purpose you describe I prefer to carry prints of
> USGS
> > > 1:500,000 maps from my National Geographic TOPO! software. Since I
> > already
> > > have the PCT route and related information displayed on TOPO! it?s easy
> > to
> > > print a 1:500k map for each resupply segment.
> > >
> > > For those who do not have TOPO! for the entire three-state distance
> maybe
> > > HalfMile could be persuaded to add this type of overview to his trail
> map
> > > offering.
> > >
> > > Enjoy your planning,
> > >
> > > Steel-Eye
> > >
> > > Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
> > >
> > > http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
> > >
> > > http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 7:01 AM, <dnielsen at djmurphycompany.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I am looking for large scale maps to supplement the Half Mile maps. I
> > like
> > >> the Tom Harrison San Diego Backcountry map which covers Campo to
> Warner
> > >> Springs and almost to Hwy 74. This map clearly shows the PCT, trail
> > >> mileage
> > >> and surrounding main roads and back roads. I do not see that he has a
> > >> continuation map of this type going north from HWY 74. This is not
> for
> > >> following the trail but mainly to see road access points etc. in
> > relation
> > >> to
> > >> the trail. Question pertains to CA only.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> This topic may have already been addressed and if so sorry for the
> > double
> > >> up.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Ps. Thank you Half Mile for your maps.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Pct-L mailing list
> > >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >>
> > >> List Archives:
> > >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Pct-L mailing list
> > > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > > List Archives:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 21
> Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 12:21:26 -0800
> From: Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Best iphone gps app
> To: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTik+QhvNiZd8KPk-MDFhh=HwHe62_FR_XetiVWKu at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Thanks for all of the advice. Downloaded Topo with the halfmile wayponts
> and it looks awesome! Just out of curiosity, are there waypoints
> available
> for water sources and/or good camping spots?
>
> Thanks again everyone,
>
> Jalan Jalan
> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Bill Burge <bill at burge.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > The use of the cell towers can get you an initial fix faster than the GPS
> > chip on the iPhone, but then the GPS chip uses the standard satellite
> > signals to refine that location.
> >
> > The Halfmile waypoints are the main files you need. The maps for
> something
> > like GaiaGPS or TopoMaps have to be downloaded from the topo map servers
> > that their software supports. GaiaGPS has all the tracking and photo
> > marking and timing and stuff that isn't a lot of use on the Trail.
> >
> > I second the recommendations of GaiaGPS for mapped locations and
> TopoMaps,
> > I have both and use them for their different purposes. BasicGPS is an
> app
> > that tells you your current location in many different ways that might
> apply
> > to many different kinds of maps.
> >
> > Another to look at is Accuterra Unlimited. The maps are not as good, but
> > they make it REAL easy to get the maps for the trail. Still, I reach for
> > TopoMaps before I open Accuterra.
> >
> > (I just now see that the makers of GaiaGPS have offered the map loading,
> > reading and waypoint management functions of GaiaGPS, without all the
> > tracking stuff, as a free app called Offline Topo Maps (catchy name
> Andrew!
> > ;-) and I'll be grabbing that right now to try out.
> >
> > http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/offline-topo-maps/id376535806?mt=8
> >
> > AccuTerra Unlimited
> >
> >
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/accuterra-unlimited-maps-gps/id355787609?mt=8
> >
> > If I had to pick one app (besides the Basic GPS app Halfmile mentions)
> I'd
> > probably go with TopoMaps. (It might be Offline Topo Maps, if there is
> an
> > easy way to enumerate maps to download.) Then you have to do the work of
> > finding the right maps to download. I'd probably build the lists and
> > download them in sections, not the entire trail. The app will get very
> slow
> > and cumbersome with the entire trail loaded.
> >
> > Bottom line, when I do the trail, I'll probably be carrying a Garmin...
> > Apple would have to wonders on the battery front to change my mind.
> >
> > BillB
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mar 11, 2011, at 3:41 PM, Will M wrote:
> >
> > > So what files do I need to download from halfmile's site? There are
> > > waypoints, tracks, topo files , etc..not sure which I need though I did
> > > download topo from the app store.
> > >
> > > Will
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:57 PM, Kevin Cook <hikelite at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Halfmile is quick!
> > >>
> > >> I've settled on GaiaGPS on my iPhone. It lets you download offline map
> > data
> > >> and it will import all of halfmile's waypoints. I'm really liking it.
> I
> > have
> > >> Topo Map too. Halfmile is right, it's nice. I don't like that it
> doesn't
> > >> show the trail on many of the topos. Since I have both, I'll probably
> > use
> > >> both. I'm just not sure I'll download the hi res maps in Topo Maps.
> > >>
> > >> As he said, Backcountry Navigator is an Android app, so you can't get
> it
> > on
> > >> the iPhone.
> > >>
> > >> One more thing Will, you were misinformed about the iPhone's GPS
> needing
> > a
> > >> cell tower. It uses satellites just like any other good GPS. It has an
> > >> advantage over the GPS only devices, in that it CAN use the cell
> towers
> > to
> > >> help fix your location. They aren't needed though. I've compared it
> with
> > my
> > >> Garmin and DeLorme GPS's, and the iPhone appears to be about the same
> > >> accuracy. It's usually within 20 ft. Good enough for me. I'm either
> > right
> > >> where I'm standing, or about 10 feet to either side of myself LOL
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 3:38 PM, Halfmile <list at lon.net> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> My favorite iPhone GPS apps are:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> >
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/basic-gps-now-utm-mgrs-email/id293699773?mt=8
> > >>>
> > >>> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/topo-maps/id306014271?mt=8
> > >>>
> > >>> Basic GPS has nothing to load, but you will need paper maps with UTM
> > >>> grids printed on them. If your unfamiliar with UTM see this:
> > >>> http://www.maptools.com/UsingUTM/quickUTM.html
> > >>>
> > >>> Topo Maps allows downloading of USGS topo maps and importing of
> > >>> waypoints for offline viewing. You will want to pre-load data when
> you
> > >>> have a WiFi connection.
> > >>>
> > >>> -Halfmile
> > >>> www.pctmap.net
> > >>>
> > >>> ps - Backcounty navigator is good too, but it's an Android App.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:19 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>> I'm looking to try out the iphone gps. I'm told that without maps
> > >>> stored on
> > >>>> the iphhone itself, the gps function will not really work without a
> > >>> signal
> > >>>> from a cell tower.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> With that in mind, can someone recommend a good app or software that
> > >>> they
> > >>>> would recommend for the iphone.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Thanks
> > >>>> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> Pct-L mailing list
> > >>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > >>>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > >>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >>>>
> > >>>> List Archives:
> > >>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >>>>
> > >>> _______________________________________________
> > >>> Pct-L mailing list
> > >>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > >>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >>>
> > >>> List Archives:
> > >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Pct-L mailing list
> > > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > > List Archives:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 22
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 21:19:31 -0400
> From: Paul Robison <paulrobisonhome at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Best iphone gps app
> To: Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <B0F563F3-BBED-4587-AE21-C99EEA244CC1 at yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Halfmiles maps have water sources and camp sights on them, but if your
> waypoints are limited they won't show... I don't have an iPhone so my
> experience is from my garmin
>
> Sent from my iPod
>
> On 2011-03-12, at 3:21 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for all of the advice. Downloaded Topo with the halfmile wayponts
> > and it looks awesome! Just out of curiosity, are there waypoints
> available
> > for water sources and/or good camping spots?
> >
> > Thanks again everyone,
> >
> > Jalan Jalan
> > On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Bill Burge <bill at burge.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> The use of the cell towers can get you an initial fix faster than the
> GPS
> >> chip on the iPhone, but then the GPS chip uses the standard satellite
> >> signals to refine that location.
> >>
> >> The Halfmile waypoints are the main files you need. The maps for
> something
> >> like GaiaGPS or TopoMaps have to be downloaded from the topo map servers
> >> that their software supports. GaiaGPS has all the tracking and photo
> >> marking and timing and stuff that isn't a lot of use on the Trail.
> >>
> >> I second the recommendations of GaiaGPS for mapped locations and
> TopoMaps,
> >> I have both and use them for their different purposes. BasicGPS is an
> app
> >> that tells you your current location in many different ways that might
> apply
> >> to many different kinds of maps.
> >>
> >> Another to look at is Accuterra Unlimited. The maps are not as good,
> but
> >> they make it REAL easy to get the maps for the trail. Still, I reach
> for
> >> TopoMaps before I open Accuterra.
> >>
> >> (I just now see that the makers of GaiaGPS have offered the map loading,
> >> reading and waypoint management functions of GaiaGPS, without all the
> >> tracking stuff, as a free app called Offline Topo Maps (catchy name
> Andrew!
> >> ;-) and I'll be grabbing that right now to try out.
> >>
> >> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/offline-topo-maps/id376535806?mt=8
> >>
> >> AccuTerra Unlimited
> >>
> >>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/accuterra-unlimited-maps-gps/id355787609?mt=8
> >>
> >> If I had to pick one app (besides the Basic GPS app Halfmile mentions)
> I'd
> >> probably go with TopoMaps. (It might be Offline Topo Maps, if there is
> an
> >> easy way to enumerate maps to download.) Then you have to do the work of
> >> finding the right maps to download. I'd probably build the lists and
> >> download them in sections, not the entire trail. The app will get very
> slow
> >> and cumbersome with the entire trail loaded.
> >>
> >> Bottom line, when I do the trail, I'll probably be carrying a Garmin...
> >> Apple would have to wonders on the battery front to change my mind.
> >>
> >> BillB
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mar 11, 2011, at 3:41 PM, Will M wrote:
> >>
> >>> So what files do I need to download from halfmile's site? There are
> >>> waypoints, tracks, topo files , etc..not sure which I need though I did
> >>> download topo from the app store.
> >>>
> >>> Will
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:57 PM, Kevin Cook <hikelite at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Halfmile is quick!
> >>>>
> >>>> I've settled on GaiaGPS on my iPhone. It lets you download offline map
> >> data
> >>>> and it will import all of halfmile's waypoints. I'm really liking it.
> I
> >> have
> >>>> Topo Map too. Halfmile is right, it's nice. I don't like that it
> doesn't
> >>>> show the trail on many of the topos. Since I have both, I'll probably
> >> use
> >>>> both. I'm just not sure I'll download the hi res maps in Topo Maps.
> >>>>
> >>>> As he said, Backcountry Navigator is an Android app, so you can't get
> it
> >> on
> >>>> the iPhone.
> >>>>
> >>>> One more thing Will, you were misinformed about the iPhone's GPS
> needing
> >> a
> >>>> cell tower. It uses satellites just like any other good GPS. It has an
> >>>> advantage over the GPS only devices, in that it CAN use the cell
> towers
> >> to
> >>>> help fix your location. They aren't needed though. I've compared it
> with
> >> my
> >>>> Garmin and DeLorme GPS's, and the iPhone appears to be about the same
> >>>> accuracy. It's usually within 20 ft. Good enough for me. I'm either
> >> right
> >>>> where I'm standing, or about 10 feet to either side of myself LOL
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 3:38 PM, Halfmile <list at lon.net> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> My favorite iPhone GPS apps are:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/basic-gps-now-utm-mgrs-email/id293699773?mt=8
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/topo-maps/id306014271?mt=8
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Basic GPS has nothing to load, but you will need paper maps with UTM
> >>>>> grids printed on them. If your unfamiliar with UTM see this:
> >>>>> http://www.maptools.com/UsingUTM/quickUTM.html
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Topo Maps allows downloading of USGS topo maps and importing of
> >>>>> waypoints for offline viewing. You will want to pre-load data when
> you
> >>>>> have a WiFi connection.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Halfmile
> >>>>> www.pctmap.net
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ps - Backcounty navigator is good too, but it's an Android App.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:19 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>> I'm looking to try out the iphone gps. I'm told that without maps
> >>>>> stored on
> >>>>>> the iphhone itself, the gps function will not really work without a
> >>>>> signal
> >>>>>> from a cell tower.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> With that in mind, can someone recommend a good app or software that
> >>>>> they
> >>>>>> would recommend for the iphone.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>>>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>>>>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> List Archives:
> >>>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>>>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>>>
> >>>>> List Archives:
> >>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>
> >>> List Archives:
> >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 23
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 18:35:17 -0700
> From: "Jim Keener ( J J )" <pct2010 at ridgetrailhiker.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Best iphone gps app
> To: Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <EAE96A25-CF90-427F-92A3-05AAFFFA4F27 at ridgetrailhiker.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Check Halfmile's waypoints. Water and camp locations have their own
> waypoints.
>
> Jim Keener ( J J )
>
> On Mar 12, 2011, at 12:21 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for all of the advice. Downloaded Topo with the halfmile wayponts
> > and it looks awesome! Just out of curiosity, are there waypoints
> available
> > for water sources and/or good camping spots?
> >
> > Thanks again everyone,
> >
> > Jalan Jalan
> > On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Bill Burge <bill at burge.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> The use of the cell towers can get you an initial fix faster than the
> GPS
> >> chip on the iPhone, but then the GPS chip uses the standard satellite
> >> signals to refine that location.
> >>
> >> The Halfmile waypoints are the main files you need. The maps for
> something
> >> like GaiaGPS or TopoMaps have to be downloaded from the topo map servers
> >> that their software supports. GaiaGPS has all the tracking and photo
> >> marking and timing and stuff that isn't a lot of use on the Trail.
> >>
> >> I second the recommendations of GaiaGPS for mapped locations and
> TopoMaps,
> >> I have both and use them for their different purposes. BasicGPS is an
> app
> >> that tells you your current location in many different ways that might
> apply
> >> to many different kinds of maps.
> >>
> >> Another to look at is Accuterra Unlimited. The maps are not as good,
> but
> >> they make it REAL easy to get the maps for the trail. Still, I reach
> for
> >> TopoMaps before I open Accuterra.
> >>
> >> (I just now see that the makers of GaiaGPS have offered the map loading,
> >> reading and waypoint management functions of GaiaGPS, without all the
> >> tracking stuff, as a free app called Offline Topo Maps (catchy name
> Andrew!
> >> ;-) and I'll be grabbing that right now to try out.
> >>
> >> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/offline-topo-maps/id376535806?mt=8
> >>
> >> AccuTerra Unlimited
> >>
> >>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/accuterra-unlimited-maps-gps/id355787609?mt=8
> >>
> >> If I had to pick one app (besides the Basic GPS app Halfmile mentions)
> I'd
> >> probably go with TopoMaps. (It might be Offline Topo Maps, if there is
> an
> >> easy way to enumerate maps to download.) Then you have to do the work of
> >> finding the right maps to download. I'd probably build the lists and
> >> download them in sections, not the entire trail. The app will get very
> slow
> >> and cumbersome with the entire trail loaded.
> >>
> >> Bottom line, when I do the trail, I'll probably be carrying a Garmin...
> >> Apple would have to wonders on the battery front to change my mind.
> >>
> >> BillB
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mar 11, 2011, at 3:41 PM, Will M wrote:
> >>
> >>> So what files do I need to download from halfmile's site? There are
> >>> waypoints, tracks, topo files , etc..not sure which I need though I did
> >>> download topo from the app store.
> >>>
> >>> Will
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:57 PM, Kevin Cook <hikelite at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Halfmile is quick!
> >>>>
> >>>> I've settled on GaiaGPS on my iPhone. It lets you download offline map
> >> data
> >>>> and it will import all of halfmile's waypoints. I'm really liking it.
> I
> >> have
> >>>> Topo Map too. Halfmile is right, it's nice. I don't like that it
> doesn't
> >>>> show the trail on many of the topos. Since I have both, I'll probably
> >> use
> >>>> both. I'm just not sure I'll download the hi res maps in Topo Maps.
> >>>>
> >>>> As he said, Backcountry Navigator is an Android app, so you can't get
> it
> >> on
> >>>> the iPhone.
> >>>>
> >>>> One more thing Will, you were misinformed about the iPhone's GPS
> needing
> >> a
> >>>> cell tower. It uses satellites just like any other good GPS. It has an
> >>>> advantage over the GPS only devices, in that it CAN use the cell
> towers
> >> to
> >>>> help fix your location. They aren't needed though. I've compared it
> with
> >> my
> >>>> Garmin and DeLorme GPS's, and the iPhone appears to be about the same
> >>>> accuracy. It's usually within 20 ft. Good enough for me. I'm either
> >> right
> >>>> where I'm standing, or about 10 feet to either side of myself LOL
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 3:38 PM, Halfmile <list at lon.net> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> My favorite iPhone GPS apps are:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/basic-gps-now-utm-mgrs-email/id293699773?mt=8
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/topo-maps/id306014271?mt=8
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Basic GPS has nothing to load, but you will need paper maps with UTM
> >>>>> grids printed on them. If your unfamiliar with UTM see this:
> >>>>> http://www.maptools.com/UsingUTM/quickUTM.html
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Topo Maps allows downloading of USGS topo maps and importing of
> >>>>> waypoints for offline viewing. You will want to pre-load data when
> you
> >>>>> have a WiFi connection.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Halfmile
> >>>>> www.pctmap.net
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ps - Backcounty navigator is good too, but it's an Android App.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 2:19 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>> I'm looking to try out the iphone gps. I'm told that without maps
> >>>>> stored on
> >>>>>> the iphhone itself, the gps function will not really work without a
> >>>>> signal
> >>>>>> from a cell tower.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> With that in mind, can someone recommend a good app or software that
> >>>>> they
> >>>>>> would recommend for the iphone.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>>>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>>>>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> List Archives:
> >>>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>>>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>>>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>>>
> >>>>> List Archives:
> >>>>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Pct-L mailing list
> >>> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >>> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>>
> >>> List Archives:
> >>> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pct-L mailing list
> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >>
> >> List Archives:
> >> http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 24
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 18:44:19 -0700
> From: Halfmile <list at lon.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Best iphone gps app
> To: Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikrE2vLtY5+eyvH=6KPaY0EKPXdDmvERZMQG_oq at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Jalan Jalan,
> My waypoints use the following naming convention
>
> WR - water report locations
> WA - water not on the water report, almost always north of Kennedy
> Meadows where the water report stops
> CS - campsite
> RD - road
> Hwy - highway
> PO - post office
>
> You should find these in the waypoints you loaded.
>
> -Halfmile
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 12:21 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks for all of the advice. ?Downloaded Topo with the halfmile wayponts
> > and it looks ?awesome! ?Just out of curiosity, are there waypoints
> available
> > for water sources and/or good camping spots?
> >
> > Thanks again everyone,
> >
> > Jalan Jalan
> > On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Bill Burge <bill at burge.com> wrote:
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 25
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:03:51 -0700
> From: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: pct-l <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikWX6g6QfDNh0hXS8XQUnZtJ3ZwA9MybPc+1qEU at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Registration is open fo Kick Off
>
> --
> *Alphabetsoup*
> *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> *
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 26
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:15:16 -0700
> From: Ron <chiefcowboy at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Best iphone gps app
> To: halfmile at pctmap.net, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <pct-l at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID: <ulhm77fiw5a109p1ojy424ar.1300068916220 at email.android.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> Halfmiles maps are full.service and simply the best. Thanks again
> half.mile
>
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless Phone
>
> Halfmile <list at lon.net> wrote:
>
> >Jalan Jalan,
> >My waypoints use the following naming convention
> >
> >WR - water report locations
> >WA - water not on the water report, almost always north of Kennedy
> >Meadows where the water report stops
> >CS - campsite
> >RD - road
> >Hwy - highway
> >PO - post office
> >
> >You should find these in the waypoints you loaded.
> >
> >-Halfmile
> >
> >
> >
> >On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 12:21 PM, Will M <jalan04 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Thanks for all of the advice. ?Downloaded Topo with the halfmile
> wayponts
> >> and it looks ?awesome! ?Just out of curiosity, are there waypoints
> available
> >> for water sources and/or good camping spots?
> >>
> >> Thanks again everyone,
> >>
> >> Jalan Jalan
> >> On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Bill Burge <bill at burge.com> wrote:
> >>
> >_______________________________________________
> >Pct-L mailing list
> >Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> >List Archives:
> >http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 27
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:15:14 -0700
> From: Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=7-g69yqOv4bm2hecJkK=aEsepre-B5Y2U9rnp at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> @adzpctko: "Hey tweeps! Registration is open--temporarily (while I
> test) and for tweeps only. Please don't post on PCT-L yet."
>
> -Kevin
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Registration is open fo Kick Off
> >
> > --
> > *Alphabetsoup*
> > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> > *
> > *
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 28
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:19:07 -0700
> From: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTik0Lc+aa6a_q3T9tHwMnhbQ31T+GpoC0X_skXJ3 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> adzpctko <http://twitter.com/#!/adzpctko> PCT Kick Off
> Okay, it's official: Registration for ADZPCTKO 2011 is now open.
> http://pct77.org/adz/
> 15 minutes ago <http://twitter.com/#!/adzpctko/status/47115443953074176>
> **<
> http://twitter.com/?status=%51%75%61%6B%65%20%6D%6F%76%65%64%20%4A%61%70%61%6E%20%63%6F%61%73%74%20%38%20%66%65%65%74%3B%20%73%68%69%66%74%65%64%20%45%61%72%74%68%27%73%20%61%78%69%73%20%2D%20%68%74%74%70%3A%2F%2F%62%69%74%2E%6C%79%2F%64%58%6D%65%57%53%20%23%63%6E%6E#
> >
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:15 PM, Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > @adzpctko: "Hey tweeps! Registration is open--temporarily (while I
> > test) and for tweeps only. Please don't post on PCT-L yet."
> >
> > -Kevin
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com
> >
> > wrote:
> > > Registration is open fo Kick Off
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Alphabetsoup*
> > > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> > > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> > > *
> > > *
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Pct-L mailing list
> > > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > > List Archives:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> *Alphabetsoup*
> *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> *
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 29
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:29:32 -0700
> From: Randy Forsland <hikertrsh at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTin31iOwBUNuGb9Rt=ShQL45YM1Kv=74OPmacN0m at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Waaay too late...my check is already in the mail
>
> Redwood
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:15 PM, Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > @adzpctko: "Hey tweeps! Registration is open--temporarily (while I
> > test) and for tweeps only. Please don't post on PCT-L yet."
> >
> > -Kevin
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com
> >
> > wrote:
> > > Registration is open fo Kick Off
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Alphabetsoup*
> > > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> > > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> > > *
> > > *
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Pct-L mailing list
> > > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > >
> > > List Archives:
> > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 30
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:38:38 -0700
> From: Eric <johner27 at evergreen.edu>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikggqiKBt9cZQM6nfBYzTc6cu1U2ybXKiu6oO3K at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> Just registered! SO EXCITED! See everyone there!
>
> WAHOO!
>
> Eric
> www.primalpct.com
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:19 PM, Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > adzpctko <http://twitter.com/#!/adzpctko> PCT Kick Off
> > Okay, it's official: Registration for ADZPCTKO 2011 is now open.
> > http://pct77.org/adz/
> > 15 minutes ago <http://twitter.com/#!/adzpctko/status/47115443953074176>
> > **<
> >
> http://twitter.com/?status=%51%75%61%6B%65%20%6D%6F%76%65%64%20%4A%61%70%61%6E%20%63%6F%61%73%74%20%38%20%66%65%65%74%3B%20%73%68%69%66%74%65%64%20%45%61%72%74%68%27%73%20%61%78%69%73%20%2D%20%68%74%74%70%3A%2F%2F%62%69%74%2E%6C%79%2F%64%58%6D%65%57%53%20%23%63%6E%6E#
> > >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:15 PM, Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > @adzpctko: "Hey tweeps! Registration is open--temporarily (while I
> > > test) and for tweeps only. Please don't post on PCT-L yet."
> > >
> > > -Kevin
> > >
> > > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Alphabetsoup <
> alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > Registration is open fo Kick Off
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > *Alphabetsoup*
> > > > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> > > > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> > > > *
> > > > *
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Pct-L mailing list
> > > > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > > > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> > > >
> > > > List Archives:
> > > > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *Alphabetsoup*
> > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> > *
> > *
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Because we don't think about future generations, they will never forget us.
> ~Henrik Tikkanen
>
> ?The things you own end up owning you.?* -*Tyler Durden, *Fight Club*
>
> "The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly
> salary."?David Hieatt
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 31
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:39:47 -0700
> From: Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] ADZPCTKO
> To: Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l <Pct-L at backcountry.net>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTikH0=Bior25-W3pR2DL4oKuxphwBMNFXFRiynDT at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Yeah, just saw that. Signed up.
>
> -Kevin
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:19 PM, Alphabetsoup <alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > adzpctko?PCT Kick Off
> > Okay, it's official: Registration for ADZPCTKO 2011 is now
> > open.http://pct77.org/adz/
> > 15 minutes ago
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:15 PM, Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> @adzpctko: "Hey tweeps! Registration is open--temporarily (while I
> >> test) and for tweeps only. Please don't post on PCT-L yet."
> >>
> >> -Kevin
> >>
> >> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Alphabetsoup <
> alphabetsoupmmm at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > Registration is open fo Kick Off
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > *Alphabetsoup*
> >> > *~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~*
> >> > * www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup*
> >> > *
> >> > *
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Pct-L mailing list
> >> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> >> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> >> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >> >
> >> > List Archives:
> >> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Alphabetsoup
> > ~Soon to be PCT Thru-Hiker April 2011~
> > ?www.postholer.com/alphabetsoup
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 32
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 19:41:18 -0700
> From: Kevin Renfrow <kevinrenfrow at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] Resupplies
> To: Csilla Tabor <csilla.tabor at gmail.com>
> Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=DuVqukxETcy3NN0eR3LDyaZBJNp+sMUYTnGdo at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Were there any corrections?
>
> -Kevin
>
> On Sat, Mar 12, 2011 at 9:49 AM, Csilla Tabor <csilla.tabor at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > I just called several non-post office resupply spots I found on
> > planyourhike.com to make sure I had accurate information, and everyone I
> > talked to was super nice and helpful. I didn't think it was possible for
> me
> > to be more excited to get going, but now I am!
> > ? ~Csilla~
> >
> > .....hiking in 39 days!
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 33
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 20:12:15 -0700
> From: Austin Williams <austinwilliams123 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [pct-l] One Last Joke (again)
> To: abiegen at cox.net, pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTimk6-khZ92+bS=BeyeAb4ej5fDBb-KkQWJ5YzFs at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> lol
>
> Austin Williams
>
> www.PlanYourHike.com <http://www.planyourhike.com/>
> Info on PCT gear, resupply points, maps, movies, etc.
>
> "*Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in a
> fruit salad.*"
> -Proverb
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 5:08 PM, <abiegen at cox.net> wrote:
>
> > So Switchback is a thru-hiker through and through. Hiked most of the long
> > trails, some more than once. Being a through hiker has cost him though,
> in
> > terms of job opportunities and relationships. Keeping jobs just long
> enough
> > to get some money for the next thru. Mattress testing, pool lapping, lap
> > dancing, looting hiker booty and putting the odd damsel into distress
> just
> > doesn't pay very much and you really can't afford to buy a house or have
> any
> > permanent relationships. So Switchback lived at home with his mother,
> > Talkback, his brother Laidback and his cat Kyphosis. He cared very deeply
> > for them. On his thru hikes when he got to towns he would always call
> home
> > to chat with his loved ones.
> >
> > Starting out on another thru hike of the PCT, Switchback made his first
> > stop at Lake Morena. After putting up his tarp and arranging his gear,
> > consuming some donuts and setting a few traps for unsuspecting hikers, he
> > called home. Laidback answered the phone.
> >
> > "So, how's it going?" Switchback asked.
> >
> > His brother Laidback answered, "Kyphosis is dead."
> >
> > Switchback went ballistic. "My favorite cat died and you just tell me
> like
> > that? You knew I was going to be gone for five months. You knew I would
> be
> > calling at each town I passed through. You could have broken it to me
> > gently, darn it. The first time I called you could have said 'Kyphosis is
> on
> > the roof and we can't get her down.'
> >
> > When I called from Mount Laguna you could have said that the fire
> > department had come over but they were having trouble catching the cat on
> > the roof. When I called from Warner Springs you could have said that the
> > firemen caught Kyphosis but the cat fell and was slightly injured. When I
> > called from Idyllwild You could have said that the cat was in the pet
> > hospital, but the outlook still was good. When I called from Wrightwood
> you
> > could have told me that the she took a turn for the worse but the best
> > veterinary surgeons were working on her. When I called from Agua Dulce
> you
> > could have told me that they tried their best but Kyphosis died quietly
> in
> > her sleep."
> >
> > "You break things like this gently, you don't just blurt it out! "
> > Switchback went on. " I don't know why you are so insensitive. I'm just
> fed
> > up with you! I don't want to talk to you any more! Put Mom on the phone."
> >
> > Laidback replied, "Mom's on the roof and we can't get her down."
> >
> > TrailHacker
> > "*Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Comedy is know who to throw
> it
> > at.*"
> > -Proverb
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pct-L mailing list
> > Pct-L at backcountry.net
> > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
> >
> > List Archives:
> > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 34
> Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 20:31:10 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Rides to & from ADZPCTKO offered
> To: pct-l at backcountry.net
> Message-ID: <781141.39338.qm at web111608.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
> ?
> I live in Agua Dulce and am planning to?drive to the KICKOFF - ADZPCTKO.?I
> will
> have room for up to four hikers with their packs.?My plan is to pick up
> hikers
> at the Saufleys at 10:30 AM on Friday, 4-29-11.? Next stop will be at
> McDonalds,
> Cajon Pass for lunch. We should be there by about noon. If?I don't already
> have
> four,?I can take more from McDonalds.?We will be passing Warner Springs and
> if
> there is still room?I?could pick up from there too. We should be at Lake
> Morena
> by around 4:30 PM.?
>
>
> On Sunday morning, 5-1-11?we will leave to drive north by around 9:30 AM.
>
> This should allow some of those who want to start their hikes early?and
> avoid
> the "Herd" to still be able to go to the Kickoff.?Saturday is the biggest
> day.
>
> Please email me or call me to confi...
>
> [Message clipped]
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