[pct-l] Food question from Mid life Crisis

Fri Mar 4 22:42:58 CST 2011

All,

Of course, you need to HYOH.  I just find it to be optimal to carry a ratio
closer to 50% fat when I hike :) My body deals with it just fine.  Also,
your body literally does not need carbs:
http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/2009/8/28/carbohydrates-no-dietary-requirement-but-metabolically-criti.html

This lower carb diet (~50-100g/day in the form of starch/veggies/some
fruit/some nuts) is closer to what I eat when not hiking.

Also some carb consumption from beer.  Dear god, I love me some beer. :)

Have an awesome evening, I'm out!

Regards,
Eric
www.primalpct.com

P.S. More comments below

Dear PCT,
>
> Yoshi is correct in "optimal" macro-nutrient proportions as carbohydrates
> are the most efficient form of energy for the body.  However, the weight of
> food is a serious issue for long distance hiking and one can get about 2
> times the energy from a pound of nuts than from a pound of cereal product.
> Your body will have to go through extra steps to convert the fat to energy
> but I think a healthy body can deal with this.  Yoshi is still correct as
> far as what is optimal but hauling around more fat is optimal for
> ultra-light distance hiking.  Maybe a 55/60--10/15--25/30 distribution would
> idealize the best of both worlds.
>
> I don't think there is one set macro ratio that will work for everybody.
 However, the "Eat real food" adage by Michael Pollan I agree wholeheartedly
with. I also believe a higher ratio of fat would be beneficial for most.

> Age makes a big difference.  Some of you lean young men with no body fat,
> who are still growing and burning 8,000 kcal/day might want to carry more
> fat just to get enough energy on the trail.  Old people like Yoshi and I
> will want to gravitate more towards "the old person" distribution.  Our
> bodies aren't as efficient and need all the help we can get.  We don't go as
> fast and as far as you sweet young things anyway (-:
>
> This sounds like me :)

> Research is also supporting that slightly and I mean "slightly" more
> healthy (plant based) fat in the diet is actually beneficial in regulating
> appetite, stabilizing the glycemic index spikes in the blood and long term
> cardiovascular health.
>
> I agree, fat is definitely helpful in insulin regulation! Plant or animal,
doesn't matter though.

> Melanie
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 7:12 PM, Yoshihiro Murakami <
> completewalker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Eric
>>
>> Disagreement is unavoidable. I will write briefly ( it's my lunch time )
>>
>> My description on fat and carbohydrate  is based on "Exercise
>> physiology of mountaineering and climbing" by Masayoshi Yamamoto
>> (Japanese, published in 2000).  He is a professor of National
>> Institute of Fitness and Sports in KANOYA and also a famous climber in
>> this field. This is not my opinion.
>>
>> We can use fat as an energy source in less efficient way than
>> carbohydrate. We can train ourself to use fat, but, we cannot  perform
>> our maximum power with the "dense food". ( The ideal proportion  might
>> be indicated in Armstrong's book ).
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2011/3/5 Eric <johner27 at evergreen.edu>:
>> > Yoshi,
>> > I must respectfully disagree with your evaluation of macronutrients for
>> > hiking.  Our body, if starved of carbohydrates, will drop efficiently
>> into
>> > ketosis, a burning of fat.
>> > See: http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/faq/f/whatisketosis.htm
>> > Ketosis is an evolutionary adaptation by our bodies for times when we
>> need
>> > to survive on our energy stores.  I would place a bet that the reason
>> that
>> > the American hikers you encountered were fatigued was due to the fact
>> that
>> > (most, not all) carbohydrates are inherently inefficient - they cause an
>> > insulin spike then a crash due to depleted glycogen.
>> > What you may have been thinking of is ketoacidosis, a dangerous
>> condition
>> > that can develop if you have Type 1 diabetes.
>> > David:
>> > That being said, I would definitely take more calories, and use more
>> fat!
>> >  Something like 40-50 Carb 30 fat 20 protein.  Also recommended by
>> > nutritionist and hiker Brenda Baaten:
>> > http://thru-hiker.com/articles/PackLightEatRight/fat.htm
>> > Nuts, shelf stable bacon, avocados, and powdered butter and milk are
>> some of
>> > the high-quality fats that you could get a lot of calories/ounce for.
>>  Hope
>> > this helps!
>> > Regards,
>> > Eric
>> > www.primalpct.com
>> >
>> > On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 6:16 PM, Yoshihiro Murakami
>> > <completewalker at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Dear David
>> >>
>> >> I have only experienced JMT twice, but I think many American hiker had
>> >> insufficient foods and very fatigued.
>> >>
>> >> > A few questions..
>> >> >
>> >> > 1- Am I safe planning to consume body fat or will I be starving every
>> >> > day?
>> >>
>> >> You are not safe. Our energy system cannot use fat efficiently. If the
>> >> stock of Carbohydrate became zero, our body  make carbohydrate from
>> >> the muscles and, and produce more Nitrogenous substance. Then the load
>> >> of the kidney grows more. You will feel more fatigue.
>> >>
>> >> I had posted before on the nutrition problem. If " 7 weeks to the
>> >> perfect ride" (by L Armstrong & C. Carmichael) is right,
>> >>
>> >> The optimal weight ratio is :
>> >>  carbohydrate : protein : fat =   60-70:10-15: 9-11
>> >>
>> >> We must consider both weight ratios and total calories for healthy
>> >> hiking.  And if we hike for 8 hours, we need at least 1 Kg ( 2 pound
>> >> more )  food.( I had calculated, and confirmed the 2 pound rule is
>> >> right )
>> >>
>> >> https://sites.google.com/site/completewalker/backpacking-memo
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > 2- Does my calories per ounce ratio look ok?
>> >> > 3- Does my $'s per ounce look ok?
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Shaka Zulu
>> >> > Aka Mid Life Crisis
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
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>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Sincerely
>> >> --------------- --------------------------------------
>> >> Hiro    ( Yoshihiro Murakami )
>> >> Blogs http://completewalker.blogspot.com/
>> >> Photo http://picasaweb.google.co.jp/CompleteWalker/
>> >> Backpacking since about 1980 in Japan
>> >> 2009 JMT, the first America.
>> >> 2010 JMT, the second America.
>> >> ------------------------------------------------------
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Pct-L mailing list
>> >> Pct-L at backcountry.net
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>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Because we don't think about future generations, they will never forget
>> us.
>> > ~Henrik Tikkanen
>> >
>> > “The things you own end up owning you.” -Tyler Durden, Fight Club
>> >
>> > "The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a
>> monthly
>> > salary."—David Hieatt
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Sincerely
>> --------------- --------------------------------------
>> Hiro    ( Yoshihiro Murakami )
>> Blogs http://completewalker.blogspot.com/
>> Photo http://picasaweb.google.co.jp/CompleteWalker/
>> Backpacking since about 1980 in Japan
>> 2009 JMT, the first America.
>> 2010 JMT, the second America.
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
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>
>

-- 
Because we don't think about future generations, they will never forget us.
~Henrik Tikkanen

“The things you own end up owning you.”* -*Tyler Durden, *Fight Club*

"The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly
salary."—David Hieatt