[pct-l] Fw: Bicycle Usage Proposal

Sun Sep 19 22:38:03 CDT 2010

Ron,

You mention that you were "just kidding" about flattening their tires.  On one 
occasion, back in the 1970's, I did just that.  My wife and I were backpacking 
to the Emigrant Wilderness hiking from a TH near Cherry Dam.  When we came to 
the sign indicating that we were at the boundary of the wilderness.  This was a 
big sign located in the middle of the trail - the trail split around on both 
sides of it.. We had been following motorcycle tracks.  We could see that the 
motorcycle had stopped directly in front of the sign.  The rider had obviously 
read the sign. Part of what it said was that motorcycles and bicycles were not 
permitted in the Emigrant Wilderness.  The tracks then went around the sign.  We 
followed them for several miles until we saw where they turned off the trail.  
We found the motorcycle fairly well hidden out of sight of the trail.  I assumed 
that the rider had gone fishing.  So, what to do?  I got out my pocket knife and 
simply cut off both valve stems.  I just couldn't resist doing that.  

Here is another incident in my memory:  Someone had ridden their motorcycle over 
Piute Pass from North Lake and on into Humphrey's Basin in the John Muir 
Wilderness  A Ranger caught him and required him to remove both wheels and 
physically carry them out and deliver them to the ranger station.  The next day 
he had hike back up to carry out the rest of it.  That took two more trips.  
This happened in the late 1950's or early 1960's. 

MendoRider 

________________________________
From: Ron Dye <chiefcowboy at verizon.net>
To: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
Sent: Sun, September 19, 2010 4:29:37 PM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Fw: Bicycle Usage Proposal

Ed,

I'm for flattening their tires.  Cheaper, more effective and a great deterrent.  
(Just kidding of course).

Ron

-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net] On 
Behalf Of Edward Anderson
Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2010 5:53 PM
To: pct-l at backcountry.net
Subject: [pct-l] Fw: Bicycle Usage Proposal

I have ridden horses on various trails in Mendocino County and elsewhere and 
have encountered mountain bikers and also motorcycles.  The motorcycle riders 
are usually courteous and often stop and kill their engines when they see us.The 

horses can HEAR them coming, and so are not spooked.  It is very different with 
the bicycles since they are virtually silent and come down hills very fast 
- very dangerous.  Some horses might spook - big time - causing accidents.  My 
wife once had a very close call when a fast-moving mountain biker suddenly 
appeared, spooking her horse.

Wheeled vehicles should not be permitted on the PCT - and there should be stiff 
penalties when they are caught. How about posting the amount of the fine at 
various trail heads?  I think a fine $250.00 would discourage most.  

MendoRider

----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Ron Dye <chiefcowboy at verizon.net>
To: Greg Hardwick <gahardwick at cox.net>; CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>; 
Joel Fisler <pct at fisler.ch>
Cc: PCT listserve <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Sun, September 19, 2010 2:48:52 PM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bicycle Usage Proposal

I was somewhat ambivalent about bikes on the trail UNTIL I hiked the Tahoe
Rim Trail where they are allowed in certain areas.  While a lot of them were
respectful of the trail and hikers, others were flat out dangerous to
hikers.  At times we had to fall into the brush to avoid being run down.  We
actually had them ride through a stream immediately upstream from where we
were filtering water.  

-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
On Behalf Of Greg Hardwick
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2010 11:29 AM
To: CHUCK CHELIN; Joel Fisler
Cc: PCT listserve
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bicycle Usage Proposal

Scope creep.

Also - I hate the idea when I am hiking and have to keep looking back to see

if a bike is coming.  I am in Phoenix and we have a lot of preserve trails 
that accommodate both.  It is also really disappointing to see these fools 
going off path to make a jump and also cascading rocks down the trail.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "CHUCK CHELIN" <steeleye at wildblue.net>
To: "Joel Fisler" <pct at fisler.ch>
Cc: "PCT listserve" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2010 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Bicycle Usage Proposal

Good morning, Joel,

When discussing expanded use of the PCT there’s always concern about where
it will stop.  If bikes are allowed soon there will develop the “PCT
Cycle-Cross Race”.  Next will come motorcycles and the “PCT Motocross Race”.
Ridicules?  Each additional step towards mechanizing the PCT (semi) supports
expansion to the next step.

A practical difficulty arising from cycles, of either type, is peculiar
damage caused by wheels.  Whereas footprints – particularly pack/saddle
animal prints – cause some damage to the trail tread surface, the damage is
spotty.  Wheel damage tends to be one, long, more-or-less continuous,
relatively narrow, groove which absolutely begs water to follow and create
an erosion path.  Where I live – and perform trail maintenance – in the
rainy Pacific NW the problem is particularly bad.

Steel-Eye

Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT – 1965

http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye

http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09

On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:52 AM, Joel Fisler <pct at fisler.ch> wrote:

> I totally disagree with the two postings.
>
> First of all, if you crash all the time and break your bones then you 
> might
> be better off hiking. But making this a general rule for everyone is 
> wrong.
> Furthermore you are confusing mountain biking with road cycling. Mountain
> biking on a paved road does not make sense at all. I am a mountain biker 
> and
> I try to avoid roads (even fire roads) as much as I can because for me the
> nice thing about mountain biking is that I can be AWAY from roads and cars
> and everything.
>
> Second: Personally I would love to do the PCT with the bike. Its an ideal
> trail, its usually not too steep, wide enough and smooth for bikes and you
> could bike for weeks and weeks. I am totally for that. In fact, I dont
> understand why in the US so many trails are off-limits for mountain bikes.
> In Europe you are usually allowed to bike on all the trails e.g. in the
> Alps. Using common sense (dont pass hikers with 20mph, be courteous etc.)
> avoids conflicts with hikers and I personally never had any problems or
> arguments with hikers. Why the need for all those regulations? Isnt the US
> all about freedom and non-regulation? Why having trails for horses or 
> hikers
> only, for bikers, for people with dogs etc. Why not allow everyone use the
> trails?
>
> Anyway, thanks for the link, I'll try to promote it where I can :-)
>
> Bye
> Joel
>
>
>
> On 18.09.2010, at 08:25, Melanie Clarke wrote:
>
> > tree root, rock etc.  Let's preserve our pristine trails for hiking. 
> > The
> > trail is no place for a bike!!!
> >
>
>
> ___________________________________________
> Joël Fisler - joel at fisler.ch - http://blog.fisler.ch
>
> HOME:  Hegibachstrasse 20, 8032 Zürich
> PHONE:  +41 43 4998365 oder "joelfisler" (Skype)
> CHAT:  fisler at mac.com (Messenger & iChat)
> ___________________________________________
>
>
>
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