[pct-l] foot ware and Spring run-off

Thu Oct 14 14:17:19 CDT 2010

Steel-Eye,

I really don't know how it worked, but that it did. We even have some pictures of Captain Growler shin-deep in the creek above Big Pete where he simply just splashed through it rather than do the rock-hop, but I don't think they're posted in the Mountain Education Facebook Album; I'll have to go through the 1200 stills to find it. We've probably got it on video as well, but we're still wading through those 20 hours of HD tape...

In a deep crossing like the South Fork of the Kings, where the water was thigh-deep and rushing by, there was no hope for dry boots, just be careful about your footing, stay balanced, and pick your way across. We did find that, since the big crossing are down below snowline, the wet boots combined with new, dry socks, dried out before reaching snowline again. Again, I don't understand either the engineering of the boots nor the physics of how they dry out so well, but they did and for each of the three of us with the same non-custom boots from Limmer. So, with the exception of the deep crossings, we always had warm and dry feet through the snow and trail splashing from Olancha Peak to Evolution Valley.

Got to add that this Spring's run-off and thaw was late and sudden. As you can all see from the posted stills, we still had zero-degree nights and snow storms until the base of Forester on May 24th where after we exited over Kearsarge on May 26th for a funeral. Compare the shots of the Bullfrog Lake area then to when we returned June 15th, almost three weeks and three-feet-melted-off later, and you'll realize that water was running everywhere. You couldn't go anywhere in the canyons without hearing the roar of water falling off rocks and down creeks around you! The trail was often a creek, itself, and where it wasn't it was a major mud trough. After awhile, you just got tired of it and chose to hop the rocks along the sides, instead....

Ned Tibbits, Director
Mountain Education
1106A Ski Run Blvd
South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
    P: 888-996-8333
    F: 530-541-1456
    C: 530-721-1551
    http://www.mountaineducation.org
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: CHUCK CHELIN 
  To: ned at mountaineducation.org 
  Cc: Jim & Jane Moody ; Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes ; pct-l at backcountry.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:44 PM
  Subject: Re: [pct-l] foot ware

  Good evening, Ned,

  Footwear that always remains dry under all conditions -- whether from slop and wading or from perspiration – for weeks at a time is truly remarkable.  Further – and even more remarkable – is a pair of gaiters that keep shin-deep water out of one’s boots.

  I am monumentally embarrassed that I’m so far behind that technology curve.

  Steel-Eye

  Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT – 1965

  http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye

  http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09

  On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 11:58 AM, <ned at mountaineducation.org> wrote:

    Hey, Mango!

    Let me add that our boots used between KM and the MTR in the months of May
    and June when there was six diminishing to two feet of snow nearly
    everywhere above 9,000 feet did exceptionally well, not only for certainty
    of footing but in staying dry and keeping our feet dry, especially when
    there was water running everywhere!

    Of course, through the shallow creek crossings (water up to mid-shin), we
    wore our heavy weight tall gaitors, which kept the water out, but on the
    sections of trail which were, literally, mini-creeks, where each footfall
    was a huge splash onto the other foot, we didn't and still the boots kept
    our feet dry.

    Because the boots were maintained as needed on-trail with a waterproof
    manufacturer-supplied treatment, they never got wet enough to freeze at
    night, even when at the base of Forester when we had a zero-degree night
    where every water container froze solid.

    Good comment about loosening laces of wet shoes on nights where you
    anticipate a freeze! Trying to get your feet into a stiff boot in the
    morning is sometimes challenging!

    Ned Tibbits, Director
    Mountain Education
    1106A Ski Run Blvd
    South Lake Tahoe, Ca. 96150
       P: 888-996-8333
       F: 530-541-1456
       C: 530-721-1551
       http://www.mountaineducation.org

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jim & Jane Moody" <moodyjj at comcast.net>
    To: "Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes" <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
    Cc: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
    Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:19 AM
    Subject: Re: [pct-l] foot ware

    >
    >
    > I disagree with a portion of Diane's post about footwear in the Sierra
    > (below). Heavier boots were much preferred in the Sierra this past year,
    > which had a much higher than average snowpack. Kicking steps in trail
    > runners on a steep traverse (e.g., Mather Pass) requires a shoe that is
    > sturdy with an actual heel and firm sole, which trail runners / sneakers
    > do not have. For those who hike the Sierra when the snow is gone, then I
    > guess sneakers would suffice.
    >
    >
    >
    > The "dry out quicker" argument is also specious. This year the Sierra had
    > so many creek crossings that nobody's shoes dried out, boots or sneakers.
    > However, if they freeze overnight, then trail runners are easier to get
    > on, especially if you forget to loosen the laces on your boots.
    >
    >
    >
    > Her comments about the sandals in the desert seem like great advice, from
    > personal experience.
    >
    >
    > Mango
    >
    >
    >
    > ----- Original Message -----
    > From: "Diane Soini of Santa Barbara Hikes" <diane at santabarbarahikes.com>
    > To: pct-l at backcountry.net
    > Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:08:14 AM
    > Subject: Re: [pct-l] foot ware
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Boots are actually a liability in the Sierras because they don't dry
    > as quickly on your feet while you walk. Of course, if you're a
    > traditionalist, you'll reject that assertion on some notion of
    > needing protection or support or shoes that don't wear out quickly,
    > or shoes that can handle the supposedly super rugged conditions
    > (seemed like a regular trail to me). That's fine.
    >
    >
    > _______________________________________________
    > Pct-L mailing list
    > Pct-L at backcountry.net
    > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
    > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
    >
    > List Archives:
    > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/
    > _______________________________________________
    > Pct-L mailing list
    > Pct-L at backcountry.net
    > To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
    > http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l
    >
    > List Archives:
    > http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/

    _______________________________________________

    Pct-L mailing list
    Pct-L at backcountry.net
    To unsubcribe, or change options visit:
    http://mailman.backcountry.net/mailman/listinfo/pct-l

    List Archives:
    http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/