[pct-l] Of Cutting Ounces and Sacrificing Quality
dnlcyclone at aol.com
dnlcyclone at aol.com
Mon Mar 22 21:38:26 CDT 2010
I think it's safe to say that most of us on this forum are ultralight packers/enthusiasts to varied degrees, but cut out of the same fabric nonetheless. I understand the limitations for weight are heightened for solo-hikers as compared to those of us who travel with a companion or two...but I think the conversation of DriDucks illuminates a big red flag with those of us who probably cut your tags off your shirts: you're probably sacrificing a good degree of already-lightweight quality of slightly heavier gear in favor of cheap crap. I've already seen three posts of how their DriDucks tore "sitting" on them. Um...what happens when you brush up against some thorny alders, rocks...earth objects? It's going to tear. And if it doesn't...it will soon. Somebody talked about a "heavy" 11-oz rainjacket. Again, kudos to all of our ilk who hikes their own hike, to each their own...but I think the extreme end of the spectrum is really being abused. Obviously, people have made it through (or thru) alive with ultra-minimalist approach, but I don't think you have to be a statistician to figure out that there is a high probability that shitty gear has a STRONG influence and impact on the futility of many of the hikes that start off with such good intentions. Injury and illness being the two key culprits. Shitty rain gear = hypothermia. Shitty shoes or trying to make the hike on two pairs = plantar fascitis, ilio-tibial band syndrome, etc. Shitty sleeping pad = sleep deprivation/fatigue/immune system debilitation, etc. An 11 ounce rainjacket will NOT BREAK YOUR BACK. It will not. I encourage those of you to read up on Justin Lichter who is sponsored by montbell and Granite Gear, two of the best gear outfits in the business. His 2.5 pound pack (just the weight of backpack sans any gear/food) was light enough for him to hike 10,000 miles in less than a year.
Again, cheers to those who like hiking with crap, but I find it ironic how those who preach about safety and preparation, are equally prepared to risk their own safety with inferior gear.
Deadbeat Dave
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Subject: Pct-l Digest, Vol 27, Issue 138
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oday's Topics:
1. Re: Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker (David Ellzey)
2. Re: Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker (Denis Stanton)
3. Re: Printing Halfmile's Maps (Eugene Leafty)
4. Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker (Michael Herrera)
5. DriDucks rain gear too fragile? (Dan Africk)
6. Keeping feet dry in the rain. (Dan Africk)
7. A REAL iceaxe (Deems)
8. Re: DriDucks rain gear too fragile? (Scott Herriott)
9. Re: DriDucks rain gear too fragile? (Dan Africk)
10. Re: A REAL iceaxe (CHUCK CHELIN)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:31:52 -0500
rom: David Ellzey <david at xpletive.com>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker
o: "Pct-l at backcountry.net" <Pct-l at backcountry.net>
essage-ID:
<3CF44C7E5B716541B6A0A9AF694AC66332FF8B7076 at AUSP01VMBX02.collaborationhost.net>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mike is at mile 127 if I remember correctly...
BigToe
-----Original Message-----
rom: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net] On
ehalf Of Don Billings
ent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:23 PM
o: Michael Herrera
c: Pct-l at backcountry.net
ubject: Re: [pct-l] Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker
Mike,
You mentioned your street, but what town are you in? (Can't get a fix on the
iker just by your street name).
Don
----- Original Message ----
rom: Michael Herrera <mikeh at casaherrera.com>
o: pct-l at backcountry.net
ent: Mon, March 22, 2010 3:28:17 PM
ubject: [pct-l] Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker
the pct thru hike has started ,march 17th a thru hiker stopped by my house on
hihuahua vally road i think his name was clinton ," i could be wrong" hiker
rash all look alike after a while ,i think he said he started on the 10th good
uck the hike is ON
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Message: 2
ate: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 12:38:10 +1300
rom: Denis Stanton <denisstanton at mac.com>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker
o: Don Billings <dbillings803 at yahoo.com>
c: Pct-l at backcountry.net, Michael Herrera <mikeh at casaherrera.com>
essage-ID: <C1164AF2-0E29-4E63-B8CD-A8E73D161268 at mac.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Don
Mike's address isn't really in a town. It's a road crossing a day and a half
orth of Warner Springs
I THINK the location you are looking for is 33.38125 N, 116.5907 W
Mike, correct me if I have it wrong. I thought I had tagged the spot, but I
an't find the tag.
Denis
On 23/03/2010, at 12:23 PM, Don Billings wrote:
> Mike,
You mentioned your street, but what town are you in? (Can't get a fix on the
iker just by your street name).
------------------------------
Message: 3
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 16:54:46 -0700
rom: "Eugene Leafty" <atetuna at hotmail.com>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] Printing Halfmile's Maps
o: "'PCT MailingList'" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
essage-ID: <SNT102-DS595C9DC9F5A39D157D417B1270 at phx.gbl>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
If you want to pick up your maps in the San Diego area, you can have the
aps printed at the TransAmerica Printing located at 550 Grand Avenue,
pring Valley, CA 91977. The contact here is Tracy, 1-858-761-5404. I
ound them on the Lazerquick website, although they're not affiliated
nymore because their franchise agreement ended a couple months ago.
Anyway, full color, full page, double-sided maps cost $88 plus tax. It
osts about the same as the place in Oregon when shipping is factored in. I
ent with the place in Spring Valley primarily because I wanted to see the
aps before I paid for them, and also because it's a short walk from my
ouse. Also, I got two sets of maps. The second set of maps where half
ize, two pages per side, double sided. I wanted my maps like that because
t'd be easier to handle, but it had the added bonus of costing about half
s much.
Eugene
-----Original Message-----
rom: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
n Behalf Of Halfmile
ent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 8:23 AM
o: PCT MailingList
ubject: [pct-l] Printing Halfmile's Maps
A few weeks back, color printing options for my free maps from
ww.pctmap.net was discussed on the PCT-L. In a private email someone
uggested I contact a company called Lazerquick (www.lazerquick.com),
hich I did. Lazerquick printed a test of California Section A for me
nd the print quality is excellent, much better than my printer at
ome or any of the many laser printers at work.
The prices seem reasonable considering the quality. Lazerquick's price
s $75 (plus Shipping) for 2-sided color printing of all my maps the
CT. This is less than lulu.com, which was also came up in the PCT-L
iscussion. They offer discounts for quantities of 10 or 20 if enough
ikers wanted to go in together do a group order.
The Lazerquick I have been dealing with is in Portland Oregon. The
mail is center48 at lazerquick.com; the phone number is 503-228-6306.
sk them about "Halfmile's PCT Maps" and they should know what you are
alking about. They have copies of my map files there, so all you
ould need to do is email or call them to work out any printing you
ant done.
When I sent the files to Lazerquick I merged my PCT maps into three .pdf
iles:
Southern California - 152 pages (Campo to Tuolumne Meadows)
orthern California - 129 pages (Tuolumne Meadows to near Ashland Oregon)
regon/Washington - 177 page (near Ashland Oregon to Manning Park Canada)
A few blank pages have been inserted into these files so that PCT
ections always start on a new page and horizontal pages are rotated
ppropriately depending of if they are odd or even.
If you do decide to use Lazerquick's services it's between you and
hem, I make no money from this referral. I am just passing this
nformation on as an option and hope it helps someone, I know printing
50 pages of maps can be a chore, especially if you don't have a good
rinter.
-Halfmile
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------------------------------
Message: 4
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 16:58:23 -0700
rom: "Michael Herrera" <mikeh at casaherrera.com>
ubject: [pct-l] Leaving with the herd /first thru hiker
o: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
essage-ID: <E5800DF28D3848FEBE44615EB67566CB at CASAHERRERA.LOCAL>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
sorry we are 127 mile from the mexican boarder its called warner springs but its
bout 18 miles north of the warner springs resort next to bucksnort mnt and
ombs peak
------------------------------
Message: 5
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:59:56 -0400
rom: Dan Africk <danstheman at gmail.com>
ubject: [pct-l] DriDucks rain gear too fragile?
o: Austin Williams <austinwilliams123 at gmail.com>
c: pct-l at backcountry.net
essage-ID:
<1b15d4fc1003221659u591709f0rf65ae4d592f00476 at mail.gmail.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
I'm a little concerned about the durability also, since I'm sometimes a bit
ough on my gear. I figure for the desert sections at th beginning, the
ight weight is a good compromise for less durability. By the time I get to
eally wet areas, I'll have a good idea of how tough it is, and I can switch
o more traditional coated nylon rain gear if necessary. Or perhaps just
eep a spare in the bounce box.
n Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 5:08 PM, Austin Williams <
ustinwilliams123 at gmail.com> wrote:
> I feel obligated to share my experience with DriDucks from two summers ago:
I ordered a pair (top and bottoms) for the obvious reasons (cost and
weight). The pants were so fragile that I literally tore a 1 inch hole in
them *before I could get out of the house*! Not even kidding. I must have
lightly run into a corner of one of our counter tops or something. Or maybe
they ripped when I was putting my bare foot into the legs.... I don't know.
Then my wife grabbed a part of the jacket between two of her fingers and
scratched at it with her fingernails while saying, "they can't possibly be
*that* fragile...." ..... and then there was a hole in the jacket...
It may have been a fluke... but I never tried them again. I would feel
more secure wearing a rainsuit made of race paper.
Does anyone else have any experience with DriDucks? Did I just get a bad
batch?
-Austin
-----------------------------
Message: 6
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 20:18:15 -0400
rom: Dan Africk <danstheman at gmail.com>
ubject: [pct-l] Keeping feet dry in the rain.
o: pct-l at backcountry.net
essage-ID:
<1b15d4fc1003221718l7de4ee08g85b3b3496e4ddf18 at mail.gmail.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
I hate having wet feet. I've always brought gaiters when I go backpacking,
ainly to keep rain and mud out of my shoes. I was planning on bringing them
or the PCT, but then I realized that my shoes have a large mesh patch in
ront of the laces, where most gaiters will not cover them. It seems like
nless I get some kind of gore-tex shoe, my feet will inevitably get soaked
n a heavy rain. That's fine for a while, but when it rains for several days
on-stop, that seems like it would be really bad and possibly lead to
mmersion foot. So I guess I have 4 questions:
1- What if anything do you do to keep your feet dry in the rain?
2 - Do gaiters help much in the rain, and is there a certain type that works
ell? (I've looked at dirty girls and SimBlissity levigaiters, but neither
over the front of the shoe or claim to be waterproof. The Outdoor Research
alamander gaiter seems like it might cover the front of a shoe, although
ts heavy and expensive.)
3 - Is it worth switching to Gore-tex for the really wet areas, like
ashington? I know your feet still get wet from sweat, but unlike rain that
an be addressed by changing your socks.
4 - What about plastic bags or tyvek booties used as cheap waterproof
ocks(worn over socks and inside of shoes)? I tried this once with a pair of
oaked boots, and it worked pretty well, but I haven't tried that for
xtended trips.
-----------------------------
Message: 7
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:18:44 -0700
rom: "Deems" <losthiker at sisqtel.net>
ubject: [pct-l] A REAL iceaxe
o: "pct" <pct-l at backcountry.net>
essage-ID: <DB051244848C46DB8D9003FBF15A8D47 at S0029439031>
ontent-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I'm sure I have an Aschenbrenner in my vintage ice axe collection, and I was
orn in 1955! If you're willing to carry the weight, your old friend will
ontinue to serve you well. It would not be my first choice from my
ollection to carry in the Sierra today or climb Mt Rainier, it would be my
nd or 3rd choice. If I had known it for 55yrs, it would be my only
hoice!! Times have changed, as has the equipment and technology, but the
eauty and spirit of a vintage wooden handled ice axe that has been carried
n the same hands for 55 years is a trusted friend and a personal treasure.
ttp://www.pbase.com/losthiker/image/91949361 a few
ttp://www.pbase.com/losthiker/image/91949365
I shared a few of my best vintage and modern ice axes with the group at the
LDHAwest gathering in fall 2009.
~^^~~^^~~
recall that there was recent posts on the subject of Iceaxes. I still
ave the iceaxe that I originally bought in 1955. It is an Aschenbrenner
nd was made in Austria. It weighs 2 1/2 pounds and its length comes up to
bout 6'' below my elbow when I am standing. It's axe head was heavy enough
o effectively cut steps when traversing an icy slope. And it was long
nough to add stability downslope. I only recall having to use it for
elf-arrest once. (Of course I never had the benefit of having taken Ned's
ourse - everyone who would go through the Sierra when there is snow and ice
hould take that course.) I did a lot of climbing and backpacking,
ncluding the JMT, in the Sierra during the 50's and 60's. I often carried
y iceaxe - used it not only on snow and ice but also as a walking stick for
dded stability pretty much as today's hikers use their hiking poles. I
an't remember when I first saw a hiker with hiking poles -
perhaps it was Reinhold or maybe Steeleye. To me, some of today's iceaxes
hat I see tied behind some hikers packs look rather short and probably too
ight to be effective for cutting steps in ice or icy snow. Just a few
houghts - - - .
endoRider
-----------------------------
Message: 8
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:49:30 -0700 (PDT)
rom: Scott Herriott <yetifan at yahoo.com>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] DriDucks rain gear too fragile?
o: Austin Williams <austinwilliams123 at gmail.com>, Dan Africk
<danstheman at gmail.com>
c: pct-l at backcountry.net
essage-ID: <334258.41528.qm at web113211.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Dan wrote:
<I'm a little concerned about the durability also, since I'm sometimes a bit
ough on my gear. I figure for the desert sections at th beginning, the
ight weight?is a good compromise for less durability.>
love my Dri-Ducks because they're so light. ?But whatever you do, don't sit
own on a rock with them...they will rip fairly easily. I learned that the hard
ay.
quatch
ww.walkpct.com
0% of DVD proceeds to the PCTA until April 16th
------------------------------
Message: 9
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 20:59:53 -0400
rom: Dan Africk <danstheman at gmail.com>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] DriDucks rain gear too fragile?
o: Scott Herriott <yetifan at yahoo.com>
c: pct-l at backcountry.net
essage-ID:
<1b15d4fc1003221759m4f26437eua93d8c9f5440c954 at mail.gmail.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Thanks for the tip, I've read that elsewhere too. For that reason I'm only
sing the dryducks jacket, and keeping my heavy(11oz), full-zip, Red Ledge
ain pants. These have taken a lot of abuse and it's great to be able to put
hem on and off without having to sit down or take off my shoes. I figure
he driducks jacket will stand a better chance if I make an effort to be
areful with it.
On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:49 PM, Scott Herriott <yetifan at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dan wrote:
<I'm a little concerned about the durability also, since I'm sometimes a
bit
rough on my gear. I figure for the desert sections at th beginning, the
light weight is a good compromise for less durability.>
I love my Dri-Ducks because they're so light. But whatever you do, don't
sit down on a rock with them...they will rip fairly easily. I learned that
the hard way.
-----------------------------
Message: 10
ate: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:15:14 -0700
rom: CHUCK CHELIN <steeleye at wildblue.net>
ubject: Re: [pct-l] A REAL iceaxe
o: Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>
c: pct-l at backcountry.net
essage-ID:
<db9154d1003221815q32e95294k921aca96c49c6b65 at mail.gmail.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Good evening, all,
In many years snowpack hiking I?ve arrested slides four times ? none of them
ere highly dangerous, none of them were performed with any of the ice axes
hat I?ve owned and practiced with, and all of them could have been easily
voided. Is this recommended practice? Not a chance: Do as I say, not as
do.
On a Washington PCT section hike in 2000 I wanted to descend a snow field to
xplore an attractive bowl. I didn?t have poles or an ice axe with me, but
he sun had been on the snowpack and the traction was good for my sneakers.
nfortunately, about 2/3 the way down I passed into the shade of a ridge
nto snowpack that had not yet been touched by the sun. It was far too
lick to continue further unassisted. As I rested for a moment near a small
alus outcropping I had to decide to: 1) go back up the steep slope, which
eemed a lot of work for someone as lazy as I; 2) continue around the bowl
n-grade just above the shade line, which was quite a long route; or, 3)
ind some way to continue down.
>From the outcropping I managed to loosen a piece of talus about a foot long,
arrow, relatively thin, and shaped like an arrowhead. By holding one hand
n the center and the other hand over the wide top end I could slide on my
ide and drag the point in the crust. It was much like an ice axe without a
haft. I practiced on a short, safe pitch and when I found the process
atisfactory I gently slid all the remaining distance to the rocks below.
In ?07 on the north side of Mather Pass I wanted to cross a big patch of ice
nd snowpack covering a flat, sloping rock face. I could have worked around
t, but across was convenient. I had no ice axe, but three times in about
s many minutes my feet went out from under me and I slid until I could do a
wo-handed grab near the tip of one pole to arrest the slide. I don?t use
rist straps so I could quickly sift my grip. I don?t know how I managed to
eep control of the other pole.
ttp://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?id=188368
Steel-Eye
Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT ? 1965
http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
ttp://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09
On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 1:52 PM, Edward Anderson <mendoridered at yahoo.com>wrote:
> I recall that there was recent posts on the subject of Iceaxes. I still
have the iceaxe that I originally bought in 1955. It is an Aschenbrenner
and was made in Austria. It weighs 2 1/2 pounds and its length comes up
to about 6'' below my elbow when I am standing. It's axe head was heavy
enough to effectively cut steps when traversing an icy slope. And it was
long enough to add stability downslope. I only recall having to use it for
self-arrest once. (Of course I never had the benefit of having taken Ned's
course - everyone who would go through the Sierra when there is snow and ice
should take that course.) I did a lot of climbing and backpacking,
including the JMT, in the Sierra during the 50's and 60's. I often carried
my iceaxe - used it not only on snow and ice but also as a walking stick for
added stability pretty much as today's hikers use thier hiking poles. I
can't remember when I first saw a hiker with hiking poles -
perhaps it was Reinhold or maybe Steeleye. To me, some of today's iceaxes
that I see tied behind some hikers packs look rather short and probably
too light to be effective for cutting steps in ice or icy snow. Just a few
thoughts - - - .
MendoRider
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