[pct-l] Fw: Stove Fires (addendum: shipping and hazmat)

[Paul Robison]

at UPS we were told that our strict regulations were in place in order to 'match 
regulations' put on the USPS....
perhaps this was rumour.  i suppose i can ask next time i'm mailing boxes,  but 
i doubt anyone behind the counter will know all that well.

btw,  for a long while (i don't know about now),  the 4 ounces containers were 
not hazmat, but the 8 ounce ones were.  not sure what other people buy i only 
ever bought the 8's.


now the real question,   how could you ever get caught? assuming this is 
domestic...  see if it is labelled hazmat, then we randomly open and check 
them.  but if you don't declare it, it's not like people open the boxes to see 
if you broke the law.  and it's not like the containers have changed in such a 
way that they didn't pose a hazard before, but they do now.




________________________________
From: Ken Powers <ken at gottawalk.com>
To: PCT-L <pct-l at backcountry.net>
Sent: Sun, December 12, 2010 8:11:57 PM
Subject: [pct-l] Fw:  Stove Fires

I sent this to Paul. I should have sent it to the mailing list.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: Ken Powers 
To: Paul Robison 
Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2010 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove Fires


That is true for UPS and FedEx and commercial shippers at USPS, but not true for 
USPS consumer commodities. The postal regulations had not been changed when I 
looked a couple months ago. I tried to get a postal employee to check to see if 
USPS consumer commodities were subject to the new DOT regulations and got 
nowhere. So I only have their web published regulations to go by. Those 
regulations have not changed and that is what our postal employees look at when 
we mail fuels.

Ken
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Paul Robison 
  To: Ken Powers 
  Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net 
  Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2010 8:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove Fires


  Ken,

  this information is out of date.

  there are new requirements from 2010 hat put canisters in the hazmat qual. not 
an ORMD any longer.
  for ups this gives them a 38$ minnimum surcharge. not sure about other 
carriers.  also means they can no longer go 'priority' class, though i believe 
first class is still an option.

  ~Paul 
  (i'm a former hazmat auditor for UPS)



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Ken Powers <ken at gottawalk.com>
  To: robert at engravingpros.com; pct-l at backcountry.net
  Sent: Fri, December 10, 2010 4:03:23 PM
  Subject: Re: [pct-l] Stove Fires

  Actually Esbit tablets, alcohol, and propane/isobutane canisters have the 
  same mailing requirements. All must be labeled as "Consumer Commodity - 
  ORM-D"  and must be shipped "Surface Mail Only".

  http://www.gottawalk.com/shipping_fuel.htm

  Ken

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Robert W. Freed" <robert at engravingpros.com>
  To: <pct-l at backcountry.net>
  Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 12:19 PM
  Subject: [pct-l] Stove Fires


  Pepsi can alcohol stoves are light weight and hot. A strong wind can blow 
  them around spraying pressurized fuel as it goes. Also, since they 
  pressurize by heating the entire stove they are not easy to stop with your 
  hands. Plus there is no way to turn them off. This scenario has led to at 
  least two forest fires that I have heard of.
  I use esbit. A half tab will boil a cup of water in about 7 minutes. They 
  are easy to blow out and easy to carry. Plus mailing them in your drop box 
  is easy. (Legal?)
  Robert
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