[pct-l] Cooking Within concerns

Tue Dec 8 13:51:06 CST 2009

I typically use a Snow Peak Titanium Stove with igniter.  If there's a need
for me to cook in my shelter (rain, snow, whatever) I get in my shelter &
get all my stuff ready (water in the pot, packets opened, silverware &
seasonings out, etc).  Then I light my stove just outside my tarp shelter
while just inside the doorway...if something goes wrong (nothing EVER has
with my stove), the fire is OUTSIDE, and I can be too in a second.  If it
lights fine & everything is A-OK, I bring my LIT stove inside & cook in the
doorway.  Plenty of air and I still get to feel the heat of the flame...and
again, if anything goes wrong, the stove isn't inside a zipped tent or even
on a flammable surface.

The reason I get everything ready 1st, is that IME, if I light the stove 1st
& get the water boiling, all too often, in the opening & closing of my pack
& packages and whatever, it's WAY too easy to knock-over a Qt of boiling
water or even get something too close to the stove without even noticing.

That's just how I do things.

Josh

-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net]
On Behalf Of ned at pacificcrestcustombuilders.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 11:42 AM
To: CHUCK CHELIN; Gary Schenk
Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net
Subject: Re: [pct-l] Cooking Within concerns

OK, let's review the concerns, here.

Carbon Monoxide
Flare Ups
Lack of attention to stove

Regarding CO, open the doors and windows or cook in your vestibule. Solves
the problem of trapped CO in the tent, thus insufficient oxygen and
subsequent fears of death.

Flare ups with the Svea were common, but with practice and attention, with
fingers on the control valve and awareness of exactly how much fuel was
trickling into the "Spirit Cup," the possibility was minimized.
Occasionally, if the fuel poured out too fast and I didn't shut it down
right away, the spirit cup would fill and run out over the tank. All I had
to do, upon paying attention to this, was to move the stove to the center of
the tent, where the ceiling was 4 or 5 feet tall, before lighting the Cup
and beginning the priming. If the flames were high, I blocked them with my
pot lid for the brief time it did so. No danger of tent melt-down, ever.

The new Jet Boils never have this problem as they are not white gas and do
not need priming. Alcohol stoves, however, do have fuel spill dangers and
have started fires, some of just the picnic table where they sat (photo if
you want it) and others of the entire Forest. Alcohol stoves are highly
dangerous in this regard and should never be used in, on, or near any
flammable surface. This is an area there gram-counting can kill you and
others.

If you start your stove and don't pay attention to what may catch on fire
around it, you are a danger to yourself and others. Learn how to use your
stove, how to control it, how it works, at home and in the field before you
rely on it for all your hot meals. Primarily, you need to know how to
regulate the flame. If it goes south, you need to be able to shut it down,
now. 

Mtnned
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: CHUCK CHELIN
  To: Gary Schenk
  Cc: pct-l at backcountry.net ; ned at pacificcrestcustombuilders.com
  Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 8:09 AM
  Subject: Re: [pct-l] Cooking Within (addendum)

  Good morning, Gary,

  Years ago when I was young, wild, and ignorant I had a significant love
affair with a little Swedish beauty by the name of Svea 123.  She seduced me
away from my previous love-also a Swede - by the name of Trangia.  While
Trangia was small, quiet, and unassuming, Svea was taller, more
sophisticated, and overall much more impressive.  Unfortunately she was also
much more difficult to turn on, and she was loud, but when she finally did
get started she was HOT! She provided me with the two best moments of the
day:  When she actually turned on and put out the heat, and when I was
finished with her and she finally shut-up.

  Why had I made the change?  At the time I was impressed with
sophistication:  Anything with more parts and processes had to be better -
an affliction common to many mechanical engineers who prefer twenty
complicated parts when one simple one will do equally as well.  Svea had
lots of things to fiddle with, and I could even add things like a mini-pump
to avoid having to bring that ice-cold piece of brass into my sleeping bag
in the morning and hold it in my warm crotch for ten minutes to warm it
enough to create some internal pressure in the tank; my hands being too cold
to effectively do the warming.

  Next came a really good reason why Svea should never be lit inside a tent:
With a bit of pressure in the tank the valve was opened slightly, and kept
open just long enough to pressure-dribble raw fuel down the generator stem
and into the little dam around the top of the tank.  When lit, the raw fuel
in the dam would then flame up and heat the burner plate sufficient to
vaporize fuel that was eventually to squirt out of the generator.  If the
valve was subsequently opened to soon - before the vaporizer plate became
sufficiently hot - there would be a really big raw fuel flame-up with the
possibility of burning fuel running out of the dam and down the sides of the
stove.

  This process was really great for hikers who have trouble waking up and
getting started in the morning, being better than a double-tall espresso for
jump-starting the day.

  Steel-Eye
  Hiking the Pct since before it was the PCT - 1965
  http://www.trailjournals.com/steel-eye
  http://www.trailjournals.com/SteelEye09

  On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 6:46 PM, Gary Schenk <gwschenk at socal.rr.com> wrote:

    On Sunday 06 December 2009 19:35:18 ned at pacificcrestcustombuilders.com
wrote:
    > Please keep in mind regarding this article that the kind of stoves we
use
    > are the commercial variety white gas (Svea, MSR, etc.) or canister
    > (Jetboil, Bluet...) stoves with good bases for predictable stability
and
    > valves for flame control. We consider the use of alcohol stoves
dangerous
    > for self and environment and not worth the weight savings in the long
run.
    > Those who practice with them may have good fortune, but for the novice
we
    > do not encourage their use.

    You light a Svea inside your tent?!?!? They don't call those things
Swedish
    hand grenades for nothing, you know.

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