[pct-l] dogs/pets

Mon Dec 7 00:59:07 CST 2009

Hey Cruz,

What rescue organization do you belong too? I have yet to see an ACD on a rescue team even though I hear of them being on wilderness rescue efforts all the time.

This is probably a good time for me to advocate my strong opinion on keeping the dog on a lead. While on trail, my dog is always on lead with the single exception of deep/fast stream crossings where it would be dangerous for him and myself. I adamantly feel this is important for several reasons:

1. The 6' lead is the law in National Forests, designated wildernesses and state parks where the vast majority of the PCT lies.
2. Hikers should always have the right of way on trails and in no way should my dog impede or take away from their experience. Not everyone wants to interact with your dog, respect that.
3. Even the best trained dog is just that, a trained animal. Never rely on past experience as a guarantee that your dog will not react negatively to another person. The right of the person overrides any rights you may believe your dog has, which I contend are close to zero.
4. Loose dogs chase animals, period. Recalling your dog from a chase still means that a chase took place. Yes, dogs can be taught to not chase animals that it encounters frequently but there will always be something unexpected at some point.
5. A dog not on a lead is a dog far more likely to have a bad rattlesnake encounter.
6. As we all know, long distant hiking is about calories. A dog off lead is burning a lot more calories and a dog should never go calorie deficient like we do. On our hikes, my 60lb dog consistently eats more calories per day than I do.
7. If the dog is off lead, how do you know where they crap? You are responsible for burying your animals waste just as would your own.

I have built a set of leads out of 3mm climber cord that connect to 4 points of my Osprey Atmos' internal frame. I use an ultra-light climber carabineer to clip a 6' lead to top the dog's harness. This keeps him from ever pulling against my kidneys, which can happen if he were connected to my hip belt while giving me a hands free lead.

Cruz, I understand in your case, the rescue dog has to operate off lead to perform his task. I am venting here because of all the off-lead dogs we run across while hiking that endanger other hikers, the environment and the dogs themselves.

BigToe

-----Original Message-----
From: leestcoast at gmail.com [mailto:leestcoast at gmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:58 PM
To: David Ellzey
Subject: Re: [pct-l] dogs/pets

Australian Cattle Dogs (or Queensland Healers) are a great choice - mine is a cattle dog/germ shepard mix rescue dog - good endurance way smart protective etc. They do need a lot of exercise and hopefully a real job to do (like moving a herd- if not that, keeping your hiking party together or leading you out on the trail.               Cruz Control
Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone, powered by CREDO Mobile.

-----Original Message-----
From: David Ellzey <david at xpletive.com>
Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 21:47:39 
To: PCT Email List PCT List<pct-l at backcountry.net>
Subject: Re: [pct-l] dogs/pets

Despite my trepidation that this will ignite into the yearly anti-dog thread, one option for you to consider is to get a dog that is well suited to hiking and take it with you everywhere outside of the National Parks.

I am in a more unique situation in that I am losing my hearing rapidly due to a hereditary disorder. The doctor recommended that I go with either a pair of ($12k for the set) fragile hearing assistance devices or a hearing assistance dog. I will likely do both but for now I can get by with just the dog. After consulting a couple of service dog agencies, we decided to raise and train the dog ourselves as the agencies could not guarantee to meet our requirements for the animal to meet our active lifestyle.

We got a lot of good information from the agencies and proceeded to do months of research. In the end we decided on a Australian Cattle Dog but is was not the only good option. Our choices came down to 4 possible breeds for long trail hiking:

Karelian Bear Dog
Australian Cattle Dog
Australian Kelpie
Border Collie

All these breeds are smart, agile, have great endurance and durability. In my research it seemed that the Border Collie tended to be the smartest and most agile while the other 3 were better endurance animals. But the ACD was by a good measure the most durable and so was the breed we finally went with.

You will need to select the animal as if it were destined for mountain rescue work. That means you go to a breeder, not a rescue facility as I would normally advise someone looking for a pet. Plan to spend a lot of time "interviewing" candidate puppies as for their potential and be mentally prepared to wait for the next litter or check out another breeder. This is not a time to settle for what's available as it's a very long commitment. Look for a puppy who likes to solve simple problems, who can be independent but is not aloof and is probably a sub-alpha dog. Essentially you are looking for a dog that will be incredible driven to perform. Of course you are also going to have to commit to an serious amount of training to keep that personality from being a problem too.

His first year was all about getting him new experiences, different types of trails, snow/ice, city environs and the like. I'll never forget our first foray into a Wal-Mart, poor guy. Because of the puppy, we were able to do much hiking that summer with our longest hike being a 15 mile weekend in the mountains.

2009 was his second year and he did 600 miles of PCT, which was about all we could take time off for. He did amazingly well, especially as he is still considered a puppy despite the fact he is fully grown. By the end of the summer he did a 10 day/160 mile hike through the Sierras starting out with an 8 pound pack. In that cool mountain air he easily out performed my wife and I.

Currently he does between 15 to 60 miles out walking a week plus afternoon Frisbee 3 to 4 times a week. We will likely only get a few hundred miles next summer but he will carry up to 10 pound packs.

It is our tentative plan to do thru to PCT in 2011, if so he will do it with us and I am pretty sure we are much more likely to have problems that he would.

I hope I have been helpful,
BigToe

-----Original Message-----
From: pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net [mailto:pct-l-bounces at backcountry.net] On Behalf Of sandy boyd
Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 6:51 PM
To: pct-l at backcountry.net
Subject: [pct-l] dogs/pets

Im sitting here between knee surgeries really wanting to get a dog again. I recently (march) lost my dog of 12 years. Ive section hiked over 500 miles of the PCT the last 2 years. Id always felt bad leaving my dog behind before, but believe for me, I dont want to take a dog on an extended hike on the PCT. But, I REALLY miss my dog.
  So... how do you guys deal with leaving your pets behind?? Is it right to get another dog knowing Im gonna be gone a month or more the next 2 summers? Who do you find to watch them/it? My son will be moved out by next summer, so wont have him to dog sit again.
Im considering fostering a dog....wont be the same.. but..maybe it will suffice???

I just want to do the right thing..just my thoughts on a cold windy sunday..

sandy  aka 50 feet..

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